Walthers Heavyweights - Troubles with Turnouts & Curves...

[KB0QQW]

Hi All,

Just curious, what sort of experience(s) is everyone having with the current run of Walthers Heavyweights? 

I have a set of Santa Fe HWs as well as a set of UP Gray HWs.  Both seem to suffer from similar issues...

1. Taking the Diverging Route on turnouts, the cars seem to jump the track (either "picking the frog" or just the truck not swiveling enough).  It doesn't seem to matter the size of the turn out nor if it is a mass-produced turnout or a hand-laid.

2. On Curves - it seems that the design of the underbody severly restrict the minimum radius to somewhere between 30" & 34".

Did I just get a whole batch of bad cars or is this something that is common?  Any suggested fixes?

Thanks,
Chris

[twhite]

KB--

The Walther's heavyweights are designed for a minimum 24" radius, but seem to work much better on 30" or above.  What you might try is loosening the truck screws a little--they seem to come pretty tight from the factory.  Also check your wheels with a wheel-gauge.  I've heard some complaints that the wheels are not always in gauge.  I understand that they are easy to re-gauge with a little pressure.  I've had some trouble with a few of my heavyweights, and one of the problems has turned out to be the tops of the screws that hold the trucks together, rubbing along the underframe and catching.  A couple of swipes with a file on the screw-tops has generally fixed this problem.  Also, lubricating the trucks as per suggestions in the manual really helps their rolling characteristics. 

They're good cars, but they can be a little tricky at first.  Hope this helps. 

Tom

[steemtrayn]

Some of my full-length passenger cars derail upon entering and leaving 26inch radius curves. attaching a thin sheet of styrene over the diaphragm striker plates cures this .

[Heartland Division CB&Q]

Suggest holding car upside down. Then see how trucks pivot. Sometimes they will strike against the center sill on tight curves. You may trim back the center sill if that's the case. Nobody will see the trimmed sill when the car is back on the tracks.

[KB0QQW]

Hi Tom,

 I generally check all of these items before I run any car.  It seems like the sides of the trucks are hitting the back of the coupler box which is limited the swing of the trucks.  I think I am going to try to put a fiber washer under the trucks to see if that will help a bit.  Sure that means going to an overset coupler but if I can get these to run, it'll look great on the club layout.

I'll go thru them again to see if there is something I missed as well.  Thanks for the ideas.

Chris

[bogp40]

Along with all the great replies about most of the potential problems with these cars is also inspect the truck itseff for any twist. A couple of my heavyweights would randomly derail at turnouts and all the mentioned items seemed to check out. Upon closer inspection, I found that the truck side frames where screwed to the "bolster" mounting plate had the screws slightly crooked causing a twist wracking the axle plane. Retightening and some flexing of the sideframes remedied the problem. Inspecting all other 10 cars showed similar twisting of the trucks, but not as severe to cause the derailments. Each and every car seemed to have the truck/ bolster screw far to tight also and wouldn't allow the (front to back) swivel in the truck. Side play is controlled by the screws contacting/ riding the metal electrical PU on the floor. Tom mentioned filing the screws to eliminate any snags. Minor filing can also control any out of level of the truck. Some have had troubles with the contact strips not seated problerly causing the troules also.

The Walther's heavyweights are very nice cars but these issues as well as the terrible roof latching system are my only beefs.

[cacole]

Two members of our local HO scale club have exactly the same problems with them.  Longer shank couplers had to be installed on one end of each car in order to get them to negotiate a 24 inch radius, and some of the coupler pocket had to be cut away. The only thing that has not been tried yet is removing the center axle from each truck.

 

[wedudler]

I did run into problems at my branch line (24'' ) too.

I've reworked them a little bit, now they take this curve. I've cut at the beams. 

 

 

Wolfgang 

[johncolley]

The bigger question is do you have proper easements into and out of your curves? If not it is more likeley that end lurch is the culprit. take the time to evaluate the trackwork before mesing with the cars. Take your time and try one thing at a time with at least two cars, then run them both ways and both ends forward thru the trouble areas. It is a process of elimination, and you may indeed have to do several things to get them to run right. Another thing I found is some brands are much lighter than NMRA weight specs so get them all up to standard first, and replace all plastic wheels with metal ones. jc5729 John Colley, Port Townsend, WA

[jecorbett]

I have had the same problems with two of my Walthers heavyweights. Crossovers and a curved turnout (also Walthers) cause the main problem. The curved turnout is a #8 which equates to 32/36" radius. Both of these items are what I consider to be higher end items so this is particularly aggravating. When a Walthers car cannot negotiate a Walthers turnout, something is wrong.

[Don Gibson]

1. Taking the Diverging Route on turnouts, the cars seem to jump the track (either "picking the frog" or just the truck not swiveling enough).  It doesn't seem to matter the size of the turn out nor if it is a mass-produced turnout or a hand-laid.  

These cars were DESIGNED for 24"r. but low wage assemblers may not be doing everything right. Underbody detail (and truck screws) have to be 'just so'.

REMEMBER 24"r. is a (quote) "minimum" - which should include #6's - and I have TWO  recent (2 months) ATSF cars taking my Shinohara 26" r. and #6  Xovers without easements. 

You also may find a COMBINATION of #5 & #46 Kadees (one on each end) solves your problem. I like that combined spacing, both in looks and operation. I use the shorter coupler on the rear.

After that, my 90o ATLAS 'Superflex' 26"r. was the only thing derailing. (It was so flexible that mini-small radii formed). CLUBS often buy the cheapest track available to save $$.

What I am saying is check the bottom of the car first. Those truck screws ride on press-fit metal tabs . on 24" r. EVERYTHING has to be right. Lastly, check the gauge of the trackwork. Don't ASSUME anything.

 

[csmith9474]

I only have one of the Walther's heavywight cars, and I seem to recall seeing something in the instructions about trimming up the center sill so they will negotiate tighter radii (I realize some have already mentioned trimming the center sill).

[lvanhen]

Buy Rapidos!!  That off my chest, I have a dozed Walthers HW's & streamliners.  The first one of each I picked uo at my LHS, and they ran fine on my 22" radius (I have a 4x8 - and NO I can't expand it - moving later this year hopefully!)  Well, niether box said anything about min radius, so I plopped them down & ran them.  A few weeks later, Walthers ran a sale on a number of HW's & streamliners so I ordered ten of them.  Oh the horrors!!!   None of them would do the 22" radius!!  I'm still putzing arouind with them - cut the center sill, part of the trucks, and still no go! I'm not talking about in a consist - just trying to push one around into the outside loop!!  Well, the new home will have a train room, and 30" or 36" will be the min radius!! 

P.S.  The Rapidos do the 22" radius without changing to the long shank couplers  

[Texas Zepher]

Buy Rapidos!!

I wasn't aware they built any heavyweight cars.

I have a dozed Walthers HW's & streamliners.  The first one of each I picked uo at my LHS, and they ran fine on my 22" radius. ...  Well, niether box said anything about min radius.

That is probably why they ran fine.

Walthers ran a sale on a number of HW's ... so I ordered ten of them.  Oh the horrors!!!   None of them would do the 22" radius!!

No surprise there.  They are designed for a minimum radius is 24" and even then the directions say to get get that tight the center sill must be cut.

I cannot find a single Walthers heavyweight car in my collection (about 40) that do not have the following printed on the box.
 

I have not noticed the turnout picking problem, but I don't have enough running time on them yet.   So I'll watch for it and see if I can determine the root-cause.

[twhite]

Hi Tom,

 I generally check all of these items before I run any car.  It seems like the sides of the trucks are hitting the back of the coupler box which is limited the swing of the trucks.  I think I am going to try to put a fiber washer under the trucks to see if that will help a bit.  Sure that means going to an overset coupler but if I can get these to run, it'll look great on the club layout.

I'll go thru them again to see if there is something I missed as well.  Thanks for the ideas.

Chris

Chris--

One other thing I should have mentioned, and the other posters have, but let me re-iterate their suggestion:  REPLACE THOSE GAWD-AWFUL WALTHERS COUPLERS WITH KADEES! 

One of the intitial problems I had with the Walthers heavyweights were those saggy, terrible couplers.  They droop, hardly ever couple evenly, the pins will catch on turnout frogs, and if you're running more than four or five, the sheer weight of the cars will cause those plastic knuckles to just give out, breaking your train up.  The Kadee's are a simple drop-in, and the spring keeps them even, and the pins will float over your frogs without catching. 

Why Walthers insists on installing these cheap nylon knuckle-couplers on a model that usually runs about $40 is beyond me.  They're absolutely WORTHLESS, IMO! 

Tom