Awesome scene Ed, thanks for the photos! I know what you mean about the Walthers Everett Street Station. I had purchased and eventually stopped work on four other stations because they just didn't "feel" right for the location. I found the Milwaukee station kit on ebay some years back and paid waaaay too much for it, but its exactly what I wanted!
Hi, Jeff
Here's a look at my present Union Station:
IMG_8624_fix by Edmund, on Flickr
I used a Faller kit for the "Head House" and my track arrangement seems to be similar to those photos above.
Union Station by Edmund, on Flickr
Walthers is planning to relase another run of the Milwaukee station later this month and I plan to get one to replace my present building. Simply because I'm enamored with the huge, brick structure.
I'll probably keep the existing T shaped platform sheds and concourse.
I used Shinohara curved turnouts at the "throat" of the station tracks. I'll see if I can find a photo of that area.
Good Luck, Ed
WOW! That shed is enormous. I have one thats only 1 1/2 kits long and I know how much space that takes up. I'd love to see any more recent pix you have, most especially details of the curved track area at the "top" of these pix, as the track curves away to the left. Any info on which turnouts and track you guys used would be a great help.
Here are the pictures I promised. I appologize for the cluttered background.
My grand son calls the depot "city hall"so I guess that it would work. I thought about the train shed after I made my last post and remembered that I used 4 kits not 8. I was thinking of the kits 2 sections of roof. Anyway I corrected my post. There is now someone that has produced a proper kit for the depot building. I am thinking about getting it. All that work done by Mike bilding the Walthers kit and now it's obsolete. If I do get the new kit I'll keep on with the work of doing Milwaukee while the new kit is built. I did the post office by taking the Walthers post office kit and reducing it to a 2 story and making the length twice as long. Not perfect but it looks all right. The REA building I'm scratch building out of PVC sheet. Much easyer to work with and very much cheaper. A 4x8 sheet costs about $35. I have also built 40 baggage wagons. These are Bar Mills kits. The post office was actually owened buy the railroad and used for handling the mail.
Paul
Hey y'all. I am Paul's friend Gary. We have been working on Paul's layout for the better part of three months specfically on "Milwuakee", if I remember correctly because I don't reemember when we started. Our buddy Mike is the building "purter togetherer and painterer". Mike and I are native Texans and Paul is our token Yankee. Seriously, he is from Milwaukee and Mike and I have learned a lot from him about the Everett Street Depot and area.
I will get some pictures up later.
I have not taken time to read every post in this thread but Paul did tell me that y'all were talking about lighting for the train shed. Mike did some eBay research and came up with a gentlemen that goes by "wehonest-cn". He has all manner of HO scale stuff including scale hanging lighting. The lights are a good representation of the old "service station" lights that, as best we can tell, are what they used in the train shed. The bulbs are surface mount LEDs. Our plan is to duplicate, as closely as we can, the lighting in the train shed. From what we can determine, they used something called knob and tube wiring and the hoods are suspended from a pipe. In one of the books that Paul has it appears that the lighting had one fixture on a beam then three lights on the next beam, then one light and then three lights on the following beam and so forth and so on, get the idea? The very first beam does not have a light fixture. We are going to hang 44 of these lights.
Oh yea, one great thing about this project is that I have learned how to spell Milwaukee.
Let me get to work on the pictures I am going to upload.
Gary CEO ASGW Railways
Yes, no train shed for the 'new' (1923) SPUD.
Ever since the Walthers kit came out, I've thought it would be a very good starting point modelling a well known a building in Minneapolis - not the Milwaukee Road depot, but the Minneapolis City Hall a few blocks away.
http://www.lakesnwoods.com/images/1960s.74.jpg
https://www.walthers.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/422x300/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/c/o/cornerstone_seriesr_hiawatha_accessory_structures_933-2943.gif
My friends and I have built the train shed. It is 4 kits long, a little over 7ft. The shed built that way is a bit too long but not enough to worry about. It really looks impresive. I'll see if I can get my friend Gary to post photos. The book The Milwaukee Road in color Vol 2 The City of Milwaukee is full of photos of the Evert st. depot. ( yes it wqas on Evert st not Saint Paul). I was born and raised in Milwaukee and spent alot of time at the depot and the CNW depot. The Evert st. depot burned in 65 or 66 and was torn down. The CNW depot a year or as later. The book I mentioned is the best sorce of information but do a computer search.
I don't think the SPUD had a train shed....just the overhead concourse and the platforms at the bottom.
I am very lucky to have a model of the SPUD, even if it's only 4 tracks, and a shorter overhead building...but the main entrance is the coolest part about the depot.
Phil
snagletooth wrote:Could the sheds and other associated buildings be used for any other place on the MILWK? I'm mainly thinking St. Paul, but anywhere on the system. IIRC the Depot itself was one of a kind, just wondering about the other buildings.
The Minneapolis Milwaukee Road Depot has a very similar train shed:http://www.dcd.com/images/peter1.jpgI'm not sure what the St. Paul Union Depot train sheds looked like, but the concourse was famous.
Gary
Roberto, Thanks for the info. I am about to post something about how my work is going so far. I have reached out to the Milwaukee Road Historical Association, and they have been able to offer up some more photos.
Here is what I have learned. One the station was remodeled in the 20's and again in the 40's. Almost NO PHOTOS of the inside of the building are around pre 20's ... I have found a photo of the main hall, and the 2 waiting rooms and blueprint of the ground floor.
Here is part one of my post: http://cs.trains.com/forums/1428388/ShowPost.aspx
Hey everyone, don't let the nick fool you. My interests lie in the Milwaukee Road.
Since I have so many hobbies, I don't generally spend lots of time doing research, but I have been known to buy a book or two on the subject of railroading and the Milwaukee Road. The first thing I look for in any book I buy is photos of this marvelous structure.
The Everett street station has always captured my interest because of its grandeur and uniqueness. Interestingly enough the prototypes track arrangement lends it's self to fitting at the end of a room because of the curved approaches into the train shed.
If you want some good pictures of this amazing landmark, I would suggest picking up a copy of MILWAUKEE ROAD IN IT'S HOME TOWN. It's written by Jim Scribbens, and published by Kalmbach books. I'm sure this comes as no surprise to you. On page thirteen in particular you will find a spectacular overhead view looking East toward Lake Michigan. In this view you can clearly see the REA and the track arrangement. There are indeed five tracks under the shed, and three more that parallel south of the structure. The photograph was taken in November of 1935.
There are also great ground level photos taken of the business side of the depot from both the East and West approaches. Page 16 and 17 have 2 more pictures looking North West with good views of the mail handling building and Milwaukee Electric's Public Service Building.
Another resource that I don't recall anyone mentioning is the Milwaukee Road Historical Association. I would drop them a line and see where that gets you.
Best regards and good luck'
Roberto
As I've understood it the sheds are rather generic. They will also be sold after the Limited run station is gone and are suppose to be a part of Walthers general stock.
Magnus
Now that was good info! I'm going to use it, you can trust me on that. I'll might change some stuff but that info was excellent.
One interesting thing was that the sheds where "only" 600 ft long. That would make them almost 7 feet in HO or just about fours sheds long. That would mean I actually ordered the correct amount!
Lets keep digging in this.
I did some more reserch and here is what I have for you all so far... From the book "BUILDINGS AND STRUCTURES OF AMERICAN RAILROADS. A REFERENCE BOOK FOR RAILROAD MANAGERS, SUPERINTENDENTS, MASTER MECHANICS, ENGINEERS, ARCHITECTS, AND STUDENTS."
DO NOT WORRY IT IS PUBLIC DOMAIN Published in 1893. You can download a copy of this book (legal and free) from the Google Lib here (get it, it has tons of pics in it) PAGE 372-373
Terminal Passenger Depot at Milwaukee, Wis., Chicago, Milwaukee d f S/. Paul Railway.— The \y Passenger depot of the Chicago, Milwaukee & St. Paul Railway at Milwaukee, Wis., plans for which were Published in the issue of the Railway Review of Dec. 25, 1886, and in the issue of the Scientific American (Architects and Builders' Edition) of March, 1887, is a large terminal side-station, described as follows in the publications mentioned: The new passenger station of the Chicago, Milwaukee & St. Paul Railway at Milwaukee is situated between Third and Fourth Streets, one and one-half blocks from Grand Avenue, and fronts on a park on Everett Street. The ground-plan of the building shows a surface of 120 x 65 ft. There are three floors— the first 16 ft. in the clear and the other two 14 ft. each. In the centre of the facade rises a tower to the height of 160 ft., reminding one in its graceful lines of some Venetian campanile, and dominating the landscape in every direction. The style of the structure is modern Gothic. The foundations are solid and enduring, being constructed of stone, with granite facings above grade. The material used in the construction of the walls is Milwaukee brick, faced with pressed Philadelphia red brick. The trimmings are of red sandstone and terra-cotta in handsome patterns. The main entrance of the building is formed of a triple arch, supported by columns of polished granite. It is reached by a flight of six easy steps. The swinging-doors of polished oak are a few feet 1ns1de the arch, being surmounted by stained-glass windows in beautiful designs. These admit the visitor into the large central hall which bisects the building. This is 30 x 65 ft. The floor is of tile, in a well-defined pattern, and soft, pleasing colors. The walls are of red brick up to the spring of the arch. From there on they are in a soft, creamy brick. The lower portion of the wall is marked with geometrical patterns in d1fferent- colored brick, while the creamy surface above is picked out here and there with a dash of dark color. Around the rear of the hall runs a gallery, which serves to give the light and lightness needed to the whole. This gallery is surrounded by a railing in hammered dull brass. On the right of the main entrance is the ladies' waiting-room, an apartment of handsome proportions, 30 x 84 ft., with tile floor, and finished in oak in natural color. To the rear of the apartment are well- appointed toilet-rooms. On the same side of the hall, and occupying the south side of the building, is the gentlemen's waiting-room, of the same size as the other room, less a slight abridgment in length. Between the two is a bijou ticket-office with three ticket-windows, one to the hall and one to each waiting-room. All these rooms, as well, in (act, as all the rooms down-stairs, with one exception, are finished in a similar manner to the ladies' room, and have tiled floors. The ceiling on this floor throughout is ribbed by heavy beams, whose possible heaviness is relieved by tinting in light color approaching a soft shade of Nile green. On the left of the entrance is the dining-room of the hotel connected with the depot, a room 40 x 52 ft., finished as the other rooms, but with a wood floor. The lunch room, on the same side, is 16x 52 ft. in size, and is furnished with folding-stools for the benefit of its patrons. Between the two rooms is the telegraph- office and the parcel counter. To the right and rear of the hall an alcove gives room for a handsome oak stairway that leads to the second floor. This, in the west end of the building, is occupied by the train-despatchers of the different divisions, and it is safe to say that never before did train-despatchers have more comfortable or beautiful quarters. The most of the offices look directly out on the park. The east end of the building is occupied, with the exception of one room, for hotel purposes. Descending to the first floor, in the extreme west end of the building, is found the baggage-room, an apartment 52 x 56 ft. in its floor dimensions. Immediately above it and reached by a water-elevator is a room of similar size for the purpose of storing baggage not called for immediately. In the east end of the building is the emigrant room, of size the same as the baggage-room, with heavily timbered ceiling and tiled floor. This room and the one above it, also intended for the same purpose, are well appointed for their special object. The building is lighted throughout by electricity and heated by steam, both being furnished by boilers and engine located in the east end of the basement. Outside are large car-sheds, 600 ft. in length and 100 in width, supported by iron columns and girders, and roofed with corrugated iron. They cover five tracks, on which the highest skill of the road-masters' art has been displayed. There is placed in the tower, at a height that will make it easily seen from a good part of the city, a big clock, the dials of which will at night be illuminated by electricity. The clock is one of the finest as well as the largest in the country. It has four dials. Those on the north and south sides arc II ft. in diameter, and those on the east and west are 9 ft. Each of these dials is composed of six sections of the finest ground glass, so joined together as to appear one solid piece. The pendulum of this mammoth clock is 14 ft. in length, and weighs 400 Ibs. It is regulated for heat and cold. The cost complete is $500,000.
Terminal Passenger Depot at Milwaukee, Wis., Chicago, Milwaukee d f S/. Paul Railway.— The \y Passenger depot of the Chicago, Milwaukee & St. Paul Railway at Milwaukee, Wis., plans for which were Published in the issue of the Railway Review of Dec. 25, 1886, and in the issue of the Scientific American (Architects and Builders' Edition) of March, 1887, is a large terminal side-station, described as follows in the publications mentioned:
The new passenger station of the Chicago, Milwaukee & St. Paul Railway at Milwaukee is situated between Third and Fourth Streets, one and one-half blocks from Grand Avenue, and fronts on a park on Everett Street. The ground-plan of the building shows a surface of 120 x 65 ft.
There are three floors— the first 16 ft. in the clear and the other two 14 ft. each. In the centre of the facade rises a tower to the height of 160 ft., reminding one in its graceful lines of some Venetian campanile, and dominating the landscape in every direction. The style of the structure is modern Gothic. The foundations are solid and enduring, being constructed of stone, with granite facings above grade. The material used in the construction of the walls is Milwaukee brick, faced with pressed Philadelphia red brick. The trimmings are of red sandstone and terra-cotta in handsome patterns. The main entrance of the building is formed of a triple arch, supported by columns of polished granite.
It is reached by a flight of six easy steps. The swinging-doors of polished oak are a few feet 1ns1de the arch, being surmounted by stained-glass windows in beautiful designs. These admit the visitor into the large central hall which bisects the building. This is 30 x 65 ft. The floor is of tile, in a well-defined pattern, and soft, pleasing colors. The walls are of red brick up to the spring of the arch. From there on they are in a soft, creamy brick. The lower portion of the wall is marked with geometrical patterns in d1fferent- colored brick, while the creamy surface above is picked out here and there with a dash of dark color.
Around the rear of the hall runs a gallery, which serves to give the light and lightness needed to the whole. This gallery is surrounded by a railing in hammered dull brass. On the right of the main entrance is the ladies' waiting-room, an apartment of handsome proportions, 30 x 84 ft., with tile floor, and finished in oak in natural color. To the rear of the apartment are well- appointed toilet-rooms. On the same side of the hall, and occupying the south side of the building, is the gentlemen's waiting-room, of the same size as the other room, less a slight abridgment in length.
Between the two is a bijou ticket-office with three ticket-windows, one to the hall and one to each waiting-room. All these rooms, as well, in (act, as all the rooms down-stairs, with one exception, are finished in a similar manner to the ladies' room, and have tiled floors. The ceiling on this floor throughout is ribbed by heavy beams, whose possible heaviness is relieved by tinting in light color approaching a soft shade of Nile green.
On the left of the entrance is the dining-room of the hotel connected with the depot, a room 40 x 52 ft., finished as the other rooms, but with a wood floor. The lunch room, on the same side, is 16x 52 ft. in size, and is furnished with folding-stools for the benefit of its patrons. Between the two rooms is the telegraph- office and the parcel counter.
To the right and rear of the hall an alcove gives room for a handsome oak stairway that leads to the second floor. This, in the west end of the building, is occupied by the train-despatchers of the different divisions, and it is safe to say that never before did train-despatchers have more comfortable or beautiful quarters. The most of the offices look directly out on the park. The east end of the building is occupied, with the exception of one room, for hotel purposes. Descending to the first floor, in the extreme west end of the building, is found the baggage-room, an apartment 52 x 56 ft. in its floor dimensions. Immediately above it and reached by a water-elevator is a room of similar size for the purpose of storing baggage not called for immediately. In the east end of the building is the emigrant room, of size the same as the baggage-room, with heavily timbered ceiling and tiled floor. This room and the one above it, also intended for the same purpose, are well appointed for their special object. The building is lighted throughout by electricity and heated by steam, both being furnished by boilers and engine located in the east end of the basement.
Outside are large car-sheds, 600 ft. in length and 100 in width, supported by iron columns and girders, and roofed with corrugated iron. They cover five tracks, on which the highest skill of the road-masters' art has been displayed. There is placed in the tower, at a height that will make it easily seen from a good part of the city, a big clock, the dials of which will at night be illuminated by electricity. The clock is one of the finest as well as the largest in the country. It has four dials. Those on the north and south sides arc II ft. in diameter, and those on the east and west are 9 ft. Each of these dials is composed of six sections of the finest ground glass, so joined together as to appear one solid piece. The pendulum of this mammoth clock is 14 ft. in length, and weighs 400 Ibs. It is regulated for heat and cold. The cost complete is $500,000.
Thanks!
So if I may ask, someone here posted that the station was done in an American Indian style... is there a great station around today that we think is in the same style as this one would have been to use as a model of what the interior may have looked like?
I know it will not be the same, but at least the same style....
Here is a better photo than the postcard...
As far as the REA building (without seeing the pic) I'd look at other Walthers buildings, it could be their commissary building or other buildings would work. Seems to me that they used to make a model of an REA building?? If so I wouldn't be surprised if it was also based on one in Milwaukee??
(Edit) This is what I was thinking of...
Walthers REA building.
Walthers Commissary background building.
BTW having a post office near the main passenger station was a very common (and rarely modelled) feature of many cities, since mail was primarily carried by train. When my Dad first starting working for the US Post Office in 1943, his first job was rolling a big cart from the main Post Office in downtown Minneapolis to the Milwaukee Road or Great Northern depots located near the Mpls Post Office (in fact the GN one was right next door) to collect mail coming in by train.
missing_caboose wrote: Hello, new here but I am building an inside to this thing in the next few weeks (I am getting the kit as a birthday gift (yes I am 33 and I ask for toys for my birthday)) I will let you know how it goes. Wanted to point out another photo I found of the outside...There are a few more on this gents site http://crossbucks.com/proto_photos.php?id=933-2943 I am still looking forinside shots.
Hello, new here but I am building an inside to this thing in the next few weeks (I am getting the kit as a birthday gift (yes I am 33 and I ask for toys for my birthday)) I will let you know how it goes.
Wanted to point out another photo I found of the outside...
There are a few more on this gents site http://crossbucks.com/proto_photos.php?id=933-2943
I am still looking forinside shots.
- Luke
Modeling the Southern Pacific in the 1960's-1980's
Hi,
According to the book I have their was a native American style on the interior. Anyone know if anything such is available? I was thinking of using perhaps strips of wood and stain them myself to do the interior.
Also, could anyone check if their really was 8 sections?
DigitalGriffin wrote: Magnus,The prototype was 8 sheds long.~D
Magnus,
The prototype was 8 sheds long.
~D
I just want to check if you are a hundred percent sure of this? I wonder for two reasons.
First, when I checked against a picture in a book the proportions of the station versus the sheds where not 8 to 1. If one removes the wings, the buildings that are not included in the walthers kit it's more like 3 to 1.
Second, I counted the poles the shed rests upon. Now the picture was dark in the middle and it was hard to be sure but I counted to 20-22 of those supports. Looking at the walthers website pictures their is seven supports per shed. So, my conclusion or guess is that it's actually just three sheds if the Walthers images and model is correct? But I'm not sure so I would really love some input.
http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/933-2949
lvanhen wrote:Lilen, I don't know if you use LED Christmas lights in Sweden. Here in the US we use them by the ton. They are available in solid white or yellow, as well as other colors. Placed up high in the train shed you may not be able to see the lights themselves, and if you can, they sell some that have a feceted head, although they would scale about 2m tall and 1m wide! Another possibility would be to use the Walthers streetlights modified for overhead use. Just my
Thanks, I will check those things out. I've been thinking about Christmas lights in general to light buildings. I've also used smal bulbs before that I have hidden away and they work all right.
wgnrr wrote: It is a very good replica of the depot.The kit has been condensed, as the real Everett Street station would have had 2 wings coming off each end of the station. These have been removed by Walthers.I am not aware of any other modifications at this time.Phil
It is a very good replica of the depot.
The kit has been condensed, as the real Everett Street station would have had 2 wings coming off each end of the station. These have been removed by Walthers.
I am not aware of any other modifications at this time.
I checked my books and was able to find one about the railroad terminals which included some info and two pics of the station.
The two buildings on the sides are a mail and a REA building. But do anyone know of any building that could be used to match? Maybe buying two kits and cutting up one of them?
The track plan for the terminal was excellent. Just as I had planed to build my layout in fact with the curves coming in straight to the sheds and a track passing besides it at the opposite end of the building. This will stand as my prototype for my own station.
If I just could get those wings.
Oh, and detail parts and good lightning.
One more photo:
Don - Specializing in layout DC->DCC conversions
Modeling C&O transition era and steel industries There's Nothing Like Big Steam!
wgnrr wrote: MisterBeasley wrote: Who knows what the prototype for this station was? Searching images of "Milwaukee Train Station" is not terribly productive. Any takers? One picture said the station was used into the 1960's.The prototype is Milwaukee Road's Everett Street Depot, which was torn down in 1965 along with the C&NW's lakefront depot. They were both replaced by the new joint station which the C&NW and MILW both utilized (which was just re-modeled in 2007).The famous clock tower was taken off the depot due to it being unstable, in the late 50's, leaving a stubby appearence.http://www2.jsonline.com/desk/histwis/images/railroadbig060799.jpgPhil
MisterBeasley wrote: Who knows what the prototype for this station was? Searching images of "Milwaukee Train Station" is not terribly productive. Any takers? One picture said the station was used into the 1960's.
The prototype is Milwaukee Road's Everett Street Depot, which was torn down in 1965 along with the C&NW's lakefront depot. They were both replaced by the new joint station which the C&NW and MILW both utilized (which was just re-modeled in 2007).
The famous clock tower was taken off the depot due to it being unstable, in the late 50's, leaving a stubby appearence.
http://www2.jsonline.com/desk/histwis/images/railroadbig060799.jpg
Thanks for the info and the link. It looks like the station had some more buildings attached to it. Or is the Walthers kit a pretty good replica?