jimrice4449 wrote:One possible reason for the dearth of RPOs and combines is that, typically, a given train would only have one of each, limiting the likelihood of multiple sales (although the same thing could be said for diners which they have brought out)
Jim--
Not neccessarily--especially during WWII, which was kind of the last of the 'golden age' of heavyweight passenger equipment. With the troop movements going from coast to coast, many transcontinental trains would run in two or three sections, and baggage and RPO's were usually pretty multiple in their consists. I remember the SP "Gold Coast" on the Donner Pass route (the train was called the "Cold Roast" by a lot of the military men who used it), and believe me, it would often run with as many as six or eight head end cars before you even SAW a passenger coach.
And frankly, some of us who like the old heavyweights would probably like to run a mail train or two, which would consist of quite a few RPO's and various styles of baggage cars. There were lots of head-end cars back then, and quite a variety of different kinds. Walthers' should at least test the market. I know I'D bite, LOL!
Tom
Tom View my layout photos! http://s299.photobucket.com/albums/mm310/TWhite-014/Rio%20Grande%20Yuba%20River%20Sub One can NEVER have too many Articulateds!
Those cars were the 'Luxury Coaches' built before WWII for the HW Empire Builder. These cars were transfered to the upgraded Badger/Gopher trains about 1952 and were painted in the usual orange/green GN paint scheme. Some were modified and has a food sales service at the head end of the car. You could buy sandwiches/beverages from the food sales attendent, or he would go through the train with a modified grocery cart selling the products.
The cars had a 'sorta' streamlined roof line. The roof was a complete arch, and tapered down to match streamlined roofs at the ends. New sealed windows were added as well. Here is a link to the MTM that provies more information:
http://mtmuseum.org/?body=jsr/roster/1952_gopher_badger.html
Jim
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
DigitalGriffin wrote: hoborich wrote: If you check some of the online discounters, you may find some Trainline RPOs. I would suggest buying whatever roads you can get, and repainting them. Sadly, while my assembly skills are great, my airbrush painting skills are pathetic.
hoborich wrote: If you check some of the online discounters, you may find some Trainline RPOs. I would suggest buying whatever roads you can get, and repainting them.
If you check some of the online discounters, you may find some Trainline RPOs. I would suggest buying whatever roads you can get, and repainting them.
Sadly, while my assembly skills are great, my airbrush painting skills are pathetic.
It's nice to know I'm not the online. I have vowed that this year will be the year I get serious and learn to do that. Of course, I've made vows like that before.
Stix,
have many thanks. This helps. I will look for these books. Currently I am building a GN "Fast Mail", therefore I will need head end cars exclusively. What I already have is an RPO and a Baggage from Oriental, both HW, and an old but very nicely built WALTHERS 70' Baggage, and an postal car and a 6-wheel Baggage from BALBOA (both streamlined), which I intend to repaint to Pullman green.
VAPEURCHAPELON wrote: wjstix wrote: GN had some that came built that way (heavyweight cars on six-wheel trucks and riveted sides, but streamlined style roofs with A/C) but also modified many other heavyweights to match up better with their streamlined lightweight cars. wjstix,do you know good reference for these cars, either print or internet? I am modeling GN very much and saw some photos of this type of car, and even in brass theye were modelled very rarely.
wjstix wrote: GN had some that came built that way (heavyweight cars on six-wheel trucks and riveted sides, but streamlined style roofs with A/C) but also modified many other heavyweights to match up better with their streamlined lightweight cars.
GN had some that came built that way (heavyweight cars on six-wheel trucks and riveted sides, but streamlined style roofs with A/C) but also modified many other heavyweights to match up better with their streamlined lightweight cars.
wjstix,
do you know good reference for these cars, either print or internet? I am modeling GN very much and saw some photos of this type of car, and even in brass theye were modelled very rarely.
What I know about them has kinda been cobbled together from a pic and/or comment from different books and magazine articles. IIRC the GN Color Guide to Freight and Passenger Equipment has pics of some of them, as do several other books on GN such as "The Great Northern in Minnesota" by Luecke.
I'm modelling northern MN and several of these cars were used on the Gopher and Badger passenger trains that ran between the Twin Cities and Duluth...in fact, I may have ridden in one when I went on the Badger with my Mom back in 1969...although I think we were actually in one of the ex-C&O streamlined cars.
One thing I would like to see Walthers do - given that so many of their heavyweights are painted in post-WW2 streamliner paintschemes - is offer these cars as "modernized" cars with streamlined styled roofs and detailing. These "semi-streamlined" cars were fairly common from the thirties thru the sixties. GN had some that came built that way (heavyweight cars on six-wheel trucks and riveted sides, but streamlined style roofs with A/C) but also modified many other heavyweights to match up better with their streamlined lightweight cars.
Of course it probably wouldn't be that hard to add a different roof to a car, but would be a nice alternative.
You can kitbash headend cars fairly easily by using readily available passenger cars. Here's a link to thread that gives a brief outline of the work involved. If you're on dial-up, be forewarned: lots of pictures.
or, if you just want to look at thumbnails (they'll enlarge if you click on them), try here:
For those who can't be bothered to look, here are a few examples:
The first four of these wood-sided cars were built from Athearn Pullmans, the horse express car is from a Rivarrossi coach, and the free-lanced combine is an ex-Rivarossi diner.
Wayne
There is definitely a shortage of baggage/express cars. It is a particular shame because that was where the profit-generating revenue (in addition to the bar in the club car) came from...and express trains offer lots of switching opportunities.
Mark
I remember the older Walthers cars (metal and wood) and they had a wonderful myriad of head-end equipment (still have a couple). Like a lot of you, I'm wondering why they're so skimpy on this equipment in their new plastic ready-to-run heavyweight cars? Heck, they even had a really COOL Pennsylvania 'horse'-car baggage (one of which I have). Someone needs to remind Walthers that passenger trains during the 'golden era' weren't all Pullmans. Some trains had almost as many head-end cars as they had passenger cars, that's what helped make passenger trains so darned fascinating back then.
What is wrong with the Walthers diner?
Well GandyDancer, I just ordered two of them so I won't be able to answer your question until I see them.
I probably will have to chop them up and kitbash the two of them to New Havenize them. Hopefully, not. Being in Mill Walkie, Walther's has always tilted strongly in favor of local buildings and mid west roads.
What about Bachman Spectrum for combines?
What about Bethlehem Car Works for RPOs?
Walthers has a baggage car as part of it's heavyweight line now too, with two different door styles for different time periods.
Cheers!
~METRO
Athearn, Ready to Roll, has some decent RPOs. I have a couple.
http://www.athearn.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=ATH78772
Depending on how fussy you are, or how much work you care to put into it, the old Rivarossi RPO can be made into an acceptable car.
Likewise for a combine. I added a few New England Rail Services windows to mine.
You can also kitbash Athearn baggage cars: this one is made from two cars, using the ends with the larger doors, although the car could be left as-is, with just a new, scratchbuilt floor added. The same goes for their RPO. I added some windows from an Athearn Pullman, as I converted a number of them into wood-sided cars. In the era that I model, the '30s, windows in baggage cars were quite common.
This car is a Rivarossi coach with most of the windows blanked (a common practice on the prototype), and new scratchbuilt doors added. You could do the same with the Athearn arched-roof coach, creating either a baggage car or an RPO. These would need a new floor/underframe, too, an easy task.
Safety Valve wrote:I dont think a 60' RPO trainline model is going to cut it either...they really need to finish up the Heavyweights with the RPO.
I dont think a 60' RPO trainline model is going to cut it either...they really need to finish up the Heavyweights with the RPO.
If it's the length you're objecting to, that's an accurate length for the RPO they modeled it after. 60 feet was a common maximum length for heavyweight full RPOs. While a few roads had 70-foot full RPOs (Pennsy, for one), the photos I've seen over the years have the roads with 60-foot heavyweight full RPOs far outnumbering those with longer ones.
Now if you start talking RPO/baggages and RPO/baggage/coaches, then yeah, 70 feet and up makes sense. I'd like to see a RPO/baggage/coach made available, and maybe a baggage/RPO with two baggage doors on each side, along with the RPO section. Several roads in the Midwest had those. The baggage/RPO/coach would be a natural for small layouts.
And how about some head-end equipment with arch roofs? The Walthers modernized version of their paired window coach has an arch roof, but an arch roof baggage/RPO would sure be nice. Or a 60 to 64-foot arch-roof baggage car. The Pennsy B60's shape doesn't quite cut it as a stand-in for many other roads' arch roof cars.
-Fritz Milhaupt, Publications Editor, Pere Marquette Historical Society, Inc.http://www.pmhistsoc.org
I bought two Mail Storage cars (Baggage car) and called it good enough.
They have LOTS of RPO's in other kinds of passenger cars but none for the Heavyweights.
Dave
USAF (Retired)
Gandy Dancer wrote: BigRusty wrote: diners ... are sadly lacking from both Walthers and Branchline.What is wrong with the Walthers diner?
BigRusty wrote: diners ... are sadly lacking from both Walthers and Branchline.
Perhaps they don't have enough styles? Personally I think they have a fair amount of choices... though it could always be improved I guess
-Dan
Builder of Bowser steam! Railimages Site
BigRusty wrote: I agree. Baggage, rpo, diners and parlor cars are sadly lacking from both Walthers and Branchline.If they don't get on the band wagon soon, one day all of us old timers who model the Heavy Weight era will have gone to that great model railroad club in the sky and the market for HW cars will go there with them.
I agree. Baggage, rpo, diners and parlor cars are sadly lacking from both Walthers and Branchline.
If they don't get on the band wagon soon, one day all of us old timers who model the Heavy Weight era will have gone to that great model railroad club in the sky and the market for HW cars will go there with them.
Walthers Pullman Heavyweight Parlor Car:
http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/932-10301
Walthers Pullman-built Heavyweight Diner:
http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/932-10150
Walthers ACF 70' Baggage-Express:
http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/932-10549
Don - Specializing in layout DC->DCC conversions
Modeling C&O transition era and steel industries There's Nothing Like Big Steam!
I don't know whats missing. But for $44.95 list price, they could include the lights in the price!
I did manage to find a Trainline RPO, in the Union Pacific scheme, which I plan to repaint in another road. If you check some of the online discounters, you may find some Trainline RPOs. I would suggest buying whatever roads you can get, and repainting them. You may find a couple, in the less popular and slower selling roads.
ABSOLUTELY!!!
Some days ago I emailed them and asked if they at least plan a rerun of their TRAINLINE RPOs. These were VERY NICE models! I never understand why they offered it for such a short time. No reply up to date.
But perhaps they are even RETOOLING it...?
Where are the combine's and RPOs? RPO was a big revenue generator. And combine's were essential for all those first class passengers and their extra baggage.
The only other one I can find is made by IHC, and it's..."lacking"