We are starting to take our club layout to the next level by adding a various sounds at selected locations. One member is building the components, downloading the sounds, and handing over the completed units to us as completed. My question is how to best place the speakers to get the best sound. An example is a hobo camp (Woodland Scenics) where one of the figures is playing a harmonica. I can place the speaker pretty much anywhere on the scene but would it be better to mount it under the scenery with a hole cut in the plaster shell and perhaps a plastic box behind the speaker, or mount it on the surface behind some bushes. I know some sort of a container for the speaker is generally recommended but putting all of that on top of the shell might be a challenge. So, how should I try to mount the speaker to get the most out of it? Note - the volume will be set low enough that until you get close to the scene you won't much hear it. It is meant to be a background sound, not one to be heard throughout the layout.
Thanks,
Dan
I would recommend as large a speaker as is practical, and mounting it under the layoutm beneath the scene the sound is meant to accompany. It doesn't have to be a huge speaker, you can get relatively inexpensive speakers meant to connect to a computer that are in an enclosure only a few inches across but still produce good sound.
You don't have to try to squeeze the speaker into the scene for it to be effective. A speaker mounted in the tender of a steam engine works well, even though the sound should be coming from the front of the engine. Plus, as guitar great Les Paul once said, people hear with their eyes. Visitors will hear the harmonica (and perhaps crackle of a fire?) coming from the general area of the hobo camp, and their eyes will soon land on the hoboes. Their minds will accept that the sound is coming from there, even with a speaker mounted under the layout in the area.
A lot of variables in each scene where sound is desired will determine where the speaker should be placed. The distance between the viewer and the scene is very important, especially when you want the sound to appear as though a certain figure or object is producing the sound.
Most of us have heard sound equipped steam locos with the speaker installed in the tender operating on a layout. When the loco is a couple of feet or more from the listener, the sound appears to be coming from the loco. Unfortunately, that same loco traveling along a track on the edge of an aisle allows the listener to get close enough that the sound is easily identified as coming out of the tender. Fortunately, the scenery is stationary so it is a little easier to make it appear that the sound is actually coming from the "source."
Take the hobo scene. If the listener cannot get close to the scene, speaker placement is not that critical as long as it remains within inches of the scene. However, if the scene is on the aisle and you want the sound effects to appear to be coming from the figures in the hobo scene, locate the speaker as close to the figures as possible. Directly under the figures would probably be best. A piece of fine tulle (such as the material provided in the Walthers Chain Link Fence kits) painted black and sprinkled with foam turf would make an excellent acoustically transparent speaker grill while easily hiding the speaker from the listener. Bird sounds would sound best if the speaker were hidden up inside trees. Hiding the speaker inside a polyfiber puff ball sprinkled with ground foam could work nicely inside a tree toward the rear of the scene. Hiding a speaker inside a rock in the middle of a stream could make water sounds appear to come directly from the stream.
Sounds eminating from structures is a bit easier as you can usually hide the speaker somewhere inside the structure.
Just remember that the closer the listener can get to a scene, the closer the speaker needs to be to the "source" to sound realistic.
Hornblower
wjstixas guitar great Les Paul once said, people hear with their eyes. Visitors will hear the harmonica (and perhaps crackle of a fire?) coming from the general area of the hobo camp, and their eyes will soon land on the hoboes. Their minds will accept that the sound is coming from there
As a professional acoustical engineer, I agree that people hear with their eyes. However, if the sound is not eminating from what their eyes are looking at, they immediately conclude that something is wrong. This is due to the fact that people have binaural or direction sensitive hearing. This direction sensitive hearing is why surround sound is so effective at placing the listener inside the action. It is also why when we hear a certain sound like a friend yelling, "Hey Dan!", we can easily turn to look at the sound source, even when it is behind us. The same thing happens when we add sound to our layouts.
The critical variable remains how close the listener can get to a layout scene. If they can get their face within a few inches of the hobo scene for a better look, a speaker hidden in a rock even a couple inches away from the hobo will make it sound to the listener that the rock is playing the harmonica, and no, our minds will not accept that a rock can play the harmonica! The effect will be quite disappointing to the listener.
On the other hand, placing the speaker directly beneath the hobos and using a hollow log, a rock with lots of cracks, bushes, or a camouflaged screen to hide the speaker from view will place the sound exactly where it needs to be, reinforcing the listener's perception that the harmonica sounds are indeed eminating from the harmonica player.
Granted, many modelers are getting up in years and no longer hear well enough to detect these nuances, but people that do still possess normal hearing will truly appreciate a sound augmented scene as long as it is executed properly.
To add to this: consider how close different scenes with different sounds are - if over the hill from those hobos is a logging camp, the overlap of harmonica with logging noises is fine. However, if you want the feeling of an isolated hobo camp, you don't really want the logging noises to be heard, much less the noises of a factory or a city.
I have a small scene with a small tank engine that services a car float. The engine is a bit small for installing sound, so I put a speaker in a small structure the scene curves around. As the scene is at the back of the layout, this illusion works very well.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
Thanks for all the replies guys - much appreciated. We have a work session tomorrow evening and the other member and I will see about locating the speaker as close to the figures as possible. Should be able to cut out an opening in the plaster where the speaker can be placed and then hidden by bushes. If the sound is good, that may be all that is needed. Will let you know the results.
You can use piped sound too, this is where pipes made of styrene tubes or whatever are hiden in bushes exc. and terminate near the speaker, you can experiment with size of tubes and placement till you get what you want along with fixing the volume.
How about purchasing or making an old wooden crate that the hobo could lean against or sit on top. The back side could be removed, or holes cut into, to allow sound to pass. This of course assumes the back side would not be visible
I'll just clarify my main earlier point, a larger speaker and enclosure an inch or two directly below the scene (i.e. under the scenery or under the benchwork) will sound better than a tiny speaker (possibly with no enclosure) sitting in the scene.
So a dumb question here, for a small scene such as the OP described why wouldn't one of the sugar cube speakers for sound equipped locomotives work? They have plenty of volume in a locomotive so getting the volume lower should be easy, right? Smaller and easier to hide in a scene too. I'm sure I'm missing something, but on the surface it seems like a good solution to me.
Good Luck, Morpar
Project is done and it works great. Would like to post a video but can't figure out how to do it. Seems overly complicated compared to other sites.