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ESU Pilot - Light Control Question

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  • Member since
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  • From: Chicago area
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Posted by Arto on Thursday, May 11, 2023 5:28 PM

Thanks Ed!!

That looks like a doable solution. Big Smile

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Posted by gmpullman on Thursday, May 11, 2023 12:18 PM

Arto
I just won't have a bleaking beacon light. 

I recently installed one of the 'Rapido Bits' Cullen-Hayes rotary beacons in a C&NW FP7. These don't need any additional programming as the 'blinking' is handled by a timer chip integral with the wiring.

Just another option.

Regards, Ed

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Posted by Arto on Thursday, May 11, 2023 8:36 AM

maxman

Can you replace the motherboard with one from the decoder manufacturer?

Or hardwire the decoder?

 

Well, yes. But that was what I was trying to avoid.

After reading the decoder product description in more detail, seeing the info regarding lighting effects, I thought I might be able utilize the effects simply by resetting some CV's. As usual, manufacturers marketing descriptions are misleading. Yes, you can do all those things, "IF". And that's the caveat.

It's not worth my time nor money messing around trying to solve this issue. I might as well just buy a LokSound decoder.

I got these U50 (5 of them, 2 DCC, 3 DC) for a really great price brand new. I wrongly assumed that by just installing a decoder in the DCC ready units, I could make a few CV changes and at least get more lighting effects functionality.

So now the worse case is I'm back to where I started. No big deal. The locos run great with the LokPilot decoders (much better than the DCC/Tsunami units). I just won't have a bleaking beacon light. Crying

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Posted by maxman on Wednesday, May 10, 2023 7:46 PM

Can you replace the motherboard with one from the decoder manufacturer?

Or hardwire the decoder?

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Posted by BigDaddy on Wednesday, May 10, 2023 5:33 PM

Arto
"Our team contacted the Athearn development team and they do not have wiring schematics available.

If one repeats that statement, followed by the expression "Really?" one must conclude that Athearn has no credability.

Putting less than full function decoders is not unique to Athearn.  Bachmann sound value decoders is but one example.  There are also other ESU OEM cheaped down decoders.  I assume there are other "slimmed down" models from other manufacturer. 

Caveat Emptor.

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

Shenandoah Valley

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Posted by Arto on Wednesday, May 10, 2023 5:12 PM

I got a response from Athearn tech support. As I suspected.

"Our team contacted the Athearn development team and they do not have wiring schematics available.

Regards,

Horizon Hobby"

The Athearn part# in question is ATH67240

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Posted by Arto on Wednesday, May 10, 2023 2:08 PM

maxman

Question.  If you can see the beacon wiring, is it possible to separate it from the headlight wiring and then resolder to a different point?

 

Max, yes. However I see no way of knowing what that different point/terminal on the OEM motherboard should be.

I can't trace the circuit board - it's opaque. So I don't know what pins on the OEM motherboard go to on the decoder connector. And Athearn was not helpful in providing any documentation. They basically pushed it off as an ESU problem.

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Posted by maxman on Wednesday, May 10, 2023 1:27 PM

Question.  If you can see the beacon wiring, is it possible to separate it from the headlight wiring and then resolder to a different point?

  • Member since
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Posted by Arto on Wednesday, May 10, 2023 12:34 PM

Thanks for everyone's help!

Unfortunately, after tracing the lamp wiring, both the headlight & beacon are connected together to the same motherboard terminals. I can't trace anything any further because the circuit traces are "covered over" and Athearn tech support has been coy and useless as usual. Without any documentation there's no way to attempt a re-wire to the proper motherboard terminal, possibly using the Tsunami motherboard for reference.

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Posted by wjstix on Wednesday, May 10, 2023 10:27 AM

It looks like (per ESU website) that the LokPilot 4 micro DCC decoder is only has two light function outputs. It says it does do strobe, flashing light, and other options, so I suspect you could program the decoder in such a way that the rooftop strobe would flash - but most likely one or both headlights would then flash also.

ESU - Electronic Solutions Ulm GmbH & Co. KG: LokPilot micro V4.0 DCC

p.s. the decoder I have is the ESU 53614 LokPilot Standard DCC Decoder, 21MTC that I bought back in 2017 (it was first released by ESU in 2013 apparently). The ESU website talks about needing a ESU 51968 adapter board to access all of the functions. 

Stix
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Posted by BigDaddy on Wednesday, May 10, 2023 9:11 AM

Don't forget to set CV's 16 & 32 first.

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

Shenandoah Valley

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Posted by Arto on Wednesday, May 10, 2023 9:03 AM

I thought it was a LokPilot5 but I was wrong.

It's actually a LokPilot4 Micro DCC (only).

I'm pretty sure that puts it in ESU's most basic decoder catagory, and obviously not the most current version and therefore, unlikely it has the light effects functionality I was hoping for.

OTOH, I'll try what Henry has so kindly deciphered from the ESU User Guide (if you can call it that. Kind of amazing considering how technically good their decoders are)

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Posted by Mark R. on Wednesday, May 10, 2023 5:38 AM

What version of the LokPilot decoder are you using ? The earlier LokPilot Basic decoders had very limited abilities.

Mark.

¡ uʍop ǝpısdn sı ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ 'dlǝɥ

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Posted by BigDaddy on Tuesday, May 9, 2023 6:40 PM

wjstix
ou can't set it so one is bright and the opposite dim (which is my preferred way)

I only have Loksound, and no 21 pin, but 21 pin came after 8 pin.  I have a hard time believing they downgraded with the first 21 pin decoders.  Ask on the ESU group.

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

Shenandoah Valley

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Posted by BigDaddy on Tuesday, May 9, 2023 6:37 PM

The OP has a programmer but one shouldn't need to buy $150 accessory nor learn JMRI to program this.  ESU instructions are notoriously bad.  There is an Alternate Lokprogramer Manual available in the ESU Groups.io files

I'm not sure how one determines what function the rotary beacon would be wired to.   For argument sake, let's use their example of Aux 4 which would be Mode Select CV 299 (pg 65)

At the top of page the instruction for setting CV 16 and 32 should say the below CV's not above.

Instruction 4 on page 66 should say set CV 299 to 6 not 4

Reading across the table of Aux 4, Special Function CV 1 is 303.  For LED's you need to set this at 128.  CV 302 is brightness and they suggest 25

If anyone sees where I have gone wrong, please speak up.

 

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

Shenandoah Valley

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Posted by wjstix on Tuesday, May 9, 2023 4:33 PM

Hooking up the LokProgrammer and letting it read the decoder will tell what the decoder can and can't do.

FWIW I have a 21-pin LokPilot decoder, I'm not sure if it's a very early one or what, but the lighting is very limited. All I can get it to do is have the headlight on in the direction of travel and the other off, or both on bright, depending which settings I use. You can't set it so one is bright and the opposite dim (which is my preferred way). It's as best I can tell a very basic decoder. 

Stix
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Posted by Arto on Tuesday, May 9, 2023 3:12 PM

Yes, thanks Max. I already saw that. Unfortunately, it all makes absolutely no sense to me. On top of that, the ESU manual might as well be written in Martian. The pages they reference are wrong. The examples they provide are shallow, bordering on retarded.

I already tried the function mapping thing using JMRI to no avail.

Upon opening and examining both a DCC Tsunami equipped and DCC Ready ATHG U50 (equipped with ESU LokPilot), tracing the wires, I'm pretty sure at this point that the original DCC Ready motherboard will not support the rotary beacon lighting effect regardless of whether or not the DCC decoder does.

I'm hoping someone can tell me otherwise.

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Posted by maxman on Tuesday, May 9, 2023 2:48 PM

Looks like that is discussed on pages 67 - 70 in the Lok Pilot decoder manual:

https://www.esu.eu/en/downloads/instruction-manuals/digital-decoders/

Probably easiest to use JMRI.  There is also a ESU support website, loksound@group.io

 

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ESU Pilot - Light Control Question
Posted by Arto on Tuesday, May 9, 2023 10:39 AM

I'm using ESU Pilot decoders in several locomotives (Athearn Genesis U50). These have a beacon on the cab.

How do I get the rotary beacon effect to work? Right now it just lights up (and turns off) with the rest of the lights.

Digitrax DCC/JMRI. I have a ESU LokProgrammer (if that is required) but it isn't hooked up yet.

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