know2go Hi Batman, when you get "cannot read CVs when on the programming track, usually this is the decoder issue. replacing the decoder with a new one usually fixes this and by extension, other problems.
Hi Batman, when you get "cannot read CVs when on the programming track, usually this is the decoder issue. replacing the decoder with a new one usually fixes this and by extension, other problems.
I sent it back to Rapido and they said it was definitely a bad decoder and it is currently on its way back across the country homeward bound.
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
Brent.
We have all been there. Especially when DCC was in it's infancy. I couldn't tell you how many decoders I have had to reset because of a simple problem that with a little deductive reasoning could have saved the day. I have had decoders get scrambled when someone else shorted the track. And when someone broadcast program instead of POM. Before disabling DC in CV29 would rocket your train across the layout. Flashing lights, melted shells, and buzzing motors were all part of the learning curve.
When something weird happens. The first thing that goes through my head is. What was the last thing I did before it messed up? Then work back from there.
Like the Pink Floyd song. Welcome to the machine.
Pete.
hon30critter BATMAN FIXED!!!!!! I am happy to hear that Brent. DCC can be very unforgiving. Several years ago one of my critters was acting up so I did a factory reset. After that the decoder seemed to be totally dead. I tried all sorts of things programming wise but nothing worked, so I decided the decoder was faulty. To make a long story short, the problem was simply that I was inputting address 03 incorrectly on my NCE PowerCab. I was putting in address "003" instead of "03". The display shows the address as '003' when it is actually '03', so I was simply putting in the address that the display showed. Fortunately a fellow forum member pointed out the error of my ways, but unfortunately I had already removed the decoder and in the process I managed to destroy part of the shell. I still haven't fixed it. Dave
BATMAN FIXED!!!!!!
I am happy to hear that Brent.
DCC can be very unforgiving. Several years ago one of my critters was acting up so I did a factory reset. After that the decoder seemed to be totally dead. I tried all sorts of things programming wise but nothing worked, so I decided the decoder was faulty.
To make a long story short, the problem was simply that I was inputting address 03 incorrectly on my NCE PowerCab. I was putting in address "003" instead of "03". The display shows the address as '003' when it is actually '03', so I was simply putting in the address that the display showed.
Fortunately a fellow forum member pointed out the error of my ways, but unfortunately I had already removed the decoder and in the process I managed to destroy part of the shell. I still haven't fixed it.
Dave
Dave, In my endless reading trying to resolve the problem, the conflicting advice on how many "0" to add when programing a CV was enough to drive you nuts, especially CV 8.
This little exercise in frustration has taught me a few things at least and that is never a bad thing. I came across a guy with the same problem on FB and suggested the delete from consist button and he was up and running again in no time.
I have two Rapido FP7As and one "B" unit and they have been in and out of consist a lot. I will hit the delete from consist button for all of them just to be sure. I haven't tried it yet, but I wonder if I will still get the "can not read" notice on the programming track for the "B" unit?
I was seeking help on the ESU forum and those guys sure like to make you feel stupid, not here though, it is a better fit for me. Thanks for all your help.
wrench567 Rich. There could be an issue with the wireless throttle. But the same thing happens with the wired Power Cab. Because of computers, things that would take days to screw up now only takes seconds. When the Power Cab was version 1.1. I never noticed any problems. After the upgrade chip to version 1.6 when I exit program track for some reason the bell is on F4. I have to unplug the tether and restart the cab. Then everything is normal. Strange behavior indeed.
Rich.
There could be an issue with the wireless throttle. But the same thing happens with the wired Power Cab. Because of computers, things that would take days to screw up now only takes seconds. When the Power Cab was version 1.1. I never noticed any problems. After the upgrade chip to version 1.6 when I exit program track for some reason the bell is on F4. I have to unplug the tether and restart the cab. Then everything is normal. Strange behavior indeed.
Rich
Alton Junction
Stix.
You don't have to tell me about bonehead moves. I'm a master at it. One of my steamers wouldn't run. Instead of address 9827, I was putting in 8927. The font at quick glance the 9 looks like an 8 and vice a verse. Note to self. Put on glasses before operating!!!!
Been there done that. Will be across my headstone.
wrench567 . Stixx hit on it about ten posts ago. Old fashioned consist!!!!! There was nothing wrong with the decoder at all. The consist is held in the command station. As long as the locomotive is on the track it will only be controlled by the consist address. Pete.
. Stixx hit on it about ten posts ago. Old fashioned consist!!!!! There was nothing wrong with the decoder at all. The consist is held in the command station. As long as the locomotive is on the track it will only be controlled by the consist address.
wrench567 Rich. The same with my Power Cab system. Weather it's user error ( probably), or the offending locomotive had a disconnect from dirty wheels or track. It happens.
The same with my Power Cab system. Weather it's user error ( probably), or the offending locomotive had a disconnect from dirty wheels or track. It happens.
I would rule out dirty wheels and dirty track because I have checked that out on my layout. It still could be, but that is not my experience.
As to user error, I cannot claim to be infallible as an operator. But, in this case, I will rule out operator error because, over time, I feel that I have developed sufficient expertise with Advanced Consisting to do it right.
My conclusion is that there is some type of flaw in the NCE system, either the command station or the wireless throttle. I have often wondered if the CV19 error could be eliminated by using a tethered throttle. In other words, I consider the wireless system as a "throttle of interest".
The same with my Power Cab system. Weather it's user error ( probably), or the offending locomotive had a disconnect from dirty wheels or track. It happens. On the clubs Lenz system I would old fashion consist two advanced consist sets and sometimes have difficulty breaking them up. Or one locomotive never got the message. I then found it easier just to use two throttles for the pusher section. But an extra throttle was not always available.
I have been following this thread, but I have offered no replies because I had no answers. But now that Brent has solved the problem, I will offer these comments.
I also have the NCE Power Pro 5 amp wireless system. I use the Advanced Consist option quite often because I run my passenger train locomotives in AA and AB consists. I also run diesel freight locomotives in consists. I never use Old Style Consists.
That said, there have been occasions where I clear a consist and CV19 is not cleared even though I follow the NCE instructions for clearing consists. In fact, it happens often enough that when a locomotive has lights and sound but no movement, CV19 is the problem.
I no longer waste time putting the locomotive on the Programming Track to check CV19 to see if that is the problem. I simply use the Ops mode on the mainline to set CV19 to zero, and that solves the problem.
I blame all of this on the NCE command station. I don't know why CV19 is not reset to zero, but it often not reset to zero.
I have never documented the problem and the solution in writing to remind myself of this recurring issue, but I'll bet if I went down to my layout right now, this very problem will occur on at least one consist.
BATMANFIXED!!!!!!
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
wrench567 Could it be possible you thought it was an advanced consist? You were clearing a CV control consist instead of an old fashioned command station consist.
Hmmmmmm, you may be right. I need to read up on NCE and consist.
BATMAN So why wasn't it removed when the consist was deleted on the system?
So why wasn't it removed when the consist was deleted on the system?
Could it be possible you thought it was an advanced consist? You were clearing a CV control consist instead of an old fashioned command station consist.
Did you say earlier that this was a B unit? All my B units have the same DCC address as the A unit. Engines that I usually run together have the same address. At my former club I would run a half dozen Alco RS units on coal drags. Two RSD4/5, three RS3, and an RS1. All six have the DCC address of 5566. That is the address of the RS1. The ones with odd number cab numbers are set to run reverse. The even numbers run forward. Address consisting is easy and quick.
Glad you got it going.
maxman I wonder what it was deleted from.
I wonder what it was deleted from.
I hope someone can give us an answer as I am hoping to get my tiny brain around DCC before I can't.
FIXED!!!!!!
Hours later after clearing consist, setting CV19 to 0, and trying other things, I hit the delete loco button and KAPLA! Who-da thought. This hobby is too advanced for my tiny brain.
At least there is a hockey game tonight and the wife has stocked the bar.
BATMAN The DCC Wiki page lead me to this. I wonder as my system was purchased in 2009. The letter is dated 2010. https://ncedcc.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/article_attachments/201358689/prog_track_boost.pdf Lee, I will take a look at CVs 31 and 32.
The DCC Wiki page lead me to this. I wonder as my system was purchased in 2009. The letter is dated 2010.
https://ncedcc.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/article_attachments/201358689/prog_track_boost.pdf
Lee, I will take a look at CVs 31 and 32.
Lee 1234 This is a less basic thing to check on. Did you change CV 31 or CV 32? CV 31 = 16 and CV 32 =0 if accessing CVs 1-255. Reference the Quick Start Guide.
This is a less basic thing to check on.
Did you change CV 31 or CV 32? CV 31 = 16 and CV 32 =0 if accessing CVs 1-255. Reference the Quick Start Guide.
Do not attempt to change indexed CVs with a Power Pro using the program track! The decoder will be corrupted.
You can do it using Decoder Pro, as it is aware of the issue and can work around it.
It is also possible to to use Ops Mode to do it, but it can be problematic with timing issues.
The PowerCab is not impacted by this firmware bug.
BATMANWell, it runs on DC, I have no consist in the system. wjstix (I suspect more likely) the engine is still set by your DCC system (not the decoder) to be part of a consist. Even if the system has been purged of consist?
I can't say if your issue is consist related or not. In any event, how did you "purge" all your consists? Sometimes the NCE system does not do a good job of this.
To be sure, put the loco on the programming track and directly set CV19 to zero.
Perhaps I need one of these?
https://dccwiki.com/PTB-100
https://soundtraxx.com/accessories/installation-accessories/dcc-accessories/ptb-100-programming-track-booster/
https://ncedcc.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/202353705-Cannot-Read-CV
I feel like I am getting somewhere.
Lee
ESU decoders are pretty complex and a bit different than other decoders, so maybe the best bet would be to find a friend or hobby shop that has an ESU LokProgrammer and review the settings using that.
BATMAN I have an NCE Power Pro-R System and it cannot read the CVs on the programming track of this one decoder and I cannot reset it either on the PT or main. Suggestions? I get sounds and lights but the loco won't move. As always, thanks.
I have an NCE Power Pro-R System and it cannot read the CVs on the programming track of this one decoder and I cannot reset it either on the PT or main. Suggestions?
I get sounds and lights but the loco won't move.
As always, thanks.
ESU recommends using the program track (service mode) and Direct Mode to reset the decoder.
Writing a value of 8 to CV8 should work. If you have JMRI, it has a specific button for resetting an ESU decoder. You will have to determine the decoder model using New Loco - Read Type from Decoder.
Remember, a LokSound's default address is not necessarily "3". It could be any acceptable value.
Decoder Reset
Well, it runs on DC, I have no consist in the system.
wjstix(I suspect more likely) the engine is still set by your DCC system (not the decoder) to be part of a consist.
Even if the system has been purged of consist?
It is a Rapido F7B and was working and then it wasn't. Horn, bell, and light still work so that tells me the addressing is OK.
Onward and upward, please keep the suggestions coming
BTW quick and easy way to test for a loose motor connection without taking the engine apart is to try it on DC. Since it's a dual-mode decoder it should run on DC but due to being a sound decoder may require maybe 9-10 volts before moving. It it moves even slowly in DC, then it's a problem with a CV setting or (I suspect more likely) the engine is still set by your DCC system (not the decoder) to be part of a consist.
BATMAN wrench567 Does the locomotive jiggle when writing CVs? Do you have decoder Pro? Try reading all sheets and see if it walks down the track. Is it difficult to check the motor connections? It does wiggle ever so slightly, does this mean anything? I thought I was seeing things as I thought it was not supposed to be able to move on the program track. I don't have a programmer and I will try and get the shell off for a peek inside tomorrow. I appreciate the help.
wrench567 Does the locomotive jiggle when writing CVs? Do you have decoder Pro? Try reading all sheets and see if it walks down the track. Is it difficult to check the motor connections?
Does the locomotive jiggle when writing CVs? Do you have decoder Pro? Try reading all sheets and see if it walks down the track. Is it difficult to check the motor connections?
It does wiggle ever so slightly, does this mean anything? I thought I was seeing things as I thought it was not supposed to be able to move on the program track. I don't have a programmer and I will try and get the shell off for a peek inside tomorrow.
I appreciate the help.
If the locomotive is jiggling now then that would indicate the motor IS connected. Try what Stix posted above. If you have it on the roster of decoder Pro from the beginning then you could try the write all sheets to reload what was in before. Why it won't read is a mystery.