I'm a total newbie venturing into DCC. I have a consist of 3 Athearn Genesis F7's (all are powered). They all run great with sound muted but they tend to run a little flakey at high throttle settings when each of them has full sound on. I noticed my NCE Power Cab is spec'd at 4 locomotives max. Does having full sound from the three locomotives put much additional load on the Power Cab? I do plan to experiment with CV's and disable sound on all but one locomotive. Just curious if full sound is a factor when it comes to power load. TIA.
Dave,
Actually, your Power Cab is spec'd @ 2A (max). I have some locomotives that only draw about 0.1-0.2A. So, I could technically run up to 8 locomotives at a given time. Keeping track of that many locos, however, would be a much bigger issue than current draw.
If you have all three locomotives running at or near full throttle with the sound on, that could tax your Power Cab. One way to check is to turn on the current meter feature of your Power Cab and measure one of the three F7s with the sound on at high throttle. Here's how to turn on that feature:
The current draw will then display up in the right-hand corner of the LCD screen.
Once you have determined the current draw from one of your F7s, then multiply that amount by three. A current draw of 1.5A for all three should be okay. 1.75A or > might be pushing it. Even muting one of three sound decoder should help drop the current to better levels.
The only way to alleviate the issue would be to upgrade to either the NCE PH Pro system or the SB5 (booster). Either would increase max current output total to 5A and also allow you to use your Power Cab as a throttle.
HTH,
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
Thanks Tom,
Track amps show around 1 amp so that's not a problem. The surging does go away when I turn off sound on unit B, the rear A and reduce it to 25% on the lead A unit. I've also noticed these brand new locomotives are sure leaving the track oily/dirty. Is this common on new locomotives fresh out of the box?
Do you have the A & B units speed matched? Sounds like they maybe fighting each other.
Don't think the dirty track is from you loco's- rolling stock wheels clean?
It's possible that the gears are over-greased and leaking onto the track. You can try popping off the gear covers and taking a peek. However, cleaning the wheels first would be a good place to start to help pinpoint where the problem is coming from.
Yea, that built-in current meter in the Power Cab is a pretty handy little tool. I agree with woodone that you might want to check to see how well the units are speed-matched to one another.
davefrI've also noticed these brand new locomotives are sure leaving the track oily/dirty. Is this common on new locomotives fresh out of the box?
Rapido trains has a video showing how dirty the wheels can be on brand new loco's and strongly suggest they be cleaned. I recently bought two new FP units and two RDCs. One RDCs wheels were so dirty the lights flickered as it went around the layout, that reminded me I had not cleaned the wheels and they were grimy, to say the least. The other RDCs wheels were quite clean. The FPs wheels were not too bad but still needed a quick run on the paper towel.
Speed matching makes things run much smoother. I have a 48' loop I run them around when matching. Once they stay within a foot of each other after one loop, that is good enough for me.
Brent
"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."
Even though all these locos are considered "ready to run" out of the box - always check them over a bit before any prolonged running. Some locos (even all the same brand and model) come with dry gears, others have so much grease applied at the factory that it's dripping all over the bottom. I guess one gets a double shot and another gets none as they go through assembly. The worst one I had was a Bachmann E33 electric - then entire bottom of the plastic shell around the loco on the inner packing, under the trucks, was full of grease, and the bottom covers of the trucks were shiny with excess. I was lucky it didn't get on the loco shell and ruin the paint. Took a lot to clean it all off, and it STILL oozed again. When that gets all over the truck wipers or the wheels (and hence the rails) it messes with the operation of ALL locos.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
I fried my Power Cab by running too many sound locos at once.I didn't get any indication of trouble until they stopped.
I emailed NCE, they gave me an estimated time for repair, but were much faster. Their advice was to get a SB5 if I were going to keep running that kind of load. Haven't redone the layout yet, have just run three at most. Will add an SB5 when the new layout is ready to run trains. (A time to be determined.)
Good luck,
Richard
The Power Cab current draw isn't too much. The question I have is - how big is the layout, and what size wiring are you using? Does this only happen when the locos are further away from the power feed to the tracks?
It's a small 4 X 8 layout (Woodlands Grand Valley) with soldered track and lots of power feeds. DC locomotives run flawlessly. Here are the problems I'm experiencing with these Athearn Genesis DCC locomotives:
1. Although I don't see an excess of lubrication in the gear boxes, they leave my track very dirty. Even if I clean the wheels and track it get's dirty quickly again.
2. There's some binding around 18" curves. I can hear the screeching (even though Athearn spec says 18" min.)
3. I get cutouts, surging and inconsistent performance. It's like the wheel's power pickups are unreliable/intermittent or related to #1. I would think 4 wheels picking up power there would never be an issue like this.
4. I can speed match locomotive B to lead A by adjusting trim but to get rear locomotive A to match front A and B requires 2X trim and that still isn't enough.
5. If I mute sound, it comes right back on randomly when crossing frogs.
6. The consist works better with sound off. So what's the point with this expensive DCC/Sound set.
I'm sending these sets back to the supplier. I don't want to void the warranty by taking them apart and they're within the 30 day return window. My DC Stewart/Kato FT consist runs so much better then these. DCC/Sound was cool at first but get's old fast IMHO. For a simple layout like mine, DC will be fine.
I seem to have a similar problem with power on my Digitrax w/ DB150 and a 5 amp power supply. I have about 200 feet of track down with more to go. I ran a consist of 6 Athearn sound locomotive with all on, 2 Bachamann ES44 sound locomotives and a Proto sound locomotive and the consist seems sluggish. But I am almost sure it is my feeder wire problem being they are not hooked up yet on the far end of the layout were the problem seems to be. I have 14 awg bus wires ans 20 awg feeder wires. I will look at it closer when the bus wires are done.
I always clean wheels of new diesels, particularly Athearn, but everybody's new diesels dirty my track.
The axle bearings need lubricated. I have a brand new Genesis GP-7 that was screeching on 34" radius. I lubed axle bearings and now it runs fine and matches other unit.
John
Are the headlights flickering? That would indicate power pickup issues. Clean wheels getting dirty right away is also a sign something isn't right with those locos. And I have to wonder if they don't have the same sort of power pickup issues my first Athearn RS3 had - you should be able to park one truck on a piece of paper and the loco should move fine, picking up from the other truck that is sitting on the rails.
Which trim are you adjusting? CV66 and CV95? If you aren;t using speed tables, those will do nothing. And remember that if one loco is facing backwards, it's the REVERSE trim, not forward trim, for that loco - as would be typical in an A-B-A consist with the two cabs facing opposite directions. But for 3 locos with the same decoders from the same manufacturer, you shouldn;t need to mess around with speed tables. Just adjust CV2 for start so they all start at the same speed (speed up the slowest one, since you can't make the one that starts the fastest any slower), and CV5 for top speed (if you cna run them wide open - in this case, adjust to slow down the faster ones, since you can't make the slowest one go any faster). Maybe CV6 for the mid point if they vary a lot in the mid range.
What are you cleaning the track with? Don't use things that leave residues, any arcing will turn it into all sorts of gunk, and don't use abrasives - it may all look shiny but even with fine grit abrasives, there will be microscopic pits in the rail head which will quickly collect any dirt.
I have multiple Bowser/Stewart locos, all converted to DCC, a couple with sound, and they have run perfectly fine from day 1. Both on DC before converting, and after installing the decoders. You can argue over the higher level of factory detailing of Gensis F units, but I'm in this to run trains - I can add more grabs and stuff to my Stewart Fs, and the other models like their Baldwin switchers are pretty highly detailed out of the box.