I just started to set up JMRI Operations and have run into a problem. I am not using to run trains but only create a manifest. I have been able to create a route and assemble a train. I am work on my second route and train. Here is the problem.
1. Train leaves Wolfcreek mine with four loaded ORE cars.
2. Arrives at Chama Interchange where there are 4 empty ORE cars on the siding.
Here is where the problem starts. Theses empty cars are supposed to be retunded to Wolfcreek Mine.
3. I am getting a messege that it can not put the loaded cars on the siding because there are cars there and not enough room. It needs to pull the cars off the siding and then put the new cars in.
What am I doing wrong?
I've never ran a layout using computer programs, JMRI, and such, so you either unplug the technical stuff and do it the way a real railroad would do it, OR the way your JMRI says, couple to the empties with the train of loaded cars, pull the empties out, park them on the main, and then shove the full cars into the siding.
And if your computer and JMRI don't like that, tell it to shut up and be quiet.
It's YOUR choice, YOUR railroad, not JMRI's
Is this like the talking HAL, in the movie: 2001: A Space Odyssey ?
Mike.
My You Tube
Thats what I do now with my own manifest. What is neat about JMRI is when you finish a session it will now remember where all the cars are and reshuffle the deck with different cars.
OK, well, what ever you like doing. I'm just a one man show, with a one man layout, no other operators, so I've never had a problem of remembering where cars are, as I can see them, and I've always "shuffled" my own deck as to what cars I need for the next switching ops.
Have fun!
You aren't doing anything wrong. That's the "normal" way Ops works.
But you want it to be more aggressive, pulling those cars first, then dropping the empties. So what you need to do is go into your build options and select "aggressive". That should get it to work the way you want.
More info here:
https://www.jmri.org/help/en/package/jmri/jmrit/operations/Operations.shtml#BuildOptions
Thanks. That should work. One question. Can you build one train aggresive an another Normal?
Harold
No. It is a global setting.
Colorado Front Range Railroad: http://www.coloradofrontrangerr.com/
wolfman hal Thanks. That should work. One question. Can you build one train aggresive an another Normal? Harold
Yes you can do it on a per train basis, but you have to set the global setting to aggressive, then "use normal mode when building" in the specific train options
So, what happens if you try to "disobey" JMRI, and do what you want, or need to do, does it shut the power down? display a huge flashing "ERROR" message?
I do use JMRI for decoders, never tried the operations thing.
mbinsewi So, what happens if you try to "disobey" JMRI, and do what you want, or need to do, does it shut the power down? display a huge flashing "ERROR" message? I do use JMRI for decoders, never tried the operations thing. Mike.
Here's the 10,000-foot "simplified" view, right from the JMRI Ops page:
<quote>
The JMRI Operations program allows you to create computer generated train Manifests for your railroad. A train Manifest details the work that a crew will perform during an operations session. The Manifest provides a list of car pick up and set outs and shows where the cars are located and where they should be eventually positioned on the railroad. The program allows you to enter a roster of cars and locomotives, define locations (stations) on the railroad, and routes for trains to travel. The car roster includes information about the car, including road, number, type of car, color, length, weight, load, date built, and owner. Trains are assigned routes that define locations or stations where cars can be picked up or set out. Features include the ability to control what car types, roads, and car loads a location or industry can service, the available track space for a location, and the maximum length the train can be between any two locations in the train's route.Locations can have spurs, yards, staging and classification/interchange tracks. Spurs are used to service industries, and can optionally have schedules assigned to them which allows for very fine control over car movement and loads. Trains can be configured to require a caboose or car with Flashing Rear End Device (FRED). The program generates Manifests for each train and switch lists for any location. A switch list for a location shows the work for all of the trains that will visit that location. The program can also place icons representing trains on a JMRI panel. The icon can be taught to move in the panel along with the train from location to location.
</quote>
If you "disobey" it, it won't do anything except build useless trains, because the cars it selects won't be at the locations it thinks they're at, and the space on a track it thinks is available is filled with the "wrong" cars, etc.
I use it, and really like it. The options make it easy to tailor it to exactly how you want it to work. The author frequents the JMRI list on groups.io and has been very willing to offer assistance and will sometimes even even modify the code to accommodate user requests as long as it doesn't negatively affect other users. And, it doesn't require the "rebalancing" that some other car-forwarding software seems to.
Since you already have JMRI, try the demo railroad included with Ops. It will give you an idea of what it can do, and if you "break" something in the demo files you can reset it and start again.
Thanks for the explanation. I have a small layout, and all of the industries I have, I can see, as I walk the front of the layout.
I know what plastic pellets cars I need when and where, along with the variety of cars I use at the food processing planr, and the trans loading are.
Thanks for the info, I think I'll just continue the way I am.
Tells you when you need a EOT device? That's pretty obvious.
It is pretty obvious where the EOT device belongs, but I don't think anyone yet has made an HO scale (or smaller) portable one(that works, anyway) - they are built in to the car, like the Ring one, or the Bachmann car that comes with one preinstalled. So slightly unprototypical, you have to put a specific car facing a specific way at the end of the train. If using a dummy one that just sits ont he coupler like a real one, I suppose there's no reason for the program to notify you of this, you know to stick it on the last car at the end of the train.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
mbinsewi Tells you when you need a EOT device? That's pretty obvious.
Yeah, that's pretty obvious, but it's not what was quoted - It says "Trains can be configured to require a caboose or car with Flashing Rear End Device (FRED)." (Emphasis added)
So when you build a train that requires one, Ops will add it. But whether the train requires one or not is entirely up to you. As I mentioned, there are lots of preferences you can set to customize Ops to your need/desires.
For example, on my layout trains require a caboose. But I have two different roads (one is a run-through layover) as well as transfer cabeese. So Ops not only picks a caboose, it picks the "right" caboose for each train.
Could I do that manually, or with car cards, or whatever? Of course! But a couple extra keystrokes when I set up Ops, and now it does it for me.
JMRI produces the railroad equivalent of what we used to call a "work order", which is the equivalent of a switch list for a local or industry job.
It won't produce a prototypical train list and it won't produce a prototypical yard switch list (but then there was only 1 model railroad program that I know of that did that and its developer has passed, so its unsupported freeware).
Having said that, if you want computer generated lists to switch your industries, its the best system I have seen or tried. And its free.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
Thanks guys, I could see where a switch list would be something different for my small ops., something to try.
Especially for the food plant, "Grandma Ginger's" Foods". There are hoppers for the mill ops, including incoming grain, and out going processed flour to other plants, sweetners, oil, and tomato paste, etc., in tank cars, and reefers for incoming gaylords of frozen fruits and vegies, and outbound package products.
The trans load area can get busy as well.
The plastic injection plant and the pulp wood landing are pretty straight forward.
I guess the only thing is, JMRI is on my laptop, up in my office, with the PR4 and test track for decoder work, and not connected to the layout.
Thanks again for the info guys!
mbinsewi I guess the only thing is, JMRI is on my laptop, up in my office, with the PR4 and test track for decoder work, and not connected to the layout. Thanks again for the info guys! Mike.
Doesn't matter, because Ops doesn't need a layout connection. Build and print your trains, then walk over to the layout with your paperwork in hand...
Ok
You seem to be well versed on JMRI. So I have another question?
Before JMRI one of my trains had a simple run as other trains were running ops. My layout is 10' x 16 ' so one train must be simple.
1. It started at with TWO loaded log cars at Mill Creek Lumber.
2. Went to Balwin Sawmill where there are TWO empty log cars.
It said to pull the two empties from Balwin and replace with the loaded car. This is correct.
But in the other example above it would not let me do that at the interchange with the ore cars. Setting is still on NORMAL. Does it have anythng to do with it is called an INTERCHANGE instead of a SPUR?
In the lumber example it is doing one other strange thing. It is supposed to return to Millcreek lumber with the empty cars. The Manafest routes the train for an additional PU and when it returns To Mill Creek it puts One of the empties at MILL CREEK LUMER ( Which is correct ) but spots the other empty at the Millcreek Spur next store. Will this correct itself on it's next run?
Thanks in Advance
wolfman hal Ok You seem to be well versed on JMRI. So I have another question? Before JMRI one of my trains had a simple run as other trains were running ops. My layout is 10' x 16 ' so one train must be simple. 1. It started at with TWO loaded log cars at Mill Creek Lumber. 2. Went to Balwin Sawmill where there are TWO empty log cars. It said to pull the two empties from Balwin and replace with the loaded car. This is correct. But in the other example above it would not let me do that at the interchange with the ore cars. Setting is still on NORMAL. Does it have anythng to do with it is called an INTERCHANGE instead of a SPUR? In the lumber example it is doing one other strange thing. It is supposed to return to Millcreek lumber with the empty cars. The Manafest routes the train for an additional PU and when it returns To Mill Creek it puts One of the empties at MILL CREEK LUMER ( Which is correct ) but spots the other empty at the Millcreek Spur next store. Will this correct itself on it's next run? Thanks in Advance Harold
I have Ops configured for my layout, and I've used several of the preferences/options to get to that point. But there's a lot of it I haven't used or experimented with, so I certainly wouldn't consider myself an expert.
That said, to answer your first question, yes, interchanges are treated differently than spurs. That's why Ops has different types of track designations. Each one has it's own use case, set of rules, etc. They're all described in the Help.
For your second question (Mill Creek vs Millcreek), I suspect it's because you've allowed off-spot cars in the same town. Or possibly you made the Milcreek Spur an alternate track for Mill Creek Lumber? Whether or not it "corrects itself" depends on why it placed the car there in the first place.
In either case, to see why Ops did or didn't do something, set your build report option to "Very Detailed", build your train, and examine that build report. It's in text format, so just do a "find" on the car number or location in question. It may be listed several times, so to see all the instances simply repeat the find until you reach the bottom of the buld report.
Makes sence. Tomorrow I will change the inerchange to a Spur. and see if that works. I think it will as the other Spurs are swaping cars. I will also remove Lumber car from the other Spur. If you would keep checking this tread I would appreciare it as I am sure I will have other question but I have not got the time to look all the time.
Thanks again
wolfman hal Makes sence. Tomorrow I will change the inerchange to a Spur. and see if that works. I think it will as the other Spurs are swaping cars. I will also remove Lumber car from the other Spur.
Makes sence. Tomorrow I will change the inerchange to a Spur. and see if that works. I think it will as the other Spurs are swaping cars. I will also remove Lumber car from the other Spur.
I would suggest that you read the Ops help sections describing the different track types and what the purpose/ability/restrictions are for each type.
wolfman hal If you would keep checking this tread I would appreciare it as I am sure I will have other question but I have not got the time to look all the time. Thanks again Harold
If you would keep checking this tread I would appreciare it as I am sure I will have other question but I have not got the time to look all the time.
A much better option would be for you to join the jmriusers list on groups.io and post your Ops questions there. Folks with way more experience with and knowledge of Ops than I have, including the developer who writes the code, hang out there and can give you authoritative answers.
I set up and joined the JMRI forum. One problem is that I can not find a way to post my problem. I have gone over every page and help with no results.
Can you direct me to how to post?
Thanks in advance
Harold, I am in this group, look at the column of topics on the left. The 5th one down, click on "New Topic".
Mike
The column on the left only has
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Is this because I am subscribed but not paying a premium.
Maybe you didn't really join or the membership didn't get approved for some reason
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
Thanks Guys
I found out what I was doing wrong and now I am in business. It had to get Moderator approval. Thanks again