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Posted by SouthPenn on Saturday, September 7, 2019 3:25 PM

Paul3: "South Penn, Why would switches not be "wired properly" affect MU'ing?"

That was not a very good explanation of my switch problems. The switches I bought were Shinohara power routing switches. They were used but cheap. The first problem I had was the small copper tab on the points that was supposed to make contact with the rails to make electrical contact. They were bent and some looked like accordions. Getting these to work was a real pain. To get the points off the switch you had to drill out a small rivet in the throw bar. If the copper was mangled up too bad, trying to fix it was an exercise in futility. Some of the switches developed problems with the hinge on the points. The points were connected to the switch with a rail connector. Over time these came loose and continuity suffered. This problem was intermittent and caused some real headaches. On some switches, I soldered the rail connectors on the points.

All of the switches were code 100 and not DCC friendly. Double crossovers were particularly troublesome.

 

Most of my engines are Stewart 'F' units with Kato drives. They are short enough that they would stop while going through a malfunctioning switch. This happened with DC, DCC, or RailPro. 

I replaced most of those switches with Peco. 

South Penn
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Posted by SouthPenn on Saturday, September 7, 2019 12:14 PM

The RailPro power supplies can be used as a repeater. You can turn the repeater function on & off from the hand controller. You can also shut the power supply off from the hand controllers too. The E-Stop function on the hand controller can either send zero speed commands to all RailPro engines or shut off the power supplies. A handy feature if you are running DCC and RailPro presuming you are using a RailPro power supply for the DCC. 

The latest RailPro decoders can be controlled from a DCC hand controller. The only reason I can think of that would be useful is having more than one operator on a small layout. I only have one DCC hand controller and one RailPro controller. If I had a second operator they could run RailPro or DCC. 

South Penn
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Posted by SPSOT fan on Thursday, September 5, 2019 12:58 PM

Yes, I think RailPro can use any filter power supply. I’d guess same voltage as regular DCC would be ideal. The advantage of the RailPro power supply is you can monitor it from your throttle and other stuff I really son’t know about. Still I suppose it would be cheaper to just use another power supply.

Regards, Isaac

I model my railroad and you model yours! I model my way and you model yours!

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Posted by rrinker on Thursday, September 5, 2019 11:31 AM

 Exactly. Although since they support using the RailPro receivers on track powered by DCC, it can't be THAT picky about the power coming in. Ring's power supplies are not cheap, but they are more than just a filtered power supply. Ones like yours are common - I'll be needing a few just for my layout lighting which will be LED strips.

                                 --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by ATLANTIC CENTRAL on Thursday, September 5, 2019 7:43 AM

rrinker

 Ring themselves sell high current DC power supplies to power the layout (which also seem to act as radio repeaters - which if you distribute your power around the layout instead of clustering all power supplies in one place actually makes that a bit of clever design, because if your room is big enough to need multiple power supplies, then you are likely to also need radio repeaters to get complete coverage). They may not want you to run off the output of an old power pack, because of pulse power, not clean filtered DC, and general relatively low power, but high current clean DC power supplies are quite common these days, if you don;t need the Ring ones with radio repeaters and status readback.

                                    --Randy

 

 

I used filtered, regulated, pure DC power supplies with my Aristo Train Engineer Throttles. They were not expensive at all.

Should be fine for RailPro.

Sheldon

    

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Posted by rrinker on Thursday, September 5, 2019 7:21 AM

 Ring themselves sell high current DC power supplies to power the layout (which also seem to act as radio repeaters - which if you distribute your power around the layout instead of clustering all power supplies in one place actually makes that a bit of clever design, because if your room is big enough to need multiple power supplies, then you are likely to also need radio repeaters to get complete coverage). They may not want you to run off the output of an old power pack, because of pulse power, not clean filtered DC, and general relatively low power, but high current clean DC power supplies are quite common these days, if you don;t need the Ring ones with radio repeaters and status readback.

                                    --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by SPSOT fan on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 10:48 PM

rrinker

 What would be the point of installing DCC only to run all your locos with Railpro? A plain DC power supply to provide constant voltage on the rails is far less expensive than a DCC system putting a DCC signal on the track which isn't going to be used for anything except maybe the occasional visitor.

 Hopefully the DCC compatibility of the RailPro receiver is better than MTH's idea of DCC compatibility. But that points out again a feature of two of the competing direct radio systems, in that they not only use DCC protocol, they use whatever DCC decoder you already have in the loco and simply add a direct radio (with option for dead rail) to the loco.

I believe RailPro says it is a bad idea to run RailPro on a DC power pack for long periods of time. Something about the power not being pure or constant or something. Using DCC components would allow flexibility for other operators and visitors regarding what can be run.

I don’t really think any serious RailPro users make use of the switch to DCC capability. It’s really built in as more of a backup incase Ring Engineering goes out of business.

Regards, Isaac

I model my railroad and you model yours! I model my way and you model yours!

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Posted by wp8thsub on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 9:33 PM

rrinker
Though - are any large clubs using RailPro? Or truly large home layouts, ones that host a lot of operators at a time, like Tony Koester's NKP or a really huge one like Ken McCorry's?

I'm aware of only one large layout using Railpro - Lee Nicholas' Utah Colorado Western.

Incidentally, I ran once at Ken McCorry's when he still had Digitrax, and remember the radio throttles losing control, and other performance issues.  It was one factor in me choosing to go with NCE instead.

Rob Spangler

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Posted by ATLANTIC CENTRAL on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 8:56 PM

OK, agreed, simple motion only decoders are less than $20, I am onboard with that. Please understand that my really serious research was 24 years ago. Only occasionally have glanced around to see what's "new" in DCC.

But even a $16 decoder is a big investment in a loco you only paid $39 for Big Smile

And for the record, my "universal" relay is a 24VDC 4PDT 5amp ice cube at a dollar cost average investment of $1.50

And I don't think I rail against DCC, I rail against the idea that one size fits all needs........after all, I do say rather often, "if you want sound, you need DCC".

So was able to unpack a few boxes and check a few locos, and yes, many but not all the blue box locos have 8 pin plugs. It's hard to remember all this stuff.......

Sheldon

 

    

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Posted by Paul3 on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 8:30 PM

Sheldon,
I researched the Internet Wayback machine (and eBay) and found out the following:

The first P2K engines were in gold boxes: the BL2 (1989), FA-2/FB-2 (1990-91) and GP18 (1992-93), after which they coverted to the blue box.  I thought that the gold boxes continued for the E8's and SD9's, but I was wrong.

The first blue box P2K was the E8A/E8B (1994-95) and they did not have DCC plugs.  Nor did the first SW900/1200 (1995-96), also in the P2K blue box. 

But the P2K blue box SD7's (1995) and SD9's (1996) do have DCC plugs, along with the E7A/E7B (1996), GP9 (1997), PA/PB (1997), GP20 (1998), and so on.

So it wasn't the first "several" runs of P2K blue box that didn't have DCC plugs, just two runs.

https://web.archive.org/web/20040203190507/http://www.lifelikeproducts.com/proto/olderlocos.htm

And yes, we get it.  You're never going DCC.  I don't care about that.  What I do care about is getting the facts right.  Rail against DCC all you like, but do it with the correct facts and figures, please.

Let me put it in a way that would apply to your situation.  Imagine if someone said they'd never go for an DC analog system like you have because relays cost 2 to 3 times more than you know they actually do.  Not only that, they say that the relays they are pricing are far in excess of what you know is actually needed.  Say, instead of quoting 12VDC SPDT 3amp types that you know is all you need, they're quoting 110VAC 4PDT 20amp types.  Sort of like swatting a fly with a Buick.

Just because you saw a lot of motion-only decoders for more than $16 doesn't mean that one has to purchase them.  If one wants to save a few bucks, one can hardwire them in with the $16 version vs. buying a form factor type that clicks in place.  Some people are willing to pay for the simplicity of a quick install vs. getting out the soldering iron.

The typical price for a decoder is for the most popular one, which in your case (as in mine) would be the motion-only, headlight-only decoder of the under-$20 type (I don't do ditchlights or beacons either).  In the future, please use $16 per decoder for your 140 engines, or at least $20.  $2240-$2800 is still a chunk of money and can be prohibitive to many.  There's no reason to make it $4900.

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Posted by ATLANTIC CENTRAL on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 2:32 PM

Paul3

Sheldon,
"Ever changing"?  They've been $16 for over 20 years!  Seriously, the first $20 decoder (available at 20% off = $16), the Digitax DH120, was retired in 1998.  And goodness knows you and I have had more than one discussion about the cost of DCC decoders here.  Smile, Wink & Grin

And P2K drop in decoders?  Um, most if not all P2K's since the mid-1990's have had 8-pin DCC sockets.  They don't require board replacement decoders.  The only ones that don't have sockets are the old "gold box" P2K's like the original runs of the BL2, FA-2/FB-2, GP18, SD9, and E8A (AFAIK).  Everything in a blue-gray P2K box (and later) has a plug.

 

Actually no, the first several runs of Blue Box Proto (early 90's I guess) did not all have 8 pin sockets....trust me I have stacks of them.

And if I was going to go DCC I would likely pull the boards and hard wire them, but again, work I am not motivated to do.

I looked at DCC long and hard, twice, a pretty good while ago. For me it simply does not add enough to justify the cost. I have radio throttles, I have CTC and signals. DCC does not really make any of that easier or better.

$16 or $25 or $35, more than I want to spend, along with 8-10 throttles, radio base stations, reversers, boosters, command station, etc.

The stuff I have is paid for and works fine for my goals.......

Sheldon

PS - I just did some quick decoder shopping at TrainWorld, and I saw a lot of motion only decoders that were a bit more than $16, but all were in that $15 to $35 range.

Why one decoder would be used over another obviously is based on a number of factors that I have no interest sorting out right now. But it clearly appears that $25 or $35 is a pretty typical price in many cases.

    

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Posted by Paul3 on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 1:49 PM

Sheldon,
"Ever changing"?  They've been $16 for over 20 years!  Seriously, the first $20 decoder (available at 20% off = $16), the Digitax DH120, was retired in 1998.  And goodness knows you and I have had more than one discussion about the cost of DCC decoders here.  Smile, Wink & Grin

And P2K drop in decoders?  Um, most if not all P2K's since the mid-1990's have had 8-pin DCC sockets.  They don't require board replacement decoders.  The only ones that don't have sockets are the old "gold box" P2K's like the original runs of the BL2, FA-2/FB-2, GP18, SD9, and E8A (AFAIK).  Everything in a blue-gray P2K box (and later) has a plug.

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Posted by rrinker on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 10:31 AM

 What would be the point of installing DCC only to run all your locos with Railpro? A plain DC power supply to provide constant voltage on the rails is far less expensive than a DCC system putting a DCC signal on the track which isn't going to be used for anything except maybe the occasional visitor.

 Hopefully the DCC compatibility of the RailPro receiver is better than MTH's idea of DCC compatibility. But that points out again a feature of two of the competing direct radio systems, in that they not only use DCC protocol, they use whatever DCC decoder you already have in the loco and simply add a direct radio (with option for dead rail) to the loco. 

                                --Randy

 

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by ATLANTIC CENTRAL on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 10:24 AM

SPSOT fan

 

 
rrinker
 

 I was specifically referring to the club I belong to, not any club. And I don;t have any keep alives now, don't need them, and don't plan to start needing them any time soon. My home layouts have always run just fine, no stalls. 

Though - are any large clubs using RailPro? Or truly large home layouts, ones that host a lot of operators at a time, like Tony Koester's NKP or a really huge one like Ken McCorry's?  

 

 

I think that the prospect of a club exclusively using RailPro is a bit ridiculous as it limits what people can do. The beauty of RailPro is you can use it on any DCC layout as well.

For similar reasons I think people would chose to use a DCC system with RailPro locomotives on a big layout as it will allow visitors to use standard DCC locomotives. The only RailPro user I know has a small layout but brings his locos to the big layout of other and runs on straight DCC.

Personally if I went with RailPro I would use DCC power and RailPro locos/throttles to allow for more flexibility. It is important to note that RailPro decoder can act as regular DCC decoders after a quick setting change using the RailPro throttle.

 

No, you can, as explained earlier, my OCD perfectionism would simply not allow two different control systems on my layout.

And clubs just don't interest me other than to visit as a guest...

Sheldon

    

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Posted by SPSOT fan on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 10:21 AM

rrinker
 

 I was specifically referring to the club I belong to, not any club. And I don;t have any keep alives now, don't need them, and don't plan to start needing them any time soon. My home layouts have always run just fine, no stalls. 

Though - are any large clubs using RailPro? Or truly large home layouts, ones that host a lot of operators at a time, like Tony Koester's NKP or a really huge one like Ken McCorry's?  

I think that the prospect of a club exclusively using RailPro is a bit ridiculous as it limits what people can do. The beauty of RailPro is you can use it on any DCC layout as well.

For similar reasons I think people would chose to use a DCC system with RailPro locomotives on a big layout as it will allow visitors to use standard DCC locomotives. The only RailPro user I know has a small layout but brings his locos to the big layout of other and runs on straight DCC.

Personally if I went with RailPro I would use DCC power and RailPro locos/throttles to allow for more flexibility. It is important to note that RailPro decoder can act as regular DCC decoders after a quick setting change using the RailPro throttle.

Regards, Isaac

I model my railroad and you model yours! I model my way and you model yours!

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Posted by ATLANTIC CENTRAL on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 10:21 AM

Yes, Ken's layout will leave you speechless. It's like Disney World, hard to explain the size and scope to someone who has not seen it.

Sheldon

    

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Posted by rrinker on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 9:42 AM

 Ken's the one I was referring to about stessing systems - the original NCE radio was inadequate, so he went Digitrax but the 120 slot limit was a problem, but then NCE improved the radios and now NCE radio works fine. And Digtrax has released a new system with a 240 loco limit - certainly because someone requested the capability, not just to do it with no prospect of sales. 

 I managed to remember to go visit during one of the open houses. That time is coming up again. After all these years of not being all that far away, I finally remembered to head down that way and hit up a few layouts, including Ken's. As soon as I entered the layout area, I was pretty much speechless. Never saw something that big, done as a realistic layout. Not sure any of the public displays I've been to are as big as his layout.

                                                --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by ATLANTIC CENTRAL on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 8:20 AM

rrinker

 

 
SPSOT fan

 

 
rrinker

That all locos in consist stop when one stalls means Railpro would be useless on our club modular layout.

 

 

I would disagree with Randy on this issue. All locos stop only if the lead loco stops. So only one loco in the consist in theory needs to be a really good runner (i.e. Keep-Alive installed) and that loco can be used as the lead unit.

I wouldn‘t decribe RailPro as useless for a club application, the beauty of RailPro is you can use it on a DCC system without changing anything with the DCC system.

 

 

 

 I was specifically referring to the club I belong to, not any club. And I don;t have any keep alives now, don't need them, and don't plan to start needing them any time soon. My home layouts have always run just fine, no stalls. 

Though - are any large clubs using RailPro? Or truly large home layouts, ones that host a lot of operators at a time, like Tony Koester's NKP or a really huge one like Ken McCorry's? 

                           --Randy

 

 

I've been to Ken's, RailPro does not have a shot........

Sheldon

    

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Posted by rrinker on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 7:39 AM

SPSOT fan

 

 
rrinker

That all locos in consist stop when one stalls means Railpro would be useless on our club modular layout.

 

 

I would disagree with Randy on this issue. All locos stop only if the lead loco stops. So only one loco in the consist in theory needs to be a really good runner (i.e. Keep-Alive installed) and that loco can be used as the lead unit.

I wouldn‘t decribe RailPro as useless for a club application, the beauty of RailPro is you can use it on a DCC system without changing anything with the DCC system.

 

 I was specifically referring to the club I belong to, not any club. And I don;t have any keep alives now, don't need them, and don't plan to start needing them any time soon. My home layouts have always run just fine, no stalls. 

Though - are any large clubs using RailPro? Or truly large home layouts, ones that host a lot of operators at a time, like Tony Koester's NKP or a really huge one like Ken McCorry's? 

                           --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by ATLANTIC CENTRAL on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 5:29 AM

Paul, admittedly I don't keep up with the ever falling/changing street prices of motor only DCC decoders.

Last time I did, drop in decoders for my older Proto2000 locos that make up almost half my fleet were in that $35 range.

And as you said, I have a number of reasons for not being interested in any change. The biggest being time and money. It would take a lot of time and a fair amount of money for very small gains in operational flexibility.

And it would add operational complexity I don't need or want for my operational style and goals.

And I do really dislike the ergonomics of most of the DCC throttles out there. I have used DCC a lot, some aspects of it are very nice at times, and some aspects can be annoying at times.

Call me a little OCD, but the idea of having two different throttle systems, like DCC and Railpro, on the same layout, is simply a non starter for me.

Sheldon 

    

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Posted by SPSOT fan on Wednesday, September 4, 2019 3:08 AM

rrinker

That all locos in consist stop when one stalls means Railpro would be useless on our club modular layout.

I would disagree with Randy on this issue. All locos stop only if the lead loco stops. So only one loco in the consist in theory needs to be a really good runner (i.e. Keep-Alive installed) and that loco can be used as the lead unit.

I wouldn‘t decribe RailPro as useless for a club application, the beauty of RailPro is you can use it on a DCC system without changing anything with the DCC system.

Regards, Isaac

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Posted by Paul3 on Tuesday, September 3, 2019 11:51 PM

Sheldon,
Sigh  You always inflate the cost of DCC decoders to unrealistic levels.

DCC decoders, without sound, that don't do beacons, ditchlights, or anything other than headlights and motion, are $16 each not $35.  That's $2660 more than what you stated for your 140 engines. 

Your reasons for not going DCC are your own (and you know that's fine with me), but let's keep the facts correct.

South Penn,
Why would switches not being "wired properly" affect MU'ing?

No, you don't have to send in your DCC throttle for software upgrades.  Hardware upgrades, yes, send that in.  But software is done through the computer at home.

My club runs more than 50 engines during a session, but then we're halfway into filling a 6300+ sq. ft. room.  We currently run just over 30 trains in two hours (plus 8 local freights and 3 yards) with up to 20 people.  Each mainline train can have 1 to 4 engines each, depending on the train.  www.ssmrc.org

As for my opinion on RailPro, I think it makes a great addition to an existing DC or DCC layout.  If I had some spare cash laying around, I'd probably get a throttle and equip a number of locos just to run them around my club's layout without having to rely on our DCC system's sometimes wonky command station.

 

 

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Posted by ATLANTIC CENTRAL on Sunday, September 1, 2019 5:46 PM

Again, I like the idea of direct radio.

And RailPro appears to do that as well or better than anyone.

I have long been a vocal supporter of the idea that one size does not fit all. DCC is perfect for many situations, well designed DC systems can rival most of the features of DCC, sometimes for less money, and RailPro has some features that should make it very attractive to many.

RailPro looks like a potential good fit for a lot modelers. It clearly appeals to small or medium layouts with a focus on "being the engineer", maybe even more so, or better than many DCC throttles.

But after watching a few videos myself, my original reaction years ago, and my recent reaction, stands - it would not be a good fit for my layout.

The cost of receivers alone is way more than DCC decoders would cost for my loco fleet - even without sound, 140 locos x $60 = $8,400. $60 is more than I paid for many of my locos, and trust me, they all run very nice and are well detailed stuff made in the last 20-25 years or so.

And any idea of partial or gradual conversion would not be compatible with my operational goals for the layout. As explained earlier, all 140 powered units are necessary for the operation of the layout.

The cost of throttles would be staggering as well. I currently use 10 Aristo wireless Train Engineer throttles purchased for about $120 each. 10 RailPro throttles = $3,000 - We have now reached the price of a good used car to convert my layout to RailPro, or DCC........

The simple task of finding one of my thirty pre-staged trains is more difficult with RailPro than with my DC system. All I have to do is know what track the train is on, and push one button that corresponds to the throttle in my hand. Yes, that button is on a control panel, a control panel that is right there where the train is parked......just one button, no list to scroll thru, no multi number sequence to enter...... 

I model the 50's, no ditch lights, etc. But my lights come on full brightness before my trains move with my Aristo wireless throttles - with no seperate action on my part.

Sound - RailPro or DCC, I'm just not interested. I get that others are, glad they are having fun. My HiFi trained ears identify locomotive sounds coming out of 1" speakers as white noise static.........

Touch screens - they don't like me, and I don't like them. I don't own a smart phone, I still have a flip phone - and a tablet, so the touch screen buttons are big enough......and I still have trouble.

I think my comments in my first post are valid - how big a layout do you want to have?, how many locos? - these factors will drive the effectiveness of RailPro on any given layout. 

A room sized layout with 15-20 locos, it might well be better, easier and no more expensive than DCC. But bigger than that, the advantages start to fade.......

And as was explained by several people, lots of modelers/clubs/groups have 50, or 100, locos in play during a single operating session.

Sheldon

 

    

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Posted by SouthPenn on Sunday, September 1, 2019 12:03 PM

I don't have any Keep Alives in any of my engines. I fixed the track.

There is a speed indicator on the selected engine page. It's in the upper right corner and reads out in percentage. No scale MPH that I am aware of. Motor RPM can be calculated but the gear ratio and wheel size would be problematic.

I hold the RailPro in my left hand and turn the throttle knob with my thumb. It would be nice to have a serrated knob.  

South Penn
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Posted by rrinker on Sunday, September 1, 2019 10:33 AM

 AFter watching some of the videos that show an actual person holding the throttle - ok, it's not tooo big. But, the knob is still on the bottom, which makes one handed operation next to impossible, and since it DOES fit in your hand, the screen is rather tiny for a touch screen - watching the demo where they show pressing the buttons to start the bell and blow the horn, yeah, I'd be hitting two of those things at the same time.

 I do give a chuckle that the icon for the slow speed boost option in the motor settings is a boot to the behind of a turtle.

 I have no keep alives in any of my DCC locos, and they don;t stal - keep the track clean. That all locos in consist stop when one stalls means Railpro would be useless on our club modular layout. The older parts of it use short pieces of track to connect the modules (newer ones just butt right up to the edge) and despite replacing the joiners every few times, these cause dead spots between modules. Even short trains run with at least 2 locos, simply so that one can push the other past the dead spot, which usually happens without a hiccup other than the lead unit's headlight blinking. It's why I will never buy another MTH HO loco, they go totally silent after a stutter, and the trailing units ina  consist usually do not lose power on these short sections, so now my A unit is quiet and the B unit is still making noise. Despite the function still being on that turns on the sound. Hitting it starts the sound in the A unit, but shits off the B unit. That's an MTH issue, not a DCC issues, they chose to respond to the state change of the function rather than the absolute state for some reason knowable only to MTH. 

 There are good things about Railpro. There are bad things aboit Railpro. I would say it's far from an ideal system, simply because everythign except speed is on a touch screen. The ergoonomics need some work, at least for anyone who wants to truly do operations, and there are MANY DCC systems you could buy, along with decoders for several locos, for the price of Railpro's starter set. And it remains a single vendor system, following no standards, so you are locked in - that is still the single biggest negative. While DCC throttles with only a few exceptions are a single vendor lock as well, there is already a defacto wireless standard used in JMRI, and by direct interface (no computer needed) devices from MRC, Digitrax, and ESU (maybe more), and the forthcoming TCS system throttles will also speak this protocol. So in addition to smart devices beiung used as throttles, those who are not fans of touch screens will also have choices in throttles that work with any DCC system. So now the loco side of DCC as well as the user interface side has choices, not single vendor lock in.

                                   --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

  • Member since
    March 2015
  • 1,358 posts
Posted by SouthPenn on Sunday, September 1, 2019 10:09 AM

I run DCC and RailPro at the same time on my layout. And so far I have not retrofitted any DCC engines to RailPro. But that will probably change. It's only installed in engines that were DC only and never upgraded, or new purchases. 

Here is a write up on installing Keep Alive on RailPro engines. Also, the [forum name and link removed by moderator] has lots of information on it.

RailPro is susceptible to dirty and bad track too. I replaced some very old switches that were used when I installed them. I went with Peco switches that have spring-loaded points and double-checked all switches to make sure they were wired properly. I also applied graphite to the rails.

South Penn
  • Member since
    April 2019
  • From: Pacific Northwest
  • 780 posts
Posted by SPSOT fan on Sunday, September 1, 2019 12:40 AM

I am convinced RailPro is the ideal system!

It is very simple, easy to use, espesially when it comes to consisting locos. It's no more expensive than any basic DCC system. It allows for deadrail operations should you wish. And it can be used along side any DCC system.

I also really like the sound of the USB stick they sell that allows a computer to act as a throttle. That's a great way to get into RailPro for less!

It does have the disadvantages nothing comes ready to run with railpro, though any modelers with large fleets with need to spend alot of money and time to convert to it.

This summer I visited a friends layout at the same time as another friend who is a railpro user. We held something like an improptu operating sesion, I ran regular Digitrax DCC while he ran RailPro. There are a few things I noticed.

First the RailPro engines where equally affected by dirty track and shorts as DCC engines. The Ring Engineering promotional material gives the impresion that direct radio control is more resistant to poor conductivity, but that's not true. I noticed Keep Alive equiped locos ran best, so I recommend the OP use them.

Also when a lead engine stoped due to dirty track all the engines in the consist and stop due and don't push the lead engine past the dead spot. Again another reason to add keep-alives.

Final issue I have is the decoders are to big for n scale. I am in N so that means I will not be able to use RailPro till newer, smaller RailPro receivers are made, or I get enough space to do HO again.

For these reasons, and because I have small layouts, I personnally use plain DC in N and HO scales.

Nonetheless I still like the look of RailPro and intend to use it if possible in place of DCC should I ever wish to upgrade my fleets.

Regards, Isaac

I model my railroad and you model yours! I model my way and you model yours!

  • Member since
    March 2018
  • 688 posts
Posted by BNSF UP and others modeler on Saturday, August 31, 2019 5:46 PM

SouthPenn

The handheld controller is configurable. Buttons can be added or moved. Buttons can be programmed for different outputs. Using a small glass relay I interfaced the RailPro controller to operate my DCC switch controllers. I programmed a button on the RailPro controller to operate the relay which operated the switch controller. I even used a first-generation RailPro decoder to operate a DCC switch controller. Can a DCC hand controller change the headlight intensity on the fly? RailPro can. Can you set the accel, deceleration, and top speed on the fly? RailPro can. Do you get voltage, current, and motor temperature feedback from DCC?  RailPro does.

As Tstage said, you actually CAN do all of that. You can change the NCE cab params to show track voltage, and if you want cute little pictures of your locomotives, you can just download engine driver or Withrottle and slap images on there.

I have had a chance to test the railpro system on someone's garden layout. Not overly impressed with the controller, however, I did like the concept of radio control. The touch screen isn't very good, it should behave more like phone and tablet touch screens. The throttle is too bulky. There are not many sound functions. The steam loco sounds are cheesy. You have to charge the controller as well as the locomotives. And the throttle knob was at the bottom, which I think is obnoxious. So bottom line, if you run large scale layouts and you don't want to change the steam loco sounds because you are happy with the stock ones, have a lot of money, and you have butter fingers that like bulky throttles, this system is probably the way to go.

Just my My 2 Cents.

I'm beginning to realize that Windows 10 and sound decoders have a lot in common. There are so many things you have to change in order to get them to work the way you want.

  • Member since
    June 2014
  • From: Ohio
  • 231 posts
Posted by josephbw on Saturday, August 31, 2019 5:41 PM

I've had RailPro for several years. It answers all the questions that you have about DCC and does it much easier.

The downfall for me is that RP's website will not support downloads if you have a satellite internet connection. Otherwise it is a very good system and is much easier to learn than DCC.

They have also come out with many new engine sounds that are state of the art, BUT I can't access them. Angry

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