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DCC Specilaties PSX-AR and PSX1

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DCC Specilaties PSX-AR and PSX1
Posted by WardR on Monday, March 11, 2019 11:31 PM

 

Hello, I have 5 Power districts that use Power shield circuit breakers, I also have 3 reverse loop areas that use psx ar. When I test the short each area blinks and responds to the short, however if the short is more than a second my entire system goes off. Shouldn’t just each area short and the rest stay on? I checked my power blocks and they seem fine, I can verify that by the short test but only if I short it very fast I see the light on each breaker flip anything more that a second everything shorts all bds. Hopefully you have an idea why this maybe happening, I use MRC system elite.

Thanks,

Ward

 

 

Thank you,

 

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Posted by MisterBeasley on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 10:35 AM

You should be able to adjust the trip current of each device independently.  If they are too high, the base station's breaker will go first.

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Posted by ROBERT PETRICK on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 11:53 AM

A short in a reversing section isn't really a short in the conventional sense, but rather it is a signal to the system to reverse polarity.

If there really is a short (such as when a screwdriver or pair of pliers is left on the rails), then I should think shutting down the system is a good thing.

But in your case, maybe checking the trip setting will clear things up.

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Posted by selector on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 12:02 PM

ROBERT PETRICK

A short in a reversing section isn't really a short in the conventional sense, but rather it is a signal to the system to reverse polarity.

If there really is a short (such as when a screwdriver or pair of pliers is left on the rails), then I should think shutting down the system is a good thing.

But in your case, maybe checking the trip setting will clear things up.

 

Agreed.  If there is a true short, a protracted and uncorrected one, the 'protection' circuitry will act...not the 'reversing' circuitry.  As far as I understand, the PSX is a detector and reverser to avoid conflicts, but after that correction, the short is still in place and the circuit protector acts.

If you want power or protected 'districts', then you need to wire a protection device in series off the main bus serving a separate/isolated length of track, even it's a loop.

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Posted by BigDaddy on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 3:16 PM

Is he saying that a short in any power district or reversing section shuts down the whole system or just the reversing sections?

Henry

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Posted by carl425 on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 3:49 PM

The PSX-AR is BOTH an auto reverser and a circuit breaker.

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Posted by floridaflyer on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 4:16 PM

What Misterbeasley and Carl said

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Posted by WardR on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 6:10 PM

 

That makes sense, all my reverse loops and power districts are blocked. All of my psx-ar and power shields are not daisy chained, they all have a direct feed line from a power strip directly off the bus. if i take a coin and short out each section and Im fats  i see the short light go out on each board and I test each one, If I hold the short on any one of them for more than a second everything goes to short all boards and my base station. I did notice that all the bds show a fast red led short when i short out each section, however the reverse psx don’t show that they immediately trip the whole system. It does seem like a timing thing.

 

 

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Posted by WardR on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 6:10 PM

That is correct

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Posted by WardR on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 6:13 PM

A short on any section, reverse loops and also reg blocks. if i short out any section i get a fast flash on that led to indicate a short, if I stop the short fast enough the one bd is onyl effected, however if I keep that short for a second the entire system shorts, all psx ar and power sheilds and base unit. 

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Posted by WardR on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 6:16 PM

 

The PSX ar is both a power shield and a reversing unit in one. As for the wiring I have every one of my power shields and psx ar on an isolated blocked sections. Each cable from each section goes to the psx -ar or power shield and from there each BD has a direct line to the main bus.

 

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Posted by BigDaddy on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 6:17 PM

The coin should be just placed on the track, not mashed down.

Henry

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Posted by Onewolf on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 6:41 PM

My layout has two PSX-AR and 4 PSX# with 14 power districts (16 total).  I do not see the behavior you are seeing.  If I create a short in one district none of the other districts are afflicted. 

The only problem with my layout related to the PSX-ARs is when sound locomotives enter/leave the PSX-AR blocks and polarity has to be flipped then sound locomotives completely stall/reset/restart. It's annoying, but I haven't had a chance to research/fix that issue.

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Posted by richhotrain on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 8:17 PM

WardR
 

That makes sense, all my reverse loops and power districts are blocked. All of my psx-ar and power shields are not daisy chained, they all have a direct feed line from a power strip directly off the bus. if i take a coin and short out each section and Im fats  i see the short light go out on each board and I test each one, If I hold the short on any one of them for more than a second everything goes to short all boards and my base station. I did notice that all the bds show a fast red led short when i short out each section, however the reverse psx don’t show that they immediately trip the whole system. It does seem like a timing thing. 

WardR

A short on any section, reverse loops and also reg blocks. if i short out any section i get a fast flash on that led to indicate a short, if I stop the short fast enough the one bd is onyl effected, however if I keep that short for a second the entire system shorts, all psx ar and power sheilds and base unit.  

That first quote tells me that you have wired all of the circuit boards correctly.  No PSX-ARs are wired downstream from any PSX circuit breakers. That is good.

That second quote does not seem accurate. Since all of the circuit boards are fed directly from the main bus, I doubt that all of the circuit boards are shorting out.

What I believe is happening is that you are overdoing the "quarter test" by holding it down long enough to shut down the booster. Put the coin aside for a moment and just run a locomotive through each of the reversing sections to verify that they are working correctly. Then, do the quarter test on each power district by laying the coin across both rails just long enough to trip the crcuit breaker.

Rich

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Posted by WardR on Tuesday, March 12, 2019 10:51 PM

 

Hi ,

 

 

 

Thank you everyone for all your input , I appreciate it!! Here’s an update. I went ahead and adjusted the power district as per tony train ex, I set cv- 55=1 and 65=120 and it seems to have allowed all my reg power shields to work right now, I can short it for a second and it does not short the whole system, it works quite well. As for the reverse loop the psx-ar they are still the same any short on any of the reverse loop sections instantly  trip the entire system, I’m literally shorting the section for a split second and it shorts. The trains run through the areas fine, for the exception of one loop where for some reason the engine stops for a second or 2 and then goes again, not sure why that’s happening, its weird one minute the train goes through fine the next pass stall again. I’m wondering what I have to set these things to have them work together, maybe I should default the psx-ar.  The reg power districts seem to be working good now with the delays set, but should I have set all of them, and at the same thing as per tony train exchange? I don’t know if the settings for a trip delay is the same cv on the psx-ar I am going to search for more information on that.it seems like it should all work fine, its quite simple.

 

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Posted by richhotrain on Wednesday, March 13, 2019 6:13 AM

Yes, definitely read through the PSX-AR manual which explains the behavior of PSX-AR units when used in conjunction with PSX circuit breakers.

I have four PSX circuit breakers and three PSX-AR reversers on my layout which is powered by an NCE 5 amp PH-Pro system. I have never had to mess with CV55 and CV65, so maybe that is simply required to be compatible with your command station and booster.

As I read the PSX-AR instructions, it seems that these CV adjustments should only be made on the PSX units. You do not want to program a delay in the response of a PSX-AR to a short.

It might be helpful to see a diagram of you track configuration and a photo of your wiring as it relates to the various PSX and PSX-AR boards.

Rich

Alton Junction

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Posted by richhotrain on Wednesday, March 13, 2019 6:23 AM

One other thing worth mentioning. 

Read page 6 of the PSX-AR manual about the trip current feature and consult the chart on page 16 for the trip current settings using CV49. You may need to experiment with the trip current adjustment (CV49) on the PSX-AR units.

Rich

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Posted by WardR on Wednesday, March 13, 2019 10:14 PM

I reste the psx ar back to defaults and than adjusted just the psx as suggested and that resolved ALL issues. prblem solved, thank you to everyone for your input!! and help!

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Posted by richhotrain on Thursday, March 14, 2019 4:41 AM

WardR

I reste the psx ar back to defaults and than adjusted just the psx as suggested and that resolved ALL issues. prblem solved, thank you to everyone for your input!! and help! 

Ward, glad to hear that you got that problem resolved. Normally, the PSX and PSX-AR units worked well together right out of the box without any CV adjustments. Other times, they take some fine tuning.

Rich

Alton Junction

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