Hi all,
I'm sure this has been addressed before, but what exactly gets tallied up to fill the Zephyr Xtra's 20 slots? I ask because I got this message a few days ago when re-addressing a new loco. I released all locks and consists with the CV command for the DCS51 to forget it all, and no problem.
But I have no clue how I tied up all 20 slots. Including my newest addition, my fleet is all of eight locomotives strong, and I've only ever universal consisted two of those (but possibly twice, once with each engine as lead). In addition, I have one 402D throttle.
It's been a while since grade school, but I'm pretty sure that adds up to considerably less than 20, assuming all consists and throttles eat up one slot in the Zephyr each. So what gives? Why the unexpected FuLL message?
Basically, a 'slot' is used up when you assign a locomotive to your throttle. That slot is cleared when you 'dispatch' it(remove it). Most folks get in trouble with the 'slot max' msg because they do not dispatch off of an address and after about 20 selections, they get the 'slot max' msg. Just remember to dispatch off of the engine number when you are through...
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
I think what's tripping me up is that I don't have 20 addresses to even select from, so something must be counted more than once. For instance, if I had an engine running on the Zephyr, then stole it with the 402D throttle, is that now being counted as two spots, one on each throttle? Even then, I might only barely have enough addresses to reach the 20 address limit, assuming I stole every locomotive and consist from the Zephyr, which I certainly did not do.
I do know I had a few mis-typed addresses over the last couple of months... entered 7965 instead of the actual address of 7956, that kind of thing. I suppose it's possible I had more typos than I thought? It definitely wouldn't have occurred to me to release a bogus address, and I can easily see half a dozen such addresses being punched in over the six months or so since doing a factory reset on the Zephyr.
Anyhow, I guess it's fairly moot, as I'm (trying) to integrate releasing addresses as part of my workflow (not entirely successfully, as I've not had enough equipment to even worry about it until recently, and there's 2 years of mental inertia to overcome). The FuLL message was just one of those head scratchers I can't quite find the logical explanation for, and that bugs me!
Keying the wrong address will do it, especially if what yoou do next is press the loco key and put in the cooorrect address.s The incorrect one is still in there taking up a slot.
Several things need to happen for a slot to go to a state where it can be reused. The speed has to be 0 - which means the throttle on the Zephyr has to be against the stop. Unless you have every loco set to actually move on step 1, the loco may be stopped and not moving but it's still on speed step 1 or 2. You can be doubly sure of this by setting the brake lever to the middle positon, not forward or reverse. Next, all functions need to be off - so if you brought the loco to a stop using the brakes on F7, F7 is probably still on. Turn off the headlights. Then, on the Zephyr, press Loco then Exit. If you do that every time, and you have less than 20 locos, you should never see a Full message.
Depending on how you do the consists, you could use more slots than locos. A consist can use the address of the lead loco, OR you can make up your own address to be the consist address. If you use the lead loco, and consist a second locooo, that's only 2 slots. But if you use a 'dummy' address as the consist address, then consist 2 locos, that's THREE slots used. If you don't break up the consist when done, that 'dummy' address keeps using a slot forever (or until you reset with the various OpSw settings).
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
So what happens if I try to release without turning all the functions off? Or alternatively, if there is a function button that is on but I don't know it, like the F2 bell on a loco without sound?
I was indeed curious about how consists mix into the slot count. So far, I've only tinkered with simple (universal?) consisting, with the consist using the lead engine's number. What would be the process to release the slot used by the "dummy" numbered advanced consisting? Break off the engines from the consist, then release the consist number?
If functions are on, the slot won't clear, so next time you select that loco, it will either use another slot or you will get a 'steal' indication. Steal actually means share, which is how you end up with the same loco on two throttles and it behaves like it is possessed. When two throttles control the same loco, especially if one is the Zephyr or a UT4 with a potentiometer, the loco will run to the speed you dialed up on the active throttle, then at some point change speed to whatever the other, maybe not even connected, throttle is set to, because it is in 2 slots, each with a different speed set, and as the system goes through the slots and generates DCC packets based on the slot data, on one it will be one speed, and the other may be a different speed. With the encoder throttles like a DT40x or DT500, it will just follow the last throttle change because the knob rotation is not proportional to the speed.
If you use a dummy number for a consist then yes, release the two locos from consist and then release the dummy number and that will clear all the slots used.
I've only ever seen FULL once, and that was because I was deliberately testing to see how many slots you actually get - on my original Zephyr it's supposed to be 10, but you doon;t get FULL until you try to enter 13 addresses - there's the base 10 plus one for each of the jump ports, so I got up to 12, and then when I tried to add one more it said FULL. Theoretically a Zephyr Xtra should be able to hit 22 unless they changes the way it handles the jump port connections.
SInce when? The FULL message or slot=max on a DT4x/DT5x throttles with other Digitrax systems is ALWAYS cause by improper dispatching of locos. It's perhaps easier to get on a Zephyr because it's easy to have the potentiometer throttle at something other than dead stop, with the DT throttles you can see you are at step 0, and also see that the functions are off. I've has an original Zephyr (12 slots instead of 22 like the Xtra) for 15 years and I've seen FULL exactly once - when I deliberately kept adding numbers to see if it was true and it had 12 and not the advertised 10 slots, and indeed it does - the extra 2 are for the jump ports. When I added the 13th unique address - FULL appeared as expected.
Whether or not it is Full or otherwise, it still behaves as if it is full when it flashed that message.... can't assign a new loco, etc. Ergo, it's full.
At any rate, I did the mass release thing, and paid better attention to what I was programming (and releasing) after that, and all was great. Zephyr has since passed along to the stepson's HO layout, and I upgraded to a Digitrax Evolution .... I forget how many slots it has, but no way should I fill those up anytime in the next century!
Yes, when it says FuLL it's full, what I was saying is this is the first I heard it does so for "no reason" other than all the slots being full.
The EVO has 100 slots. You CAN fill it up if you don't dispatch properly. People have gotten slot=max (which is the equivalent to the FuLL message on the Zephyr - with more than 4 characters you can use actual words) on the older DCS100 which had 120 slots (but only 22 unless you configured it for such - so sometimes that could be attributed to letting the battery go dead and having all the config revert to default).
Issues of this problem were well documented.Full on Zephyr Extra happening for no apparent reason even after doing a Sw 39 clear. Sw 36 only works on the old Zephyr. I believe at one time it was also documented on Youtube with an example.There is or was a gliche in the Zephyr. Steve............Dont forget on Z X there is no SW 36 the manual was wrong originally only a SW39.
I have a DCS51 with a DT402. When I "clear" a locomotive, I: depress the LOCO button, the number now flashes. Then I depress the DISPATCH button, then the EXIT button.
Even though I do this for each loco after use, I sometimes still get the FULL or SLOT MAX message. If this isn't the correct way to clear a loco, what is?
Oh, I occasionally purge he DCS using OpSw39
Terry
Inspired by Addiction
See more on my YouTube Channel
All functions must be off and the speed must be on step 0. Anything else and the loco is periodically refreshed because the command station thinks it is still being run. After all, why else would the speed be non-zero, or functions being used?
rrinker All functions must be off and the speed must be on step 0. Anything else and the loco is periodically refreshed because the command station thinks it is still being run. After all, why else would the speed be non-zero, or functions being used? --Randy
Yep.
Same thing happens with our club's DCS100 command station. It just takes a little longer to fill 120 slots. Op switch 36 closed is now part of the daily start up prodedure.
DCS51 does not have Op sw 36 so proper distpatching as Randy noted is the key to not getting the "Full" message. OPSW39 reset is the fix when the message is displayed. Alternately, the slots can be cleared using a computer and JMRI.
mfm37Alternately, the slots can be cleared using a computer and JMRI.
Monitor Loconet and Monitor Slots are two of the best tools a Digitrax user has in JMRI. Any time I want to check slots, diagnose a throttle or look up the status of Loconet these features are very handy.
I discovered that on several of my UT throttles the potentiometer does not "zero" when turned all the way down. A constant string of commands are sent unless you remember to place the reverser in the center-off position. A good habit to get in to.
Thank You, Ed
Yes, for both the UT throttles and the Zephyr's built in throttle - set the direction control to the center position, then you know for certain the loco is at step 0. It's a little harder to tell with these throttles if functions are turned on, especially if sometime while you were running the loco you accidently hit one that actually isn't used by that particular loco - the lights or bell on are pretty obvious, but say the loco ha sno sounds or lights accessed by pressing F7. You may have F7 on and never know it.