traindog Ok, I am using the NCE D13SRJ decoder going through a Athearn Genesis adapter board. The NCE decoder does have a variable setting for different light effects. I don't have, yet, any LED's to install, but would love to know what I might be running into when I do install some LED's. Do I need to get a Mars light module to get the right effect? This is the first F unit I am trying to get the Mars light working in. This one is sort of a guinea pig. The others will be done in a similar fashion. So far all I have done for lighting effects have been to install a strobe light device into some Athearn Ready to Roll units. All I had to do with that was to set up that CV for on/off. The only decoders I have worked with so far has been NCE DASR, D13SRJ, P2SKR, and some preinstalled Atlas decoders.
Ok, I am using the NCE D13SRJ decoder going through a Athearn Genesis adapter board. The NCE decoder does have a variable setting for different light effects.
I don't have, yet, any LED's to install, but would love to know what I might be running into when I do install some LED's.
Do I need to get a Mars light module to get the right effect?
This is the first F unit I am trying to get the Mars light working in. This one is sort of a guinea pig. The others will be done in a similar fashion.
So far all I have done for lighting effects have been to install a strobe light device into some Athearn Ready to Roll units. All I had to do with that was to set up that CV for on/off.
The only decoders I have worked with so far has been NCE DASR, D13SRJ, P2SKR, and some preinstalled Atlas decoders.
The Mars light on NCE decoders uses Output 3. The factory default setting is CV35-4. To replicate the rotating beacon, program CV122=9.
Rich
Alton Junction
You just need to set the CVs for Mars light effect, same as the strobe. NCE decoders run LEDs fine, but they do have a setting for that - if it's set for LEDs and you have an incandescent bulb hooked up, the effect will be poor. Depending on which output it's CV120 through CV123 (white, yellow, green, violet in that order). A value of 8 is a none-directional mars light for incandescent bulbs. For LEDs you add 128 to the value.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
If you think the factory dual filament bulm Mars effect is better than what you are getting with the decoder, then yes, some more work is needed. LEDs work well - but, and this is a big BUT - only if the decoder is designed to work with LEDs. Incandescent bulbs don't turn off instantly, they fade out as the filament cools. LEDs turn on and off instantly (or close enough, without getting into all sorts of technical mumbo jumbo that has no bearing on the discussion). As such, to make blinking and flashing effects, an incandescent bulb needs a different technique than an LED. The fading is built in to an incandescent bulb - you cn pretty much turn the power on and off at a set rate and get a decent looking blink, that looks right to the eye. Do that with an LED and you'll always know it's an LED. The fade in/fade out with the LED has to be generated as well as the blinking frequency. Some decoders do a betetr job with LEDs than others. Some actually have a CV setting to adjust to optimize the effects for LEDs or incandescent bulbs. For normal on/off headlights, it generally doesn't matter, but when you want to have a blinker like a Mars light or strobe, it does.
Now, that goes both ways - if you configure the decoder for LEDs but hook up an incandescent bulb, you will be very disappointed . So that may be why the Mars light with the incandescent bulbs doesn't look very good. I still say make it all LEDs, in the long run it will be betetr and they'll never burn out, but do take note of the decoder and if it has any light type setup options so that it is optimized to deliver the best possible effect.
hon30critter Mike: 5150WS6 You are correct sir and I knew all of that. I sincerely hope you didn't feel I was being condescending. That was absolutely not my intent. Its impossible to know what level of knowledge a poster has, and the forums do tend to cater to newcomers, so I have a bad habit of assuming that the OP's knowledge is limited. Dave
Mike:
5150WS6 You are correct sir and I knew all of that.
I sincerely hope you didn't feel I was being condescending. That was absolutely not my intent. Its impossible to know what level of knowledge a poster has, and the forums do tend to cater to newcomers, so I have a bad habit of assuming that the OP's knowledge is limited.
Dave
I am not sure who you are refering to in the above post, but I did not feel any condesending attitude!
I have been in the hobby for over 50 years, and I am a Life memeber in the NMRA, best $100 I ever spent! I am , however, new to DCC.
The reason I posted, was that I was not happy with the results that I had with the Mars light on the passenger Santa Fe F7, I had just converted to DCC. I have some Proto 2000 E units and PA's that have much better Mars light effects.
Part of the reason I want to convert to LED's is the fact that they last longer than regular bulbs. I have devoloped tremors, and the less I have to break into these units the better. I have devoloped some methods that help with steadying my hands, but for the most part my days of really fine model building are over.
I have been in this hobby a long time, and I am still learning new things, such as SMD diodes. I had no idea that these things exsisted until this past Trainfest!
So please keep the information coming!
Thanks,
Art
As for appearance, it all depends on the LEDs you use. Take Bachmann a few years ago as a (bad) example - the E33 electric came with a very bluish LED headlight, horribly wrong for the model and era - or any era, even the modern locos aren't that blue.
A proper golden white is slightly yellowish and perfect for steamers and first gen diesels. Some of them are made in such a way that it almost looks like a bulb inside a glass housing - a little dot of yellow inside clear shell. Just don't look TOO close, the dot is square. The tiny SMD ones are available in colors like this as well, coupled with the flicker effect most decoders have and they make a nice kerosene light.
richhotrainMaybe this was a test by Athearn Genesis that will cause them to eventually make a full fledged conversion to LEDs............or at least longer lasting incandescents.
Let's hope so!
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
hon30critter Rich: richhotrain In the same new product announcement, the other new locomotive introductions stated, "incandescent bulbs for realistic color and appearance". Darn, you burst my bubble! I guess it's true. Evolution takes a long time and many mistakes! Guess I can put away my wallet. All the best! Dave
Rich:
richhotrain In the same new product announcement, the other new locomotive introductions stated, "incandescent bulbs for realistic color and appearance".
Darn, you burst my bubble! I guess it's true. Evolution takes a long time and many mistakes!
Guess I can put away my wallet.
All the best!
richhotrainIn the same new product announcement, the other new locomotive introductions stated, "incandescent bulbs for realistic color and appearance".
5150WS6You are correct sir and I knew all of that.
I'm not sure why, but I like the traditional yellow beam over LEDs. I guess I'm old school.
Just sayin
Dave,
You are correct sir and I knew all of that. A definite type-o on my part! :) Thank you for the catch and clarifying. Sometimes in the thought of helping I get excited and don't always use the right words. And I don't want to add to the confusion.Thanks for the catch!
Mike
I wouldn't get too excited over the announcement that a single locomotive has LED lighting.
In the same new product announcement, the other new locomotive introductions stated, "incandescent bulbs for realistic color and appearance".
Hallelujah!!!
Athearn has seen the light and it is bright and reliable! The waters have parted! Will wonders never cease?!?
All that fuss and I don't own a single Athearn locomotive, and, I swore I never would. Maybe at some point in the far distant future there will be a small possibility, however remote, that I would consider buying one of their engines IF, and I say "IF" very loudly, they follow through with LEDs and Loksounds in the rest of their products.
Darn, better get out the wallet!
hon30critter Athearn still supplies locomotives with incandescent 'bulbs'. Their bulbs have a notoriously short lifespan.
All hope is not lost...
Athearn's latest announcements show the UP 4-8-4s with LEDs AND Loksound decoders! Finally!
http://www.athearn.com/Articles/Hobbywire.aspx
Who says mountains can't be moved!
Regards, Ed
5150WS6He has some of those SMD bulbs
Just so you know, the term 'bulbs' is commonly used to refer to incandescent bulbs with filaments. The term 'SMD' (Surface Mount Device) refers to LEDs (Light Emitting Diodes) which do not use filaments and therefore last much longer. SMDs were designed to be soldered directly to the surface of a circuit board, but commonly come with leads attached these days, or you can attach your own leads.
The reason I point this distinction out is that there can be confusion if the term 'bulbs' is used to refer to 'LEDs'. Athearn still supplies locomotives with incandescent 'bulbs'. Their bulbs have a notoriously short lifespan. Many (most?) modellers replace the bulbs with LEDs which will last for thousands of hours.
Lots of modellers still use bulbs because LEDs still can't quite match the true colour of an electric bulb or a kerosene lamp. They will commonly run the bulbs at a lower voltage than they are rated for because the bulbs will last much longer at a lower voltage. They won't be bright, but that is often the desired effect.
By the way, in my experience Streamlined Backshop is an excellent supplier. Their website is an encyclopedia of valuable information.
Please understand that I am not trying to be critical of you. I just wanted to explain the terminology.
Regards,
I really like Brian at Streamlined Backshop. He has some of those SMD bulbs but puts them on a clear piece of fiber optics tube so you can get two in some of the F7 headlight holes which the you can hook up to different channels on the decoder to make a really cool effect of a couple bulbs in one hole. He has a ton of the SMD bulbs and lights. Check with him if the guys responses above don't work out for you or get the results your looking for. Mike
You can access the Richmond Controls web site at the following link:
http://www.richmondcontrols.com/
Check out the pdf document for detail on wiring and installation:
http://www.richmondcontrols.com/WIREDLED.pdf
Also, click on the link titled LEDs on the left side column of the home page for even more detail.
You can also find the Richmond Controls SMD LEDs on a number of retailer web sites.
This sounds like exactly what I am looking for!
Do you have any stock #'s or size that I would be looking for?
I assume that Richmond controls has a web site?
Thanks for the reply!
I have two pairs of Athearn Genesis F7A/B consists. Early on, I struggled with the Athearn incandescent bulbs which constantly burned out, way too prematurely.
So, I changed to Miniatronics mini-incandescent bulbs and immediately solved the early burn out problem.
Later on, I replaced the incandescent bulbs altogether with Surface Mount Devices (SMDs) from Richmond Controls.
The Richmond Controls SMDs are pre-wired LEDs which are, in effect, miniature LEDs that easily fit into the light housings on the Athearn Genesis F7A locomotive and do not interfere with the clear plastic lens that covers the light housing. I used a dab of Woodland Scenics Scenic Cement at the back of the light housing to secure the LEDs in place. I am extremely satisfied with this solution.
Yes, I've done several. In the beginning I was using MonsterLEDs available through Ebay.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HO-WARM-WHITE-AC4400CW-C44-9W-ENGINE-MONSTER-LEDs-BEST-LIGHTING-KIT-BY-AL-MAYO-/182350078763?hash=item2a74e9632b:g:k~IAAOSwBahVMc5g
However, since then I have found many suppliers of surface-mount (SMD) LEDs that are pre-wired and are easily adaptable to locomotive headlights.
F units are relatively easy with the ample room in the nose. I have done a few Genesis B units or back-up (rear) lights on A units as well. Athearn uses a pretty thick brass casting, at least they did on a B&O F7B dual sealed beam lamp. I used 3mm fiber optic that I heated slightly to form into a "lens" which fits the 7" diameter Pyle-National housing perfectly.
Lately, I have been using these LEDs with the resistor already installed, for convenience.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/20-pcs-Pre-Wired-Round-2mm-warm-white-LEDs-prewired-resistor-for-12V-16V-use-/400725177589?hash=item5d4d14f4f5:g:yusAAOSwVupTmQD6
If you browse the ebay sellers you'll find scores of LEDs in many configurations.
Good Luck,
Ed
Has anyone converted thier Athearn Genesis F-7 to LED lighting?
I am converting my F7A to DCC and not happy with the results for the Mars light. I was wondering if anyone had converted to LED lighting, and what did you use? Plus the fact that LED's last much longer than bulbs, so I may not have to take it apart again.