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Powering Atlas turnout frog

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  • Member since
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  • From: Southern Quebec, Canada
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Powering Atlas turnout frog
Posted by Guy Papillon on Tuesday, December 29, 2015 4:27 PM

I am considering powering the frog on Atlas Customline Mark 4 turnouts. The turnouts are already in place and ballasted. Can I use solder on this type of metal?

Guy

Modeling CNR in the 50's

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Posted by wp8thsub on Tuesday, December 29, 2015 5:17 PM

Guy Papillon
Can I use solder on this type of metal?

Not really.  Atlas frogs use a pot metal that does not readily accept solder.  If you have access to a plating machine (like the one Micro Mark sells), you can apply something like copper plating to the metal that takes solder.  Otherwise, use the screw hole cast into the frog and attach a feeder with a 2-56 screw.

Rob Spangler

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Posted by richhotrain on Tuesday, December 29, 2015 5:33 PM

wp8thsub

Otherwise, use the screw hole cast into the frog and attach a feeder with a 2-56 screw.

That is the way to do it on Atlas metal frogs.
 
Rich

Alton Junction

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Posted by rrinker on Tuesday, December 29, 2015 8:14 PM

2-56 will break the hole out. Use a 1-72. Ho-Bits and others have small brass screws. Use a very short one with the smallest head, since it will all be visible on top, carefully screw it in the hole (the pot metal is even softer than brass so it will self tap just fine). Drill a hole next to hit and run the feeder wire down, solder the top to the brass screw, then paint the whole thing flat black to hide it as much as possible. Slightly more complicated, but at least the visible remains wouldn't obviously be a screw head, use a slightly longer screw, drive it in a few turns, then cut the head off just slightly above the frog surface with a cutoff wheel. Solder the wire to the screw stub and then paint it flat black.

                             --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by RR_Mel on Tuesday, December 29, 2015 9:14 PM

 
The hole is designed to be tapped for either a 2-56 or 2mm thread, I went with 2mm only because I have hundreds of metric screws in stock.
 
Mel
 
Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951
 
My Model Railroad   
 
Bakersfield, California
 
I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
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Posted by Sierra Man on Tuesday, December 29, 2015 9:23 PM

When I power my Atlas turnouts, I use the screws as mentioned. But rather than solder to the screw, I cut a piece of .020 brass shim wide enough to get a hole in to fit the screw, and solder it to the power wire. then just put it together and tighten. Have Fun!

Phil, CEO, Eastern Sierra Pacific Railroad.  We know where you are going, before you do!

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Posted by Guy Papillon on Wednesday, December 30, 2015 9:58 AM

Thanks to everyone for the replies.

Guy

Modeling CNR in the 50's

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Posted by zstripe on Wednesday, December 30, 2015 12:46 PM

Guy,

A couple yrs. ago I was having a little trouble with a crossover...two #6 Atlas that went into a small yard, had a little bit of a stall at very low speeds with 4-axle switchers...so I needed to power both the frogs...they were already ballasted, so taking them out was not an option. I drilled a hole straight down the hole that is on the side of the frog from the top inserted a solid #26 copper insulated wire down the hole, stripped about a 1/4'' of insulation from the end and made a 90 degree bend in it so when inserted in the hole the bend about 1/16 would rest on the outside of the hole and used the black 1-72 machine screw that used to come with the turnouts and was able to thread it right into the frog hole with the wire...just painted the head flat black and you would never know it was there. Just connected the wire to the relay that already was there for control panel lights and works like a charm. Since then, I have also done some #4's exactly the same way, they were also already ballasted. My layout is 1/2 ply + 1/2 Homasote for roadbed and yards.

Take Care! Big Smile

Frank

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Posted by jrbernier on Wednesday, December 30, 2015 8:23 PM

  There seems to be some confusion about what size of machine screw to use.  One can tap for a 2-56, but do not blame me when it either breaks as you are tapping the hole, or it cracks later on.  Tapping for a 1-72 is the way to go.  What you want  to use is a 1/8" brass 1-72 screw(much easier to solder to than the stainless steel screws).  If this is an 'after the track is laid' install, use a 'slotted' screw head.  You can 'tin' the slot and solder your wire into the slot.  I am using 1/8". slotted 1-72 brass screws.  I 'prep' each turnout with a frog feeder(grey wire) and a red or black wire on each stock rail(to the DCC bus under the bench work).  I also solder 'braids' across the hinge from the points to the closure rail.  I strip out strands and make the braids for 3 strands of wire.  Once the track is painted, the braids just vanish into the trackwork.  The above listed modifications do wonders in assisting locomotives from 'stalling' as they go through yard trackwork.

Jim

Modeling BNSF  and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin

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Posted by rrinker on Wednesday, December 30, 2015 10:30 PM

 I knew I wasn't losing my mind THAT much. Yes, 1-72 is the size for the Atlas frog.

                           --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by zstripe on Thursday, December 31, 2015 6:12 AM

rrinker

 I knew I wasn't losing my mind THAT much. Yes, 1-72 is the size for the Atlas frog.

                           --Randy

 

That's the reason they used to come with them...along with a brass tapped bar for powering the frog. The underside of the turnout, has a notched tie where the hole in the frog is...you slid the brass bar in the notch and used the 1-72 machine from the top and screwed it into the brass bar. Easy to hide the screw head, with a little ballast or paint and it will work just as well, how I explained above...simple and easy...no soldering involved. The machine screw is hardened metal, so it will tap itself into the softer copper/brass wire and pot metal frog. I don't know why they stopped putting those items in the turnout packages.

Take Care! Big Smile

Frank

BTW: I have not even tried to conceal the screw head on this #4 turnout yet!

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Posted by rrinker on Thursday, December 31, 2015 10:13 AM

 I was under the impression that the brass bar and other accessories came with the Snap Relay, so that you could hook it up for frog power. A number of years ago, someone discovered that Atlas would sell you just the screw and bar as spare parts. Mine were all prepared ahead of time before placing them, so my screws are underneath and invisible - but then I never hooked any of them up because I had no problems with any of my locos stalling. Just a bunch of green wires hanging down under my layout.

                       --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

  • Member since
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Posted by Guy Papillon on Thursday, December 31, 2015 2:47 PM

rrinker

Mine were all prepared ahead of time before placing them, so my screws are underneath and invisible - but then I never hooked any of them up because I had no problems with any of my locos stalling. Just a bunch of green wires hanging down under my layout.

                       --Randy

I wish I knew better. I wouldn't mind to see a bunch of wire hanging free under my layout, whichever color they were.

 

Guy

Modeling CNR in the 50's

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Posted by RR_Mel on Thursday, December 31, 2015 3:12 PM

jrbernier

One can tap for a 2-56, but do not blame me when it either breaks as you are tapping the hole, or it cracks later on. 

Jim

 

 

Jim I tapped all of my Atlas turnouts for 2mm screws and none of them have cracked.  I used a 2mm brass washer to solder the wires to as a ring type connector.  After the screw was tightened I used my Xuron cutters to nip off the end of the screw then a cutoff disk in my Dremel to flush them to the top of the frog/tie.  A dab of tie brown and they’re impossible to see.
 
 
 
Mel
 
Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951
 
My Model Railroad   
 
Bakersfield, California
 
I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
  • Member since
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Posted by rrinker on Thursday, December 31, 2015 5:31 PM

2mm is dead between a 2- and 1-, so it worked. But a 2-56 is too big around. A 2-56 if available in exact metric sizes would be 2.184mm. A 1-72 tap probably wouldn;t cut much of a usable thread (I never bothered trying), but forcing in a 1-72 screw and making it self tap fits plenty tight.

                        --Randy

              --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by FrankG on Sunday, May 5, 2019 6:40 AM

Great info thank you. FrankG

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Posted by BigDaddy on Sunday, May 5, 2019 11:29 AM

Necro thread.  Nothing new is going on with Atlas turnouts and 1-72 screws. 

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

Shenandoah Valley

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