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The light bulb finally turns on!!!

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  • Member since
    January 2015
  • From: Southern California
  • 1,682 posts
Posted by Lone Wolf and Santa Fe on Tuesday, December 15, 2015 3:12 PM

My policy for creating blocks is: Every time the track reaches a turnout each fork is a new block. The switch is part of the old block. The exception is in yards.

The Atlas selectors are SPDT on-off-on switches. SP single pole means that the common rail wire is not switched. The DT double throw is so you can switch between two different throttles so two people can operate at once (on different blocks). If you only have one power pack that is fine just use the upper position. Off is in the middle.

Modeling a fictional version of California set in the 1990s Lone Wolf and Santa Fe Railroad
  • Member since
    February 2002
  • From: Reading, PA
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Posted by rrinker on Tuesday, December 15, 2015 12:14 PM

 I think people try to read too far into things - oh, it's electricity, it MUST be complicated. Get yourself a battery, a switch, a small motor, and some piece of wire. To use the water analogy (I hate that, because I really hate plumbing work, it's ALWAYS a mess - yet rewiring the whole breaker box is somethign I am quite comfortable with) - you have a pump suppling water (the battery, or power pack). This water flows through a valve (the switch) to a water wheel (the motor) and then back to be picked up by the pump again. If you close the valve, it blocks off the water and the wheel stops turning. If you cut the pipe, the water doesn't get to the wheel and it stops turning. For basic DC operation, that's really all there is to it. Just because your 'wires' are a pair of rails 16.5 mm apart (in HO) doesn;t make them any different than a lamp cord or speaker wire or any other actual copper wire. Just because the 'motor' is on wheels that ride on these rails, doesn't make it any different. The electricty has to flow from the source to the device being powered, and back again, in an unbroken path, for things to work. That path can be a rail, a wire, a wheel, a strip of conductive metal, anything. If there is any break in the path, nothing will work. Sometimes you want to deliberately add a break in the path, to stop something from working on purpose, like turn out the light, or park the loco on a siding.

There are plenty of advanced concepts that do use advanced math like calculus, but those things are not necessary to understand to wire a train layout. They aren;t even necessary to use DCC. Despite all the complexity that is the hardware and software inside the various components, one does nto need to undertand how such things work or how to build your own in order to make use of them. How many understand even the old electromechanical phone system (you know, back when a phone was a thing with wires running into the wall and had a big round dial with numbers on it) works? Yet millions of people were able to make calls with their home phones. How about modern cell phones? Plenty of people use them every single day with nary a clue about how they can stay connected on the same call while driving hundreds of miles. To the point of becoming annoyed when the call does disconnect occasionally. 30 years ago, you were lucky to get 20 feet from where the phone was located, while trailing a long cord across the room.

                   --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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    February 2008
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Posted by kasskaboose on Tuesday, December 15, 2015 7:12 AM

7j43k
 
Bayfield Transfer Railway



It.  Is.  Not.  That.  Difficult.

 

 

 

 

 

Well, no.  Once you "see" it, it's incredibly obvious.  But until you do, it's not.  For a lot of us.

 

Sorta like calculus.

 

 

Ed

 

 

Understanding wiring is also difficult for myself since I don't use that often.  It seems that electricity can get quite challenging and complex.

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: Boise, Idaho
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Posted by E-L man tom on Monday, December 14, 2015 10:44 AM

Dave, you don't have to have gaps on both rails as long as the "south" rails are gapped and individual blocks are kept separate at the controller/on/off switches. Both power packs can be connected to that "north" or common rail. The control switches determine then which "cab" or power pack runs that block. Some have said, however, that finding a short or other electrical problem is easier when both rails are gapped. My remedy for that: turn on only one block at a time.

Your individual blocks are connected to the middle tab on the SPDT, on-off-on switches (I'm using DPDT switches, as I have indicator lights for A/B throttle indicators). Your "common" lead from your power pack is connected directly to the track (you can use a jumper wired terminal strip for this and have a single connection going to the track). The other lead from each power pack is connected to an "A" terminal strip that connects to all the "A" positions on the block toggles, and separately connected to a "B" terminal strip that connects to all the "B" positions on the block toggles respectively. This method separates each power pack at the terminal strip and at the toggles. Don't forget to use a jumper wire to connect the terminals on each termianl strip. Keep A and B terminal strips separate electrically.    

Tom Modeling the free-lanced Toledo Erie Central switching layout.
  • Member since
    May 2004
  • 7,500 posts
Posted by 7j43k on Saturday, December 12, 2015 7:01 PM

Bayfield Transfer Railway



It.  Is.  Not.  That.  Difficult.

 

 

 

Well, no.  Once you "see" it, it's incredibly obvious.  But until you do, it's not.  For a lot of us.

 

Sorta like calculus.

 

 

Ed

  • Member since
    April 2012
  • From: Huron, SD
  • 1,016 posts
Posted by Bayfield Transfer Railway on Saturday, December 12, 2015 6:24 PM

And even at age 12 I understood how to use double pole switches instead of Atlas if I didn't want common rail.

It.  Is.  Not.  That.  Difficult.

 

Disclaimer:  This post may contain humor, sarcasm, and/or flatulence.

Michael Mornard

Bringing the North Woods to South Dakota!

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  • From: 10,430’ (3,179 m)
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Posted by jjdamnit on Saturday, December 12, 2015 5:30 PM

Hello All,

If you aren't familiar with this book it also gives schematics so you can make these components, given your experience, not just selling Atlas components.

If you aren't familiar with wiring diagrams then the Atlas components are a simple and relatively inexpensive option.

Options...that's all I'm suggesting.

Hope this helps.  

"Uhh...I didn’t know it was 'impossible' I just made it work...sorry"

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: Chi-Town
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Posted by zstripe on Saturday, December 12, 2015 5:20 PM

jjdamnit

 

 
cplmckenzie
If I could now grasp the concept of Cab A\Cab B.

 

Hello All,

Get a copy of the Complete Atlas Wiring Book!

It will give you a great breakdown of DC wiring and you can refer to it at any time.

At $8.95 + shipping is a great addition to your knowledge base.

Hope this helps.

 

Only if He choose's to wire His layout common rail...with Atlas components. Common rail wiring, is not as versatile, as both rails insulated and easier to switch to DCC...If He so desires later.

Take Care! Big Smile

Frank

  • Member since
    January 2010
  • From: Chi-Town
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Posted by zstripe on Saturday, December 12, 2015 5:13 PM

mbinsewi

If you go back to the tread you started in the "Electronics and DCC" section, "Question, before I do it?",  scroll about half way down, and Frank (Zstrip) gave you a link with a simple wiring diagram on block wiring.  Look at it, and the two boxes on the bottom of the diagram labeled "Throttles", one box would be cab"A" and the other would be cab"B".

Mike.

 

Mike,

What's that old saying?? ''You can lead a horse to water...but''!?

Take Care! Big Smile

Frank

  • Member since
    October 2004
  • From: Colorful Colorado
  • 8,639 posts
Posted by Texas Zepher on Saturday, December 12, 2015 4:49 PM

cplmckenzie
If I could now grasp the concept of Cab A\Cab B.

The concept is simply adding a switch in the wire for each control "section" that can choose between either cab A or cab B is feeding power to that section. 

Don't make it any harder than it has to be.  Really quite simple.

  • Member since
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  • From: 10,430’ (3,179 m)
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Posted by jjdamnit on Saturday, December 12, 2015 4:07 PM

cplmckenzie
If I could now grasp the concept of Cab A\Cab B.

Hello All,

Get a copy of the Complete Atlas Wiring Book!

It will give you a great breakdown of DC wiring and you can refer to it at any time.

At $8.95 + shipping is a great addition to your knowledge base.

Hope this helps.

"Uhh...I didn’t know it was 'impossible' I just made it work...sorry"

  • Member since
    May 2010
  • From: SE. WI.
  • 8,253 posts
Posted by mbinsewi on Saturday, December 12, 2015 3:56 PM

If you go back to the tread you started in the "Electronics and DCC" section, "Question, before I do it?",  scroll about half way down, and Frank (Zstrip) gave you a link with a simple wiring diagram on block wiring.  Look at it, and the two boxes on the bottom of the diagram labeled "Throttles", one box would be cab"A" and the other would be cab"B".

Mike.

  • Member since
    February 2005
  • 869 posts
Posted by davidmurray on Saturday, December 12, 2015 3:50 PM

cplmckenzie
If I could now grasp the concept of Cab A\Cab B. cplmckenzie

You need/use two power packs/throttles.

Cab A (left) wires go the a dpdt switch.  Cab B (right) goes to the other side of the switch.  wires go from the centre of the switch to the track.  Insulating gaps on both rails, at both ends of the section.  Mind your colour coding.

Each such section can be controlled by A or B.

For three or more, rotary switchs work best.

Dave

David Murray from Oshawa, Ontario Canada
  • Member since
    August 2015
  • 115 posts
The light bulb finally turns on!!!
Posted by cplmckenzie on Saturday, December 12, 2015 3:38 PM

Hi again,

Ya know, I started reading "Wiring Your Layout" and realized that I have been doing block wiring the whole time, using series of on\off switches to control sidings and spurs, to control certain "sections" of the main and DPDT switches to control my reverse loop.

NOW, looking at my entire layout I am beginning to see "logical" sections that can be set to run independently.

If I could now grasp the concept of Cab A\Cab B.

cplmckenzie

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