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Terminating small guage wires

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Posted by TBat55 on Saturday, September 26, 2015 10:30 PM

My bad, thought it was solid.  I rarely use stranded as it moves around too much for me.  Tired of using tweezers and weights to hold stranded for soldering.

Type of insulation has a big effect.  I no longer use the shiney hard (PVD) type insulation.  It seems to have memory when you bend it.

Terry

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Posted by MikeyChris on Saturday, September 26, 2015 3:12 PM

TBat55

Strip the end longer than normal , tin the end, and spiral wrap it around the insulation.  The insulation will give it strength.  The spiral assures contact.

 

Well Terry, I had high hopes for this solution, but I guess my technique isn't up to par. I stripped about 3/4" of the stranded 26 AWG wire, lightly tinned it and tried to wrap it around the insulation. I was not successfull. Even with the small diameter wire and a very light coat of solder to tin it, the wire did not want to wrap easily and evenly around the insulation. I ended up tinning about 1/2" of the wire and wrapping that around 1/2" piece of 20 AWG solid wire, soldering that and putting a piece of heat shrink over the wrap so that about 3/16" of the solid 20 AWG wire was bare, and screwed that down under the terminal screw. It works well, but not ideal if thew Euro strips are mounted where you c an't see very well to tell how far the wire is inserted into the Euro strip. Since Euro terminal strips have no barrier between the two screws (terminals), it is easy to insert the wire in too far, and obstruct the insertion of the wire from the opposite direction. I decided on the Euro style terminal strips mainly because they are small (take up less real estate than say barrier strips). However, I am not as apt to use them again asthey have a number of drawbacks (as noted above, the lack of barrier between terminals and no pressure plate to secure small wire).
Mike
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Posted by MikeyChris on Tuesday, September 22, 2015 1:54 PM

TBat55

Strip the end longer than normal , tin the end, and spiral wrap it around the

Hi Terry,

That is a very clever idea and I will try it. Thanx for sharing.

Mike

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Posted by TBat55 on Wednesday, September 16, 2015 7:54 PM

Strip the end longer than normal , tin the end, and spiral wrap it around the insulation.  The insulation will give it strength.  The spiral assures contact.

Terry

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Posted by gmpullman on Saturday, September 12, 2015 4:47 PM

MikeyChris
Do you use plastic or metal DIN rails? If metal, how do you cut them?

I use metal and I'm fortunate here, too, that I have access to a nice bench-top abrasive cut-off wheel. I cut a few dozen random lengths and size them as necessary. They're pretty soft metal so a good hacksaw and fine blade would work. Sawzall or saber saw would work too.

The terminal blocks are a bit bulky but they do the job very well. I sent you a PM with some options for you...

Ed

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Posted by MikeyChris on Saturday, September 12, 2015 10:59 AM

gmpullman

Actually I use DIN rail terminal blocks...

Hi Ed,

I looked into using DIN rails, not only for mounting terminal blocks but also for mounting power supplies. I like the system, but it was too expensive for me. If I was able to salvage parts as you did, I may have gone that route.

gmpullman

Seems to me 14 ga. solid from romex might be a little over-kill. You can still get 18 or 20 ga. "bell" wire or thermostat wire which would be sufficient.

My only reasons for using 14 AWG Romex were:

1) I have some on hand

2) It fits the Euro terminal blocks better than smaller (18 - 22 AWG) size wire due to the fact that Euro blocks do not have the pressure plate to evenly apply pressure to the wire - so larger wire fits better.

Do you use plastic or metal DIN rails? If metal, how do you cut them?

Thanx,

Mike

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Posted by gmpullman on Thursday, September 10, 2015 6:56 PM

Actually I use DIN rail terminal blocks. I salvage a bunch of electronic gear where I work and I grab these things every chance I get. They will grab a stranded 26 ga. wire with ease and I can jumper several together if I need common or multiple connections on the same electrical leg.

Similar to these:

http://www.omega.com/pptst/AVK.html

http://www.galco.com/shop/Screw-Clamps-Terminal-Blocks

I see what you mean about the euro-style strips not having the wire protector. Seems odd that the option wouldn't be there.

Seems to me 14 ga. solid from romex might be a little over-kill. You can still get 18 or 20 ga. "bell" wire or thermostat wire which would be sufficient.

Ed

 

 

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Posted by MikeyChris on Thursday, September 10, 2015 9:30 AM

rrinker

   I'm talking about telephone/network cables, not audio connections. RJ11 4 pin, RJ12 (not 'officially' an RJ type) 6 pin, RJ45 8 pin.

You could use 66 blocks for intermediate teminations.

Hi Randy,

Oops, I obviously did NOT come to the obvious conclusion here. Sorry about that. I was thinking the wrong way. flat cables terminated in RJ connectors would be a nice solution, but I have already purchased other parts. I am now thinking about soldering a short length of Romex 14 AWG to the small wire, and securing that in the Euro terminal blocks. 

One of the really great things about this hobby is all the different (often elegant, sometimes crude but very effective) solutions fellow modelers come up with.

Mike

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Posted by MikeyChris on Thursday, September 10, 2015 9:24 AM

gmpullman
 

Something to keep in mind when looking at terminal strips is that all are NOT created equal. The top design has little inserts...

Sometimes a little extra cost will save you much aggravation and time...

 

Hi Ed,

Yes, there are strips made with the flat pressure plates you mention, and I would prefer those types (I have used them before). However, I have yet to find a Euro-style terminal block that uses them. Most of the terminal blocks that have those pressure plates are solder-tail (meant to be mounted on a printed circuit board). If you know of a source of Euro-style blocks with pressure plates, please advise.

Thanx for the reply.

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Posted by farrellaa on Tuesday, September 8, 2015 11:00 PM

MikeyChris
 
farrellaa

I have several areas that I used a short (1/2-3/4") piece of brass strip, about 1/8" wide and .020-.030" thick , for my wire ends. I solder the 26 ga wire to one end of the strip and then slip some shrink tube over the wire and brass, leaving about 1/4" exposed on the end. This makes a good solid connection for the terminal strip screw (you can really tell when it is clamped down) and the wire is held solid with the shrink tube. It takes a little extra work but well worth it.

 

Hi Bob,

Thanx for the idea. As always, you have some unique solutions! I may play with variations of this, like maybe soldering the small wire to brass rod, or ???

Mike

 

Mike,

Whatever you have on hand! I happen to have a few packs of the brass bar stock and it works very well. I even made a distribution strip with some scrap copper flashing (.030"), just made some slits along one edge to keep heat from melting the next wire connection. Got to be creative sometimes!

   -Bob

Life is what happens while you are making other plans!

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Posted by MikeyChris on Tuesday, September 8, 2015 7:30 PM

farrellaa

I have several areas that I used a short (1/2-3/4") piece of brass strip, about 1/8" wide and .020-.030" thick , for my wire ends. I solder the 26 ga wire to one end of the strip and then slip some shrink tube over the wire and brass, leaving about 1/4" exposed on the end. This makes a good solid connection for the terminal strip screw (you can really tell when it is clamped down) and the wire is held solid with the shrink tube. It takes a little extra work but well worth it.

Hi Bob,

Thanx for the idea. As always, you have some unique solutions! I may play with variations of this, like maybe soldering the small wire to brass rod, or ???

Mike

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Posted by farrellaa on Monday, September 7, 2015 11:22 PM

I have several areas that I used a short (1/2-3/4") piece of brass strip, about 1/8" wide and .020-.030" thick , for my wire ends. I solder the 26 ga wire to one end of the strip and then slip some shrink tube over the wire and brass, leaving about 1/4" exposed on the end. This makes a good solid connection for the terminal strip screw (you can really tell when it is clamped down) and the wire is held solid with the shrink tube. It takes a little extra work but well worth it.

   -Bob

Life is what happens while you are making other plans!

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Posted by gmpullman on Monday, September 7, 2015 8:58 PM

MikeyChris
I will be installing signals on my layout using 26 AWG stranded wire between the circuit boards and Euro style terminal strips.

Something to keep in mind when looking at terminal strips is that all are NOT created equal.

The top design has little inserts that allow the wire to be clamped rather than squished directly under the screw. I closed one slightly on the far right. The blue strips are on a signal board from Logic-Rail, an SA-1 I think.

The lower one was a bargain from All Electronics and you can see where I turned in the screw a little that this would just tear up stranded wire when you snug it down. It would be OK for tinned, solid or a Molex pin.

Sometimes a little extra cost will save you much aggravation and time...

Regards, Ed

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Posted by MikeyChris on Monday, September 7, 2015 8:13 PM

[quote user="Enzoamps"]

Folding over and tinning is usually my first option.  If you are in the industry, one occurs to me.  Crimp male Molex 06 series pins on the wire ends and then put the pins into the barrier strip holes.

/quote]
Good idea. I have some Molex parts here now! Thanx,
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Posted by Enzoamps on Sunday, September 6, 2015 11:36 PM

Folding over and tinning is usually my first option.  If you are in the industry, one occurs to me.  Crimp male Molex 06 series pins on the wire ends and then put the pins into the barrier strip holes.

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Posted by maxman on Sunday, September 6, 2015 2:03 PM

Did someone say they needed a Terminator?

 

18 GIFs found for terminator gif

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Posted by BroadwayLion on Sunday, September 6, 2015 9:12 AM

MikeyChris
I would have thought using 1920 vintage wiring would have been difficult. I had a 1940's era oscilloscope once, and all the insuation had cracked off the wiring! Obviously your wire is in better shape.

The 1930 and 1940s discovered rubber and used it as an insulation, it did not work out so well. The 1920s product was much better made, but probably far more expensive in 1940 dollars, and more difficult to use.

 

Signals System of LION:

ROAR

 

The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.

Here there be cats.                                LIONS with CAMERAS

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Posted by rrinker on Saturday, September 5, 2015 8:53 PM

MikeyChris

Hey Randy,

Thanx for the reply.

 
rrinker

 How many connections do you need? Phone jacks are available in 4, 6, and 8 pin connections. For a simple steady state like an LED signal driver, you can use cheap flat telephone wire as the cable, and use jacks for the termination.

 

 

I will have at least 26 signals, and the circuit boards have 8 pin male SIP headers. I bought some prefab 8 pin female connectors with 12" of 26AWG wire already crimped to the pins. I bought 12 Euro style 12 position terminal blocks at a good price, and was hoping to use them because I like having all wiring terminate at blocks to facilitate troubleshooting/modifications. That said, I have a use for the 4 pin connectors if they are suitable for use as DC walk-around throttle ports. I have only seen 4 pin phone plugs/sockets available as mini (Sony headset type). Are they available "full size"? WHat about the 6 and 8 pin? In my work I hadn't run across these critters. Can you give me a manufacturer's name or link?

Thanx,

Mike

 

 I'm talking about telephone/network cables, not audio connections. RJ11 4 pin, RJ12 (not 'officially' an RJ type) 6 pin, RJ45 8 pin.

You could use 66 blocks for intermediate teminations.

 Kinda stinks your boards have 8 pin SIP connections. Most signal boards use 10 pin DIP connections, so you use them with 10 conductor ribbon cable - look at the Digitrax SE8C and their signal mast base kits, or RR-CirKits products - most everything he makes uses 10 pin ribbon cables to interconnect.

                               --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by retsignalmtr on Saturday, September 5, 2015 8:19 PM

I have signals on several N scale T-Trak modules. I use 7 amp euro style barrier strips to connect the wires (20 AWG stranded) from the strips to the relay boards and I do splice a short piece of 20 AWG wire on the ends of the 32 AWG signal wires. I use flat 6 wire telephone wires to connect the signal controls from module to module which is 26 AWG. I do double or triple the end of the wire and solder it so the barrier strip will hold the wire in.

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Posted by MikeyChris on Saturday, September 5, 2015 5:16 PM

Hello Lion,

As always, I find your reply interesting, practical and economical.

BroadwayLion

Forget the eurostrips, they are far too expensive anyway, LION has more that 500 conductors, each with two ends, so things like that are not going to happen.

Here is solution of LION:

Since I had already purchased the terminal blocks, that issue is moot. However, I am labeling all connections and wires, much like you have. Many years of having to troubleshoot broadcast systems has taught me the value of good docs.

I would have thought using 1920 vintage wiring would have been difficult. I had a 1940's era oscilloscope once, and all the insuation had cracked off the wiring! Obviously your wire is in better shape.

Mike

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Posted by MikeyChris on Saturday, September 5, 2015 5:09 PM

Hi Tom,

tstage

Between the two I might lean toward Option B.  Once soldered, you could then slide the insulation over the 26ga wire to 1) cover the soldered joint, and 2) provide a modicum of strain-relief at the joint.  (Heat-shrink would work for that, as well.) 

After thinking about it, I think I would just as soon use AWG 20 and not introduce another failure point. As you can tell, I'm on the fence with this and it will take some time for me to decide.

Thanx,

Mike

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Posted by MikeyChris on Saturday, September 5, 2015 5:07 PM

Hey Randy,

Thanx for the reply.

rrinker

 How many connections do you need? Phone jacks are available in 4, 6, and 8 pin connections. For a simple steady state like an LED signal driver, you can use cheap flat telephone wire as the cable, and use jacks for the termination.

 

I will have at least 26 signals, and the circuit boards have 8 pin male SIP headers. I bought some prefab 8 pin female connectors with 12" of 26AWG wire already crimped to the pins. I bought 12 Euro style 12 position terminal blocks at a good price, and was hoping to use them because I like having all wiring terminate at blocks to facilitate troubleshooting/modifications. That said, I have a use for the 4 pin connectors if they are suitable for use as DC walk-around throttle ports. I have only seen 4 pin phone plugs/sockets available as mini (Sony headset type). Are they available "full size"? WHat about the 6 and 8 pin? In my work I hadn't run across these critters. Can you give me a manufacturer's name or link?

Thanx,

Mike

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Posted by BroadwayLion on Saturday, September 5, 2015 3:13 PM

Forget the eurostrips, they are far too expensive anyway, LION has more that 500 conductors, each with two ends, so things like that are not going to happen.

Here is solution of LION:

Keeping track of all of these wires could not be eaiser. Just look them up by cable and pin number in the Operations Manual...

Speaking of cheap... These wires came from a 1920s vintage pipe organ, Six bundles of 11 conductors to a cable, and since I needed them in bundles of 10, it worked out perfectly. No plastic or rubber on these cables, just wax and string, paper and more wax and string, and more string paper and wax. How cool is that?

 

ROAR

 

The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.

Here there be cats.                                LIONS with CAMERAS

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Posted by tstage on Saturday, September 5, 2015 1:46 PM

Between the two I might lean toward Option B.  Once soldered, you could then slide the insulation over the 26ga wire to 1) cover the soldered joint, and 2) provide a modicum of strain-relief at the joint.  (Heat-shrink would work for that, as well.)  That said, I like Randy's suggestion.

Tom

https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling

Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.

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Posted by skagitrailbird on Saturday, September 5, 2015 1:07 PM

I've used method A many times with no problems.

Roger Johnson
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Posted by rrinker on Saturday, September 5, 2015 12:39 PM

 How many connections do you need? Phone jacks are available in 4, 6, and 8 pin connections. For a simple steady state like an LED signal driver, you can use cheap flat telephone wire as the cable, and use jacks for the termination.

                     --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by doctorwayne on Saturday, September 5, 2015 12:32 PM

Folding the stripped ends back on themselves (as many times as is needed) and applying some solder sounds to me the easiest and most economical solution.

Wayne

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Terminating small guage wires
Posted by MikeyChris on Saturday, September 5, 2015 11:31 AM

I feel a bit silly asking this question as I feel I should know the answer (I spent over 45 years as an electronics tech/engineer). However, I have not come up with a suitable solution, so I thought I would ask you guys.

I will be installing signals on my layout using 26 AWG stranded wire between the circuit boards and Euro style terminal strips. I chose this wire size based on convenience (flexible, small size) circuit requirements (current less than 50 ma, usually less than 20 ma) and cost (less copper = less $$). However, as I get closer to implementing the build I am realizing this small AWG wire is not going to fit the Euro style terminal strips very well. The smallest size terminal strips I could find are rated at 3 amps and they can accomodate 20 AWG through 12 AWG wire.

The only solution I can come up with is to:

A) - triple or quadruple the stripped end of the wore and tin it so it will better fit the terminal blocks, or

B) - solder larger AWG wire to the ends of the smaller wire where the wires terminate at the terminal blocks.

Of course there also is the option of wiring everything with 20 AWG wire, but that is my last choice since I have already purchased the smaller wire and usaing 20 AWG wirte poses its own set of issues.

So, I was hoping someone out there has already faced this situation and has a brilliant solution! Thanx.

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