I just recieved the above, put it on my Programing Track and found that I could not write a new address to the locomotive. In the Sound Traxx Decoder's instructions sent with the locomotive the talk about this probablity and state that I need to purchase a Programing Track booster (PTB-100). Is this the case and will it correct this problem? I was able to program my two BLI Hudsons with out a booster and am wondering why I need to spend another $50.-$60.00 for this. Does this device have other benefits? I am not a tech. type person, so I would kindly ask: please keep your responses fairly simple!
Thanking in Advance!
NP 2626 "Northern Pacific, really terrific"
Northern Pacific Railway Historical Association: http://www.nprha.org/
No, you probably don't need a programming track booster -- use Programming on the Main instead of the programming track.
Take all other DCC equipped locomotives off the track, and use POM. If your DCC system doesn't step through configuration options to set CV 29 after changing the address, after you enter the new address program a value of 34 into CV 29.
After doing this, you then need to tip the locomotive over to remove power for a few seconds before trying the new address.
Changing the value in CV 29 tells the decoder to use the new, long address instead of 3. If you want to be able to run the locomotive on DC power as well as DCC, put a value of 38 into CV 29.
O.K., got the new address in excepting the throttle, everything seems to be working correctly. However, the trottle is either on or off. The loco runs at full speed or not at all. Other then programing in the loco's address, I have not messed with CVs at all. All the rest of my locos run fine with how the decoders were programed at the factory.
What I'm saying is I have not messed with the CVs so if you have a fix for me, your going to have to explain it in as simple of terms as you can as I am ignorant of these types of processes.
First step is to reset the decoder to insure that everything is back to factory settings before making any more changes.
One thing you forgot to mention is, which DCC system are you using? That's going to make a difference in CV values, because if you have a Digitrax system you have to enter leading zeros for some entries, but with NCE you don't use leading zeroes.
FIRST: Using the Programming Track, set CV 8 to a value of 8. Then put the locomotive back on the layout and see if it has been reset to run on address 3.
I bet he has a Digitrax Zephyr, as it seems everyone that had this issue (including me) is using the Zephyr. If so, use blast mode programming.
You will not be able to read back CVs using Blast Mode Programming.
1. Press the "PROG" key.
2. Press the "SWCH" key.
3. Press "7".
4. Press the "c" key (located just below the "9" key).
5. Press the "EXIT" key.
6. Program the Tsunami decoder using Direct (dir) mode. Be sure that ONLY the loco with the Tsunami decoder is on the track duringprogramming!!
4. Press the "t" key.
5. Press the "EXIT" key
You have now exited Blast Mode Programming and can return to normal layout operations.
"The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination."-Albert Einstein
http://gearedsteam.blogspot.com/
Yes, I have the original Digitrax Zephyr, DCS50. I will try your fix, Geared Steam, thanks for the help!
Well not everyone - the last Tsunami loco I had, a Bowser sound chassis for the FT, I was able to program just fine on my program track WITHOUT Blast Mode or a booster. Dunno, mine just seems to work. I have all Loksound now except one QSI in an Atlas, which I asl had no issues programming on the program track. Short, heavy (#18) wires on a very clean piece of flex track. My PR3 in standalone mode can read anything that has readback it seems, even with just a plain old 14V PS14 power supply - that has maybe 3 inches total of #18 wire between the PR3 terminals and the track, which is 3 Atlas rerailers plus a half length of straight track at eash end, all joints soldered. I've even been able to coax JMRI into reading some of those 'no readback" MRC decoders - I never know what I'll run into at the club. That one took some effort - any attempt to read the whole decoder, or even read a full sheet, failed 100%. But if I picked a CV, or a setting like the address, and read just that, it would read. Select the address, hit Read, it would read CV29 and then CV1, 17, and 18. Pick start voltage, and it would read CV2. Eventually the whole sheet loaded. This is a decoder MRC has said didn;t support readback - more along the lines of, readback is broken, so we'll have tech support just tell people it doesn't read. Very useful, since the owner of the loco couldn;t remember what decoder he had put in this loco, but I was able to read the manufacturer ID and version.
OH the real reason I think I can get locos lwith Tsunamis and other to program on my Zephyr program track - I use a DT40x throttle, not the Zephyr console. I do think the timing os setting CV17 and 18, and then changing CV29 to use long address are different with the throttle compared to the Zephyr console - this is usually the problem - CV17 and 18 get set to the selected long address but CV29 never gets changed and so the active address stays at 3. The Zephyr console tries to immediately program all 3 CVs. With a DT40x throttle, it sets 17 and 18, and then you get a prompt to use 4 digit addressing, so there is a delay until you hit the Y button.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Sorry Randy, what you posted went totally over my head! Maybe it doesn't matter that I don't understand, as we are operating with different equipment. My hand held throttle is a DT 300.
Did you try programming using the DT300, instead of the Zephyr panel? Mostly the same, just a lot harder since the DT300 doesn't have as many buttons as the DT40x, so you have to use Shift-<button>button as well as just <button> and use the dials to enter numeric values.
SImpler explanation? Changing from the default address of 3, whioch is a short address, to a long address, requires changing 3 CVs - CV17 and 18 hold the long address, and CV29 does, among other things, tell the decoder which address to use - the short address in CV1 or the long address in CV17 and 18. All modern DCC systems take care of this for you - you tell the system what address you want to use, and it sets up the CVs to use the specified address. One of the things that seems to cause issues on the Zephyr is that it sends all three CV values in quick succession. On a DT40x throttle, when you change the address, it sets the address CVs (17 and 18) and then prompts you if you want to activate the long address - so there is a human delay between setting CV17 and 18, and setting CV29.
The older QSI decoders are another one that seem to want to have the CVs programmed more slowly - they have a verbal readback option for programmin on the main, so that when you use Ops Mode on Digitrax, it will immediately speak the CV number and value you just set - like if you set CV2 to 5, it will then speak "C V two equals five". Even with that featured turned off, my contention is the decoder won't accept new program commands during the time it would be speaking if the feature was turned on - if I use the Zephyr control panel to program the address, it almost always fails, yet if I use my DT400 plugged in to the Zephyr to set the address - it always works. Everything else is the same, the difference being where the program commands are originating, the Zephyr built in throttle or the external DT400. This, I think, is as much the cause of the "system X can't program decoder Y without a program track booster" as any actual lack of program track power.
cacoleOne thing you forgot to mention is, which DCC system are you using? That's going to make a difference in CV values, because if you have a Digitrax system you have to enter leading zeros for some entries, but with NCE you don't use leading zeroes.
NCE doesn't use leading zeros in CVs, but does require them if using a long address shorter than 128 (IIRC). For instance, My DL-535E locos are number 60 and 64, so I have to enter leading zeros, for example 0060 and 0064. I use two, but it may be that only one is required, I just don't recall right now.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
Digitrax does not use leading zeros for anything. Where does this stuff come from?
You want address 8, you enter 8. Not 008, or 08, or 0008. You want addres 512, you enter 512. Not 0512. Though actually it just ignores any leading zeros keyed in.
Address 1-127 in Digitrax are ALWAYS short addresses. Address 128+ are ALWAYS long addresses. No exceptions.
Other systems vary. In NCE, 1-127 can be long or short, and they are not the same. You cna have long address loco 10 running with short address 10, but it is not recommended to use short addresses for 1-127 because these are also the consist alias addresses. With Lenz, 1-99 is always short, 100+ is always long.
NP2626 Yes, I have the original Digitrax Zephyr, DCS50. I will try your fix, Geared Steam, thanks for the help!
Geared Steam, Do you still have the PTB-100 and would you be willing to sell?
NP2626:
If you are going to use the Zephyr console for programming the 4 digit addresses adding a PTB100 isn't going to solve the CV29 problem. You will still need to set CV 29 manually. I have this system (Zephyr and PTB100) and I have found that it just won't set CV 29 along with the other address CVs. Like Randy, I found that if I used my DT400 for address programming it worked fine. I do need the PTB100 to read CVs on the programming track.
Joe
Unitil I bought a locomotive with a Soundtraxx Tsunami decoder, none of this was ever any problem. I was able to write and read 4 digit loco addresses. Although I haven't tried to read one lately, I have no reason to believe I can't still do this with my Zephyr DCS50 right now.
I need to take some time and read my Zephyr manual and read up on all this as the honest to gosh truth is, I really don't even know what CV29 is. I haven't had to do anything with my Zephyr other than assign new addresses, read an occasional one that I had forgotten and run trains. Although I like DCC, I am not into understanding how it works; but, can with effort, figure this stuff out. I use them as a method of controlling my trains. It's only a tool and having been around tools all my life, I simply use them and don't have any deep desire to understand the inner workings!
NP2626 Geared Steam, Do you still have the PTB-100 and would you be willing to sell?
Nature of the beast, Tsunamis require more 'oomph' on the program track than most any other decoder. The only ones that similarly have issues are QSI. The decoder makers say they are within NMRA standards (mainly because there isn't one for program track power). I say, if every other brand of decoder works, it's the decoder. But of course they have a vested interest in NOT fixing it, because they sell you an add-on component that makes it work. Yes, I make no secret of my dislike for the Tsunami - mainly because everywhere you go, it's "Tsunami this or Tsunami that". When first ANNOUNCED, the features of the Tsunami were head and shoulders above anything else avaialble. Unfortunately, there were problems and the actual release was delayed by several years, By then, other manufacturers like ESU had improved their decoders to beyond what Tsunami was going to have - in fact since the Tsunami announcement, ESU has introduced 3 upgrades to their decoders, each with more features. Since Tsunamis became available for purchase, there really hasn;t been any design changes, just some additional form factors released. They made one change recently - the newest ones have a connector for their keep alive circuit, which is a real keep alive - the standard capacitor just keeps the sound on. The most annoying missing 'feature' for me is the lack of CV5 top speed and CV6 mid speed settings so you can do a simple 3 step speed matching. That's all i ever set with my other decoders to match loco speeds for consisting - no need to mess with 28 step speed tables. Unless you run Tsunamis.
You CAN program them witht he Zephyr - use Ops Mode on the main, or use the Blast Mode. Or try the throttle instead of the console. Or use a calculator liek this one: http://www.2mm.org.uk/articles/cv29%20calculator.htm to determine the values you need for CV17, 18, and 29 and then instead of using the standard address setting procedure, individually set each of the three CVs to the necessary values. That should work.
Randy
The CV17,18 and 29 method has worked well for me with my old DCS50. When I got my new DCS51 I tried 4 digit programming and it was the same story. I now always use the "manual" method of setting the 3 CVs and it works every time. It's sad that a popular decoder maker won't recognize the shortcomings of its product and make some changes. When the time comes I am going to convert to ESU or, if TCS has come out with their diesel decoder line I'll give them a try. Goodbye Tsunami for me.
I guess had I known that this locomotive and Tsunami decoder required this additional equiment, I may have forgone the purchase. However, Walthers USRA 0-8-0 is maybe the only current offering for an N.P. steamer on the market.
I am going to sit down and read my Zephyr DSC50 manual, as soon as I find the time and make a decision on what to do. Like I said, I have the address set, just need to get it to have a throttle setting, other then full speed.
You may have somehow inadvertently set CV 5 (Max Voltage) or CV 6 (Mid Voltage) to a value other than zero. Try programming those two CVs to zero and see if that corrects the problem with speed control.
Tsunami's do not support CV5 or CV6. So I don't think that is the problem.
Use the calculator to determine what CV29 should be - make sure it isn;t set to a value that activates the speed tables.
But what you MAY have done is inadvertantly set CV2 to something high. Set it to 0 to start with. That's the start speed. If it leeaps to near full speed as soon as you crack the throttle, it's probably CV2 that is the culprit.
The following is the processes I have used on this locomotive to get to where it now is:
I set it on the programing track and attempted to set 1172 as its’ address, following my Digitrax Zephyr manual for programing the decoder to a new address. The address did not seem to take. I moved it off the programing track and attempted to call up the loco and other than the sounds for the loco sitting idle being heard there was no response. I attempted to read the decoders address and the Zephyr could not read anything. I put the loco back on the programing track and attempted to write the new address to it again. Still nothing. I quit attempting to fool with it, read the limited instructions that came with the loco and found that SoundTraxx recommended their Programing Track Booster PTB-100. I went to the SoundTraxx website and read up on the decoder and asked on this Forum what was needed to get this thing to work right. It was suggested I attempt to program on the main, this I did and got the address installed in the loco. Put the loco back on the Programing Track and read back its’ address, 1172. Put the loco on the main and attempted all sounds which worked, horn, bell, coupler clank, the turbo (steam generator) started up when the lights were activated. However, the throttle response is either off/full; but, directions (forward/Reverse) works correctly.
In a nutshell, the above is what I have done. If I could accidentally messed up a CV by doing what I did, then maybe that’s what happened.
Won't hurt anothing, use ops mode (Po) after selecting the address and set cv2 to 0. That's the default value anyway. Now see if it just takes off at full speed or not. You can also try resetting the Zephyr in case it is something stored there - see the manual of OpSw setting and close OpSw 39 to reset the whole thing - like rebooting your computer. Cycle power after doing this.
Before I bought the PTB100,I could write to Tsunami decoders with my PR3 but sometimes had to do it more than once for the decoder to "take" the new data.I later learned that raising the input voltage to the PR3 would have probably done it.
Since you could write and read your new adress,I assume you may be able to do any CV just the same,possibly not the first time all the time without a booster.
I'd try to read CV2 (start voltage) first,it should read 0 (default).Someone may have given it a very high value,thus the "one notch" throttle.If such is the case,writing 0 to CV2 should cure your problem.If it doesn't,let us know.There's an other way to set throttle on Tsunamis.
I have three conversations going on about the trouble I'm having. This thread, Emails to SoundTraxx talking with a gentleman named George Bogatiuk and emails to Support at Digitrax. I have looked through both my manual for my Digitrax Zephyr DCS50 and the general manual for Digitrax Decoders. I have also looked through some of the 70+ page manual for the Soundtraxx Tsunami decoder. There is references to the various CVs which might correct my problem. However, actually going into the CVs to read and possibly change them seems very nebulous to me!
Reading text such as this stuff gives me trouble, as I have some comprehension problems, obviously, pertaining to computer stuff.
I have not; but, am about to get out my Digitrax Big Book and see if I can find simple language on how to fix my problem.
I want to thank everyone who has tried to help me!
Do you know of any other modeler and/or a club within a reasonable drive from you?Clubs usually have the necessary hardware and knowledgeable members to help you out.Even if you're not a member,modelers are generally very kind people who will gladly look into your problem and even do some fine tuning for you.
There will be nothing in the Big Book, it came out LONG before the Tsunami and even the Zephyr.
You could just trust us and set CV2 to 0. If it's already 0, nothing will change. If it's set to some large number, causing your full throttle alll the time problem, it will fix it. Look at what CV2 is in the manual - Start Speed. Clearly, if it is set to a large value, the start speed will be high. Start with the basic CVs - 1 is the short address, 2 is Start Speed, 29 is the configuration, 17 and 18 are the long address. While it might be useful to understand the math between translating your address to the values to put in CV17 and 18, you really don;t have to know that - the calculator on the web site I linked does the math for you. Likewise, it may be useful to eventually know the options for CV29, however, if that confuses you for now, just use a calculator that tells you waht to put there - the one I linked does both CV29 and the long address. Digitrax has an iOS app that has such calculators in as well, they might have it for Android too.
Randy, I don't miss-trust you! I simply don't know how to go about accessing the CVs to see what is put in there. Everyone talks like it's so simple and I have no doubt it is, I just don't know how to start!
Jacktal, in the 26 years I've been building my layout, I have run accross nobody else in my small town of 6-7 thousand that are model railroaders; or, in talking to others about what I do for hobbies, no one has said to me: Oh, Bob down the road is a model railroader. Doesn't mean there aren't any, just means we are few and far between.
Stick to the programming section of the Zephyr manual. The part about programming other CVs, not the address.
If the loco is at least responding to the correct address - ie, a unique value not shared with another loco, just do this to make sure CV2=0:
Select the loco - verify it by running it, turning the lights on/off, whatever. Just to validate the selected loco is the one you are trying to program. As long as you have no other locos using this address you do not have to clear off the layout.
Press the Program button until the display says OPS
Pres the CV button.
Hit 02 so it show 02 in the display.
Press the CV button.
Hit 00 so it shows 00 in the display
Press CV-WR to write the value.
Press Exit to get out of programming - display should show loco address. Now see if it takes off at full speed when you crack the throttle.
This is on page 21 of the Zephyr manual.