OK, now there's been another weekend - though I myself was not home all weekend, had a wedding to attend in the western part of the state. GOing away next weekend for my borthday, so I won't be posting then, either. Didn;t even have a chance to fire up my laptop and work on my layout plan, though I DID think of yet another option that I want to try.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Jim
rrinker Last post was Sunday, it's just Tuesday morning now. Not everyone has time to work on their layout every day after work. I don't think he's gone, yet. When a week goes by without another word - then we can toss the whole thread on the trash heap. --Randy
Last post was Sunday, it's just Tuesday morning now. Not everyone has time to work on their layout every day after work. I don't think he's gone, yet. When a week goes by without another word - then we can toss the whole thread on the trash heap.
Alton Junction
rrinker Not everyone has time to work on their layout every day after work.
Not everyone has time to work on their layout every day after work.
Except that in this case, no one is asking the OP to work on his layout.
There is simply a need to clarify the problem.
Here is what we have so far from the OP.
I have a DCC layout and all of my turnouts have insulated frogs.
Please tell me and include a sketch of how to wire them so I don't have electrical shorts.
The frogs are metal on my Peco Insul turnouts.
On further review, the turnouts that I have the trouble with are PECO and when I run a steamer with a short wheel base across these turnouts, the engine stalls.
Depending on the frog style, how do I wire it so the small steamers don't stall.
What we need to know is (1) whether the Peco is an Insulfrog or Electrofrog (2) where on the turnout the loco stalls (upon entry, at the frog-?) and (3) how the turnout is currently wired.
Rich
P.S. Is it a short or a stall? How is the OP determining this?
Soo Line fan The smoking train seems to have run out of steam....................
The smoking train seems to have run out of steam....................
Still don't know exactly which type of Peco turnout we are dealing with.
And Peco Insulfrog, like Atlas Custom Line, should be powered on all 3 legs WITHOUT the gaps, to make sure each rail has a power supply not relying on the rivet or half joiner pivot points (though for absolutely ideal operation, jumpers should be installed around those pivot points so even the point rails have a solid source of power).
If the OP has Electrofrogs, there should already be a wire underneath attached to the frog to provide a connection to power it. Are the original Code 100 style ones different than the new Code 83 ones, in that the couple of Code 83 ones I picked up to test out have complete instructions included with them on how to hook them up. It's not the easiest thing to find, but the instruction sheets are on the Peco web site, as well.
cacole If the turnouts are Peco Insulfrog, there's no way to correct the problem with small wheelbase locomotives stalling on the insulated, plastic frog. If you must run such locomotives, then you need Electrofrog turnouts.
If the turnouts are Peco Insulfrog, there's no way to correct the problem with small wheelbase locomotives stalling on the insulated, plastic frog.
If you must run such locomotives, then you need Electrofrog turnouts.
The photos on this web site illustrate this gapping issue.
http://railwaybobsmodulebuildingtips.blogspot.ca/2013/01/the-peco-electrofrog-circuitry.html
SMOKING TRAIN Thanks all for your comments on my turnout problem. On further review, the turnouts that I have the trouble with are PECO and when I run a steamer with a short wheel base across these turnouts, the engine stalls. Depending on the frog style, how do I wire it so the small steamers don't stall.
Thanks all for your comments on my turnout problem. On further review, the turnouts that I have the trouble with are PECO and when I run a steamer with a short wheel base across these turnouts, the engine stalls. Depending on the frog style, how do I wire it so the small steamers don't stall.
But, we still need you to clarify with certainty if these turnouts are Peco Insulfrogs or Peco Electrofrogs.
I suspect that they are Peco Insulfrogs with plastic frogs and, if so, the plastic frogs cannot be powered to prevent stalls on slow moving short wheel base steam locos.
Just out of curiosity, are these turnouts HO scale?
Thanks for clarifying exactly what you have and why you need help with the wiring. It appears that you don't really have electrical shorts, but electrical interruptions.
If you must run such locomotives, then you need Electrofrog turnouts, and complete wiring instructions for them are in the package and on the "Wiring for DCC" web site cited above.
Specifically what Smoking Train said was, "The frogs are metal on my Peco Insul turnouts."
All Peco Insulfrogs, regardless of gauge, have plastic frogs.
So, he either has Peco Insulfrog turnouts with plastic frogs or he has Peco Electrofrogs with metal frogs.
Cacole,
Agree on Your statement. Info is there though...if He need's it.
Never answered my very first questions.
Take Care!
Frank
In his first message, the OP says he has "isolated" turnouts (whatever that's supposed to mean) with insulated frogs; then in a subsequent posting he says Peco turnouts with metal frogs, so the issue is becoming too confusing due to contradictory information provided by him.
SMOKING TRAIN (the OP) has not entered any bio, so we don't even know what country he is in, and he doesn't say what SCALE his layout is -- could be O, HO, or N scale because Peco makes all sizes. Peco even makes some G scale trackwork as well as European, U.S.A., and Narrow Gauge trackwork, and the frogs in them may be different than HO scale turnouts, which we all seem to be assuming is the scale he has.
Smoking Train,
Two diagrams of Peco Insul-frog and Electro-frog turnout wiring/with explanation. Easy to follow:
http://www.dccwiki.com/Wiring_Turnouts
A picture speaks a thousand words and saves 20 questions.
rrinker Well, depends on how far in you call it the 'frog' - since the metal powered rails come so close together except for said little sliver of plastic to insulate them.
Well, depends on how far in you call it the 'frog' - since the metal powered rails come so close together except for said little sliver of plastic to insulate them.
I have a DCC layout and all of my turnouts have insulated frogs. Please tell me and include a sketch of how to wire them so I don't have electrical shorts.
But, now, I am not sure as I re-read it whether he is asking how to power the frog or how to power the turnout.
In any event, now he says that the frogs are metal which Insulfrogs are not. So, if he has Peco Electrofrogs, which do have metal frogs, then he needs to gap the inner rails beyond the frog to avoid shorts.
Right now, I have no idea which turnouts he has until he clarifies this for us.
SMOKING TRAIN The frogs are metal on my Peco Insul turnouts.
Are you sure that they are metal?
Are you sure that they are not Peco Electrofrogs which have metal frogs?
Well, depends on how far in you call it the 'frog' - since the metal powered rails come so close together except for said little sliver of plastic to insulate them. I guess in terms of real railroading, you could call them a "plastic insert frog" - vs. the prototype's manganese insert frogs.
Or just ignore it all and run trains.
I agree with Randy that you should add feeders to all three ends of each Peco Insulfrog.
However, the Peco Insulfrog has a plastic frog, so it cannot be powered.
As Randy indicated, no insulated rail joiners are required unless the turnout is going to be the entry point or exit for a reversing section.
It is possible for a short to occur on a Peco Insulfrog if metal wheels bridge the narrow gap where rails of opposite polarity come close together right beyond the frog. Should that occur, you can use clear nail polish to insulate the rail at that point.
Peco Insulfrog turnouts can be just used as is, no special wiring. The metal frog is insulated, hence the name. You can attach feeders to all three legs for best power tranfer, no insulated joiners or any other special wiring needed.
SMOKING TRAIN I have a DCC layout and all of my turnouts have insulated frogs. Please tell me and include a sketch of how to wire them so I don't have electrical shorts.
Tell us more. What brand and type of turnouts do you have? Peco Insulfrogs? Atlas Custom Line? Whatever.
Are your frogs metal or plastic? Metal, I assume, because you cannot power a plastic frog.
You need to include the brand name of the turnouts, Atlas, Peco, ME, etc. in order for people to be able to help You. Also scale would not hurt. N-scale, H0-scale. Are they all the same etc.
A very good site....to read and keep as a reference. Just click on link:
http://www.wiringfordcc.com/track.htm