I went back and re-read one of the books I have been using to figure out how to do things, David Popp's "Building a Model Railroad Step by Step," and there it was, the need to insulate the rail. I had read it a couple of times, but being a bit overwhelmed with all of this, I didn't understand what he was saying. As it turns out, experience is the best teacher. I am going to try cutting the rail and using a little piece of plastic as an insulator.
Richard
Thanks, Ed.
Allan Gartner's website is still the Bible, but I really to like Railway Bob's site.
That link is actually a four-part series. Here are the links to all four pages.
http://railwaybobsmodulebuildingtips.blogspot.com/2011/06/insulfrog-or-electrofrog-that-is.html
http://railwaybobsmodulebuildingtips.blogspot.ca/2011/06/fixing-short-in-peco-insulfrog.html
http://railwaybobsmodulebuildingtips.blogspot.ca/2013/01/the-peco-electrofrog-circuitry.html
http://railwaybobsmodulebuildingtips.blogspot.ca/2013/01/the-peco-electrofrog-modifications.html
Rich
Alton Junction
That's a great link, Rich! The old standby was Alan Gartner's site but the one you posted is much easier to understand!
http://www.wiringfordcc.com/switches.htm
ANYONE having trouble understanding power routing turnouts should study the diagrams in the link you provided! Bravo!
Ed
Scroll down the page on this link and you will see some photos of how it is done.
I agree with Randy and note that if you gap both rails leading from the frog and want to maintain power to the spurs, you need only a feeder to the spur rail leading from the frog, not both spur rails.
Dante
Well, you cna also use a jeweler's saw, or a thin cutoff wheel on a Dremel to make the gaps, they don;t HAVE to be insulated joiners. When making gaps this way, it's usually best to glue in a small piece of styrene (get the thickness of the saw blade - it will fit right in), then when the glue dries you cut off the excess and file it all smooth so there's no bump. This way you cna cut gaps wherever you need them, not just at rail joints. The gap for the frog rails does not have to be right agaisnt the turnout. It can be a foot away for all that it matters, so long as any feeders are past the point of the gap, that's the critical thing.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
As always, thanks for the instructions. I get it now. I wish I had known this before I soldered and glued down my track. Good news is it is held down with caulk so I should be able to pull it up and replace the joiner. Oh well, live and learn.
Two joiners, one on each of the rails that comes together int he middle of the turnout. Those are the frog rails. You will also need to supply power to the siding if you do that, with additional power feeds.
OR it actually will work with just one insulated joiner on each turnout - on the one frog rail that is part of the main oval. In that case, you need no feeders on the sidings, and when you throw the turnout back to the main, any loco sitting on the siding will be shut off. This is an OK solution, the first is the better, with a simple toggle switch in one of the wires feeding the siding to be able to park a locomotive there.
At a MINIMUM you need two insulated joiners or gaps:
One here:
AND one HERE:
IF you can, try to slide the joiner to one side on the rail coming away from the FROG on the main line. By no means a permanent fix but if you can separate the rail ends you will see your short disappear.
This should get you running again... Ed
Put insulated rail joiners on both turnouts' rails that diverge from the frog. That's where the short circuit is happening, because the frog polarity changes when you throw the turnout.
davidmbedard Install insulating rail joiners beyond the frog. David B
Install insulating rail joiners beyond the frog.
David B
Unfortunately, I am not entirely sure what this means; I have read everything I can, but the nominclature of turnouts is still a mystery to me. I have feeders on the entry joiners to both turnouts. Should there be insulating joiners on all of the outbound rails from the turnout?
David's right.
When you throw the points to go into a siding, the two main line rails are effectively shorted because whichever route is NOT aligned becomes electrically joined by the switchpoints.
Take one of your switches and play with it using a VOM meter and you will soon see how a POWER ROUTING turnout works.
Study diagram #8 http://www.peco-uk.com/imageselector/Files/Instruction%20sheets/N%20Electrofrog%20Turnouts.pdf
This has to be the most often asked electrical issue. http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/11/t/100879.aspx
[edit: You would NOT have to gap the stub end siding UNLESS you add a feeder, then you would. Without a feeder all current has to pass through the switch point and sometimes this causes erratic power issues, THEN you would have to add a gap at the rail near the frog, then add a feeder to that rail beyond the gap.]
Good Luck, Ed
I am new to model railroading and am building a simple layout as a learning experience. The layout looks like the following:
The layout is N-Scale (Code 55) and is built using Peco Flextrack and Electrofrog turnouts. (Insulfrogs are not available in Code 55.) I finished laying all the track and was excited to run a locomotive. I ran the locomotive around the oval and everything was perfect. I switched one of the turnouts and the oval shorted out. I quickly found that my layout, as laid with no insulating joiners, is incompatable with the Electrofrog switches. I am really frustrated and don't know what I need to do to fix it. I would appreciate any help.