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bus wiring

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Posted by rrebell on Monday, February 24, 2014 10:55 AM

Posi-taps are certified for aircraft!

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Posted by streamliner51 on Monday, February 24, 2014 6:02 AM
For the whole story on this read : www.dccconcepts.com

Cornwall,UK

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Posted by CHRIS M on Saturday, February 22, 2014 9:17 AM

My opinion comes from an automotive perspective as I am only just starting to wire for DCC.

There is no more reliable connection than a properly soldered one period case closed. And I do think soldering skills should be talked about more here. My point being if you solder a 36" piece of flex you should be able to properly solder section tract at the joiner and only feed every 36".

Back to the Scotch locks, they allow moisture and then corrosion because they are open to the air, in anything less than a low humidity temp controlled environed I would solder. They are very tempting do to easy of use.

There is one variable.... the telephone company uses a dead end style connector filled with a gel that prevents corrosion and were designed for solid wire of course and would be a better way to go using a "connector" I do not know if they were ever made for 18awg wire though.

Just my 2 cents from a different perspective.

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Posted by ttenordave on Saturday, February 22, 2014 6:47 AM

thanks for all your responses    after years of procrastination think I have everything lined up and ready to go to make the "real" layout  I have always denied myself   cork is layed down &  caulked;  flex track soldered in double lengths;  feeder wires red and black soldered on etc   have never done a power bus thus the post    actually practiced with a couple of my suitcase connectors and the 18  gauge  to 22 connection  and then pried them open to see what really happens inside   the 18 gauge had a nice stripped area  but the  22 had just a little bare wire visible part way around the insulation and seemed a bit kinked like it could easily break  oh well probably the best way to insure connections would be to climb under and strip and solder each one!   will see

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Posted by Phoebe Vet on Friday, February 21, 2014 6:51 PM

I agree with everything that Chuck said.

 

 

Dave

Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow

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Posted by tomikawaTT on Friday, February 21, 2014 5:21 PM

Since this former aircraft mechanic's opinion on anything but solder or (properly torqued) threaded connectors is no secret, I won't repeat it here.  The nasty-word checker would object.

With that out of the way, have you considered WHERE to put the bus wires?  With an over-long ping-pong table, the natural temptation is to route them right down the middle.  That guarantees that most joints will require spelunking under the table.

So, to avoid joining Troglodytes Anonymous, route the busses along the edge of the table, pull your feeders to the edge with a straightened wire clothes hanger and hook them up while sitting in a comfortable chair.  Saves wear and tear on the back and noggin, and guarantees that the work site will be BELOW eye level.  Solder doesn't drip uphill.

Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - with electricals as bulletproof as I can make them)

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Posted by JDberlin on Friday, February 21, 2014 3:39 PM

Use Google or Bing with the words Ideal Stripmaster. Once on the site, click on Tools-they even have a Pdf and will answer all your questions in most languages spoken. they will direct you to a dealer on or off the web. I only wish they had a video showing the two strippers in action!

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Posted by GGOOLER on Friday, February 21, 2014 2:28 PM

i think this is the type they are talking about.

 

i use this on my bus wire and wrap the feeder and solder. stagger the joints alittle and you wont need to tape or use the messy liquid tapes.

 

later

g

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Posted by cedarwoodron on Friday, February 21, 2014 1:14 PM

Jim:

There are a bunch of Ideal brand strippers listed on the Lowes website- the name "stripmaster" doesn't call up any specific one.

Could you specify more on that tool- or provide a quick image?

 

Thanks.

 

Cedarwoodron

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Posted by Mark R. on Friday, February 21, 2014 12:51 PM

This will always continue to be a debate. Personally, I don't trust suitcase connectors to be any more reliable than rail joiners. I just don't like to rely on mechanical contact for electrical connections.

As was mentioned above, I use the automatic wire strippers to displace a bit of insulation on the buss wire and solder my drop feeds at that point.

As for the solid vs stranded debate, either will do the job, but when you are getting into heavier gauge wire, the stranded is much easier to pull through your benchwork.

Mark.

¡ uʍop ǝpısdn sı ǝɹnʇɐuƃıs ʎɯ 'dlǝɥ

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Posted by rrebell on Friday, February 21, 2014 12:30 PM

The suitcase connectors will cut wires in stranded and notch the solid, period.  This may or may not cause a problem, they are not reusable. I use Posi-taps (cheap in bulk), they will not damage the wire (I have cut apart a test peice to prove it to myself as I tend not to trust hype). The feader wires can be solid (24 is fine as long as you do a drop every 3' or so). Buss needs to be stranded (like 14 gauge). My layout is 30x15+ .

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Posted by jrbernier on Friday, February 21, 2014 11:55 AM

  My old layout used #14 solid wire for the main bus, and #20 stranded for the feeders to the track.  I used 3M #905(Red) IDC's for all of these connections.  The #905 will accept #14-#18 for the 'bus' wire, and #18-#20 for the 'tap' feeder.  Be aware that a lot of solid #22 wire has rather 'thin' insulation and may not be held by the IDC  - A 'tug' may pull it out.  I had some solid and stranded #22 and both failed my 'tug' test.  Radio Shack has(or had) #20 stranded, and the Atlas 'hook up' wire sold in your LHS appeas to be stranded #20 as well.  This is what I used for my layout wiring.  Your  5 by 11 HO layout should be able to use #18 with no issues for the 'bus' wiring.  If you use IDC's, you might want to invest in a good IDC clamping tool.  Most IDC failures are due to the modeler using gas pliers or channel locks to drive the  IDC blades home.  Our club used IDC's and out of the 'thousands' used, only one has been an issue.  You can buy IDC's from places like Mouser for 18-22 cents, depending on amount you purchase.  Micro-Mark also handles them, but the cost is a lot higher.

  Another option is to buy an Ideal 'Stripmaster' wire stripper(Lowes has them).  This rather handy tool can cut the insulation and move it aside on a bus wire so you can wrap a feeder to it and solder.  A little 'liquid' insulation paint will seall the connection.  The new layout has not had the wiring done yet, but I am considering this as am option to IDC's  They key to to have a feeder drop for each section of track - Do NOT trust rail joiners to provide power!

Jim

Modeling BNSF  and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin

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Posted by Stevert on Friday, February 21, 2014 11:01 AM

Yes and no.

18 gauge should be sufficient for an HO layout of that size, but I'd suggest stranded instead of solid simply because IMHO it's easier to work with.

As for the Scotchloks, I've used them (and their generic equivalents) on my basement layout for years with no issues at all. 

From my experience, most of the folks that say not to use them have automotive, marine, aircraft, or other "field" backgrounds where yeah, they might not be acceptable due to moisture, vibration, etc.

But my basement layout doesn't exist in those environments so it isn't subject to those considerations.  It won't sink or fall out of the sky if a connection does happen to fail (not that any have, so far...)

But two things to consider:  First, when using the actual 3M Scotchloks, some of them specify whether solid, stranded, or both can be used for the tap/run, as well as what gauges, so be sure to get the right ones.

Secondly, be sure to use either the 3M crimping tool (expensive), or a pair of parallel-jaw pliers.  The jaws on jointed pliers, even Channellocks, move at an angle and will not drive the Scotchlok blade squarely.  I use an Eifel Geared PlieRench, which keeps the jaws parallel when they close.  Works great if you can find one!

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Posted by retsignalmtr on Friday, February 21, 2014 10:28 AM

18 AWG wire is fine for the buss. I prefer 14 AWG stranded myself as it is stronger. Scotch locks are not advised. Solder the feeders directly to the buss or use barrier strips for a better connection

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Posted by MisterBeasley on Friday, February 21, 2014 7:20 AM

Yeah, and the wire gauge debate, too.  Let me start by saying I'm a heretic.  You may throw stones, but I'd prefer the little ones made of walnut shells.

I have a room-sized layout, 19 feet along one wall with a 12-foot extension a couple of feet out from another wall at right angles.  I use 18 gauge wire for my track bus.  It's divided into 5 districts, three protected by circuit breakers and 2 by auto-reverse units.  I have lots of 22-gauge feeders, and I have no power issues.

From my experience, and your results may differ, 18-gauge is fine.

But, my feeders are soldered to the bus.

It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse. 

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Posted by Phoebe Vet on Friday, February 21, 2014 6:55 AM

Welcome   You have probably just relit the IDC (Scotchlock) debate.  There are strong opinions on both sides.  Put me down on the "never on my layout" side.  18 is a little light for DCC but fine for DC.

Dave

Lackawanna Route of the Phoebe Snow

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bus wiring
Posted by ttenordave on Thursday, February 20, 2014 12:48 PM

any problem using 18 gauge solid wire for a bus with scotch locks for a small 5 ft by 11 ho layout  with solid 22 gauge for the feeders?    have read elsewhere that solid wire does not work well with scotchlocks    thanks

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