I have a relatively small layout, only 4x10.
Although the BRVRR layout is small I used #12 wire for the DCC buss and #23 I think, for the feeders. Every piece of flex track and turnout/switch has at least on pair of feeders.
A recent experiment to see how many locos I could power I had 9 sound equipped diesel locos and 2 non-sound locos(powered units of AB/AA pairs) running at once. Mind you without loads and at low speed.
My diesel locos are a mixture of Athearn BB kits, Proto2000 and Atlas.
As a practical matter I seldom run more than 4 or 5 sound equipped locos at a time with passenger trains of from 4-8 lighted cars.
I don't think you have a load problem. I think it is a matter of distribution. Finish putting in your feeders and try again. I'm fairly confident that you will be able to run 4 or more sound locos without a problem. Eight would be a stretch though.
Good luck.
Remember its your railroad
Allan
Track to the BRVRR Website: http://www.brvrr.com/
Can't fault much of what has been said. I have been running DCC since year 2000. My layout is three decks, area 29ft by 34ft. I use NCE Pro, and have each deck on a separate booster. I use 12 gauge for power and limit the length of the runs. I have had as many as 9 road freights on the layout running at the same time, with 2 and 3 units powered, plus yard engines in two terminal areas and have never had a lack of power problem.
The advantage of the 3 power districts is that shorts are easier to find as only the booster affected wil blink and give you a starting point.
I might add that before 2000 and my venture into DCC, I used one of the forerunners, a product called dynatrol, which had a decoder in each engine, but a limited number, I think 18, of channel numbers which made for some interesting shuffling. Others in my group were using the other products. When Dynatrol announced they were giving up, the decoders were a dual decoder that could be used for Dynatrol or DCC. So I was able to convert to DCC and space out buying all the decoders at once.
Bob
I would suspect your bus-and-feeder system, too, but here are a few other less likely things to consider:
Are you running lighted passenger cars? They draw power from the track too (not the battery ones) and you need to account for that when determining your total demand.
I'm assuming that you are not drawing track power to run structure lightrs, street lamps, etc. That would be a no-no.
Try doing your voltage tests with each of your locomotives in turn, with all other removed from the layout. It's possible that one has a problem and is drawing too much current.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
Your voltage drop under load is definitely inadequate feeders/inadequate bus wire. Lately a coupel of peopel have posted total lengths of thir track - but what really matters is how far fromt he command station.booster it gets. You can get a lot of track in not alot of space if it's all double tracked adn there are several yards. The key component is how far the farthest track is - all those prallel tracks int eh yard don;t cound for extra length as you should have a bus run udner the yard and feeders to allt he tracks. If your track extends 50 feet or more from the location of the power source, you shoudl consider stepping up to #12 bus wire. My layout goes around the walls in about a 10x15 space. I have most but not all of my feeders connectect, but the connected ones are distributed around the room, not just all in one spot - I get no slowdowns or loss of voltage.
As for a booster - I was on the fence. I've run as many as 8 locos on my Zephyr, and it still wasn;t overloaded, and I will never have that many runnign on my layotu at one time. But I also want to power accessory decoders deperately, plus I got a great deal on a SUper EMpire Builder Xtra set, so I went for it, the DB150 in booster mode powers my track, the Zephyr powers the accessory decoders.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
All my bus lines are 14 Gauge the feeder lines 22 gauge and none over 6". I think I will finish all of the feeder lines just to see if things smooth out. My track and wheels shouldn't be too dirty because it's all new and hasn't been run that much.
I will, however, do some cleaning just to be sure.
I will eventually be runnning more than 4 locos at once in the very near future. I thinnk I may take my Zephyer over to run the branch line - I already have a UT4r. This will be fine to run one or two locomotives.
Thanks for your help and advice.
Larry
It isn't so much the length of the track, I have just over 300 feet, It's whats on the track that determines the total amps used. As others have suggested with 14 ga bus and feeders every 3-6 feet the Zepher would work for 3 or four locos. it's the eight sound locos at one time that makes the Zepher impractical.
With 250ft of mainline and running three or four locos you could reach the limits of the Zephyr, especially if you have sound equiped locos. What size wire are you using for the DCC buss? 14AWG would be best for the buss. Feeders every three to six feet is ok. Track and loco wheels must be clean. If you get a five amp booster use it to power the main and use the zephyr as a yard or branchline controller. On my clubs layout when we had the five amp system we often overtaxed it with five or six sound loco's, and it would shut down for a few minutes until it cooled down a little. We put an old computor fan to blow air across the heatsink of the DB150. To make your system wireless you'll need a digitrax UR91 or UR92 receiver, and throttles that are radio equiped like the DT400r, DT402r, UT4r. Putting a RRamp meter in series with the DCC buss will tell you how much current your locos are drawing while running.
Since you said you have only installed about 50% of your feeders then I would suggest that that is your problem and a higher current system isn't going to correct it.
Finish installing your feeders then do a quarter test around all your layout.
Peter
Yankee and Florida Flyers!
Thanks for the feedback. First off - yes I have the speeds matched. When I said I wanted to run up to 8 Locos I didn't mean all in one consist.
I model the Georgia RR and it was common to always see 2 - 3 GP7's or a FP7 & GP9, GP40, etc. and my layout has some challanging grades so I need the power. ( I do have a photo of 11 diesels running together on the Georgia Line - back in the day they had to have that many because they could not keep enough of them running to make it from Augusta to Atlanta - true story)
What I mean is I might have one train runnnig at one end of the layout and another somewhere else and then another running on the branch line, etc.
I am wiring sidings and yard tracks where I can cut the power once a locomotive is parked.
I defintly am leaning toward upgrading to 5 amps and it has to have a wireless Cab. With 250 - 300' of track do you think I need a booster?
i regularly run four sound locos with my 2.5 amp Z. at times I've added 2 ABA dc sets to the mix and everything ran fine. however if you want to run 8 at a time that is beyond the practical limits of the Zepher.
Hey Larry
My first thought is, do you have the locos set up for speed match. If they are not, one could be fighting the other. I just came from running on my layout a consist of two sound steamers with a string of cars up a 2% grade. My system is an NCE Power Cab at 2Amps ( some say its 1.7 Amps. I can run 4 or 5 locos at once with short trains.That said, if you want to run eight locos I suggest that you do up grade to more power.I like NCE others like Digitrax.
Enjoy.
Lee
OK - I have finally "joined the rails" on my layout and like all of us I started running some trains.Very quickly I learned something is wrong. If I am running two locomotives in a consist and go any higher than a 2 on the throttle the system starts lugging. It will not operate more than 3 locomotives.
Here's what I have:
DIGITRX Zepher with the RT4 remote - which I am not using at present. I have about 250' of single track main line. In addition there will be added sidings, freight yards, engine terminals with turn table, and a 25' branch line. I would like to be able to run at least 8 locomotives, w/sound, at one time.
I tested the entire layout with a Volt Meter and I am getting at least 14.66 or better all the way around. When I run a 2 consist locomotive set it drops to 8 or 9 and at some points 5. My feeder lines are 3 - 6' apart and installed in about 50% of the layout at tihs point.
A friend has already suggested the NCE PRO - is that better than a Super Chief? Should I add a booster or two?
I want to be able to run at least 8 engines at a time with sound.
What do ya'll think?