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Question regarding the new MTH's SD70ACE DCC ready

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  • Member since
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  • From: Northeast, Ohio
  • 35 posts
Question regarding the new MTH's SD70ACE DCC ready
Posted by jellybean on Friday, April 1, 2011 12:14 PM

I purchased a new MTH SD70ACE DCC ready diesel and turned it over to my friend who is a electrical engineer (retired) and an avid modelrailroader and installs decoders professionally. He installed a decoder that I had  from TCS and upon running it for about 20 minutes it was cooked. He then installed another decoder and heres the message he sent me below.  

Hi Jellybean, 
I installed a 1.3A decoder and test ran the locomotive for approx. 20 minutes, with no cars. When I removed the locomotive from the track, the decoder was so hot that the heat shrink near the motor FETs on the decoder had melted. The motor was so hot that it was painful to the touch.
 
I have written a letter to MTH and will wait for their response. I never got a reply to my e-mail.
 
L.M.
Does anyone know whats going on????
                          
                                                        JB.

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Posted by Hamltnblue on Friday, April 1, 2011 1:07 PM

I would remove the MTH main board and hard wire it.  I hard wired my DCS version to a Tsunami.

Something in the Light board might be causing problems.

Also make sure the speakers are matched to the decoder. The loco has room for 2.  You might have to wire them in series instead of parallel depending on their impedance.

Springfield PA

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Posted by jalajoie on Friday, April 1, 2011 1:14 PM

I have the same problem with the 2 MTH SD70ACe I have purchased.  Last January at the West Springfield train show, the MTH reps told me it was a known problem and the motor must be replaced. I am still discussing with MTH since, but to no avail. I even offered to pay for the motors, still no reply yet.

I am the proud owner of two useless locos.

Jack W.

  • Member since
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  • From: Northeast, Ohio
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Posted by jellybean on Friday, April 1, 2011 1:57 PM

jaljoie, there has to be a whole lot of people out there with this problem, if they try to install a decoder for DCC use.

                                                                                 JB.

  • Member since
    December 2001
  • From: Trois-Rivieres Quebec Canada
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Posted by jalajoie on Friday, April 1, 2011 2:18 PM

I know of another modelist that his loco came so hot, it distorted the shell. Maybe MTH is overwhelmed with returns and this is why I can't get a reply to my emails.

This is not all, a friend of mine bought 3 SD70ACe with Proto Sound 3 factory installed. Out of these 3 loco only 1 retain its cab address, The other 2 will lose programming by simply removing the loco from the track and store it for a short while.

At the Chicago MSI museum three of these MTH SD70ACe did not made the grade and had to be prematurely retired from the layout .

So much for MTH quality.

Jack W.

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Posted by Hamltnblue on Friday, April 1, 2011 2:43 PM

The motors they use are by Canon.  I'm surprised they are having issues with them. Goes to show nothing's perfect.

Springfield PA

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  • From: Reading, PA
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Posted by rrinker on Friday, April 1, 2011 2:58 PM

 I doubt very much it is the motor, those motors are VERY low current draw. It's their crazy wiring for the lighting. Half the current draw of my Stewart switchers with Canon motors is the headlight LED. I measured it running free and it was using just 25ma! I'd run out of slots on a DCS100 before I'd run out of the 5 amps available.

                    --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by jalajoie on Friday, April 1, 2011 3:13 PM

Randy, at first I suspected the lightboard but I did tested it with all light off with the same overheating results. I also tough about bind in the drive train but on DC the loco move steadily at 1.5 Volts.

On DC with a quality meter I could increase the amp drawing in excess of 1.7 Amp with wheels slipping.

Jack W.

  • Member since
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  • From: North Carolina
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Posted by csxns on Friday, April 1, 2011 5:44 PM

I have 5 MTH SD70ACE / SD70M2 one is a sound unit,that one is ok so is 2 no sound.But the other 2 one went back to MTH for a motor replacement and when i git it back the other went bad,had them to send a replacement motor and about 30 min run time it went bad again.So no more MTH for me.

Russell

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  • From: Reading, PA
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Posted by rrinker on Friday, April 1, 2011 11:39 PM

 Wow, sure they are using actual Canon motors and not some knockoff lookalike? I can see issues like a drivetrain bind due to poor quality control but  would not expect to see so many Canon motor failures, nor see them draw nearly 2 amps and not even at stall.

                        --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by redram58 on Saturday, April 2, 2011 8:33 AM

Had the same problem with my mth dcc ready engine.Burnt out 2 d123 decoders & hot motor.Recived new motor after calling mth repair service.The motor was over heating & amp'd out the decoders.New motor problem solved.

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Posted by Hamltnblue on Saturday, April 2, 2011 2:57 PM

jalajoie

I know of another modelist that his loco came so hot, it distorted the shell. Maybe MTH is overwhelmed with returns and this is why I can't get a reply to my emails.

This is not all, a friend of mine bought 3 SD70ACe with Proto Sound 3 factory installed. Out of these 3 loco only 1 retain its cab address, The other 2 will lose programming by simply removing the loco from the track and store it for a short while.

At the Chicago MSI museum three of these MTH SD70ACe did not made the grade and had to be prematurely retired from the layout .

So much for MTH quality.

I wouldn't retire the loco's.  Just replace the DCS  decoders with Tsunami's

There are a few catches which I covered in a thread back in Jan of 2010.

Springfield PA

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Posted by Hamltnblue on Saturday, April 2, 2011 3:05 PM

rrinker

 Wow, sure they are using actual Canon motors and not some knockoff lookalike? I can see issues like a drivetrain bind due to poor quality control but  would not expect to see so many Canon motor failures, nor see them draw nearly 2 amps and not even at stall.

                        --Randy

 

I don't know about the DCC ready version but the original DCS version definitely had canons. I noted it when I changed my first one over to a tsunami.  Thumb is covering the Canon name.

Springfield PA

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Posted by rrinker on Saturday, April 2, 2011 4:09 PM

 Sure looks like the same motor in my Stewart switchers. Maybe a different model or something, but the size and label looks familiar. Definitely no problems with multiples of the Stewart locos.

           --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

  • Member since
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Posted by Hamltnblue on Sunday, April 3, 2011 7:47 AM

The motor is a decent size. Here's what it looks like in the loco:

Springfield PA

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Posted by zxb1 on Sunday, April 3, 2011 9:42 AM

glad i read this thread , I was going to look for one at the train show here in jersey today. specifacly an sd70m-2.

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Posted by Santa Fe Rick on Wednesday, April 6, 2011 8:38 AM

I have 11 of the SD7OACEs and have had NO problems with any of these locomotives. I have several friends who also have these locomotives and have had no problems using DCS and DCC. You would think by reading this thread that there is a high failure rate which I know is not the case. Tongue Tied

Santa Fe - All the way! Missouri Pacific - Route of the Eagles! 

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Posted by jalajoie on Wednesday, April 6, 2011 9:36 AM

I wish I had your luck Santa Fee Rick, between a friend an me we own 5 MTH SD70ACe and 4 of them are worthless.

My friend purchased 3 units factory equiped with Proto Sound 3. Out of these 3 locos 2 will lose their programming as soon as they are removed from the rails.

My own 2 DCC ready locos overheat decoders to the point they burn out.

So out of 5 locos 4 are bad this is a 80% failure rate.

If only MTH would follow with replies do my Emails.

Jack W.

  • Member since
    August 2010
  • From: Southern California
  • 35 posts
Posted by Santa Fe Rick on Wednesday, April 6, 2011 10:32 AM

Sorry to hear about you problems.My advice to you is to keep bugging MTH to honor the warranty and to fix those engines.I have been a MTH customer since 1996 and have only had to return two engines (O scale)for warranty work out of several dozen.It took a couple months but they were fixed.

 

Rick

Santa Fe - All the way! Missouri Pacific - Route of the Eagles! 

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Posted by maxman on Wednesday, April 6, 2011 2:14 PM

If I counted correctly, there were about 15 "good" engines and 10 "bad".  Not a very good success rate.

But I'm wondering if these engines came from different batches, or if the problems are road name specific.  Is there any way to compile a list?

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