Hi,
I'm a true novice and need an idea of what DCC items I'll need to operate this layout (see below) to start accumulating parts.
I plan on running 2 trains (GP-38 or 40) on the main line, plus one switcher for switching. Eventually all 3 will be in operation at once, but for now probably only 2 at once. So, I need a system that'll grow with me. One wireless cab would be nice.
There's 95+- feet of track.
There are 7 Atlas super-switches.
1 double crossover... and a partridge in a pear tree.
No signals (yet...)
It's still got Atlas sectional part numbers for now while I tweak the geometry, but it'll be code 83 flex track throughout.
If it matters, I'll be using magnetic uncuplers in the yard and at each destination.
I don't know much about different mfgs, so any honest help of who to stay away from will be greatly apperciated, too.
Thank you.
-Ed
"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit." -Aristotle
Your needs are pretty basic. Pretty much any system will support your layout. I would avoid the non-expandable entry-level units like the Bachmann EZ Command, because it can't grow and you'll end up buying another system anyway. But, Digitrax, NCE, MRC and Lenz all make good systems that you will be happy with.
You have two reverse loops on your layout. I would plan for two DCC auto-reverse units to control them, to make your train operation more seamless. Again, several manufacturers are available for these.
I would go to a shop which has several different systems available, and hold the throttles in your hand. See which one has the feel you like. The hand-held throttle will be your interface to the system, so if you're happy with the throttle, you will be happy with the system. Note that you can NOT mix-and-match throttles. The NMRA standards for DCC specify all the things that are "trackside," so they are all compatable, but everything on the "control" side generally has to come from the same manufacturer or it won't play together.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
In my opinion, the two best starter systems that are expandable are Digitrax and NCE. The Digitrax starter set has a base station similar looking to a DC power pack that is meant to be in one location. The NCE system uses a hand held controller that can be moved around the layout.
As far as I know, there are no wireless entry level systems. For that you will have to start with a more powerful system. Again, either Digitrax or NCE has radio systems.
When you get into DCC, none of the systems provide auxiliary power for operating accessories like the old DC power pack did. However, you can use that old power pack for that purpose.
Because you have two reverse loops, you will have to provide some way of electrically reversing the tracks in the loops. You can do it with a double-pole-double-throw switch, or use two DCC auto reversers. One for each loop. Once you buy the DCC system, then you can look for the auto reversers that will work with your system. Auto reversers for starter systems need to be triggered using low power, and auto reversers are different in their power requirements.
Elmer.
The above is my opinion, from an active and experienced Model Railroader in N scale and HO since 1961.
(Modeling Freelance, Eastern US, HO scale, in 1962, with NCE DCC for locomotive control and a stand alone LocoNet for block detection and signals.) http://waynes-trains.com/ at home, and N scale at the Club.
Do you have a local club or LHS that uses or sells/services DCC equipment? If there is, they can be a knowledge base for you. When I got back into MRR about a year ago the club I joined uses Digitrax so that is what I became comfortable with. I just ordered a Digitrax Zephyr Extra and several other components for the layout that I am making. My friend at the club volunteered to come to my house to help me hook up the system (club DCC expert) when I am ready to do that.
Curt Webb
The Late Great Pennsylvania Railroad
http://s1082.photobucket.com/albums/j372/curtwbb/
Thank you for the info, guys.
I've changed the layout design, again, (someone please stop me!! lol) and I've eliminated the reversing loops. I really like that the trains could reverse direction that way, both for asthetics and function, but it eats up a huge chunk of real estate that I, unfortunately, don't have a lot of.
Curt, there is a local club but I'm a wheelchair user and it's not accessible. I'm going to take a ride in the next few days to a hobby store and look at a few in person and maybe get to try them out.
gandydancer19 As far as I know, there are no wireless entry level systems. For that you will have to start with a more powerful system. Again, either Digitrax or NCE has radio systems.
Actually, although neither the Digitrax or NCE entry level systems come in wireless versions, the Digitrax Zephyr can be upgraded to wireless without buying a more powerful system.
For the Zephyr, it's as easy as plugging in a UR91 (for simplex radio) or a UR92 (for duplex), and buying an appropriately-equipped cab.
I believe the NCE PowerCab can be converted to radio, but that the radio only works with an RB02-equipped PH Pro system and not with the original PowerCab setup.
If that is in fact the case, then yes, in effect to convert the entry-level NCE system to wireless you would need to buy (or simply start out with) a more powerful system.
StevertI believe the NCE PowerCab can be converted to radio, but that the radio only works with an RB02-equipped PH Pro system and not with the original PowerCab setup. If that is in fact the case, then yes, in effect to convert the entry-level NCE system to wireless you would need to buy (or simply start out with) a more powerful system.
For the most part Steve is correct. However, you could upgrade a Power Cab to wireless (without the PH Pro system) with the following NCE components:
That's 3 components to Digitrax's two but you also increase total power output from 1.7A to 5A. If extra power is unnecessary, the wireless upgrade for the Zephyr would be the least expensive route of the two.
Tom
https://tstage9.wixsite.com/nyc-modeling
Time...It marches on...without ever turning around to see if anyone is even keeping in step.
tstage Stevert: I believe the NCE PowerCab can be converted to radio, but that the radio only works with an RB02-equipped PH Pro system and not with the original PowerCab setup. If that is in fact the case, then yes, in effect to convert the entry-level NCE system to wireless you would need to buy (or simply start out with) a more powerful system. For the most part Steve is correct. However, you could upgrade a Power Cab to wireless (without the PH Pro system) with the following NCE components: Smart Booster (SB3a) - Essentially a 5A PH Pro Command station and booster RB02 base station CAB-04pr, -04er, or -05r wireless throttle That's 3 components to Digitrax's two but you also increase total power output from 1.7A to 5A. If extra power is unnecessary, the wireless upgrade for the Zephyr would be the least expensive route of the two. Tom
Stevert: I believe the NCE PowerCab can be converted to radio, but that the radio only works with an RB02-equipped PH Pro system and not with the original PowerCab setup. If that is in fact the case, then yes, in effect to convert the entry-level NCE system to wireless you would need to buy (or simply start out with) a more powerful system.
You said you could upgrade the PowerCab to radio "without the PH Pro system" (your emphasis).
Later, you described the SB3a as "Essentially a 5A PH Pro Command station and booster"
But if you "upgrade" your PowerPro with an SB3a and another cab, you're pretty much replacing the command station and booster functions of the PowerCab, aren't you, with what you yourself described as "Essentially a 5A PH Pro Command station and booster"?
So while technically not a PH Pro, you're still not so much upgrading the PowerCab to radio as you are replacing it with what amounts to a different, "Essentially a 5A PH Pro Command station and booster" system** that supports radio.
Considering all that, I think that what I originally said still holds true: " in effect to convert the entry-level NCE system to wireless you would need to buy (or simply start out with) a more powerful system."
** But the SB3a only supports four cab addresses, doesn't it? Plus, if you add up the prices (using Tony's street prices) of the original PowerCab you're "upgrading", the SB3a, the Magnaforce MF615 to power the SB3a, the RB02, and a Cab04pr (the least expensive radio cab), you actually come out spending about the same as a PH Pro-R and Magnaforce MF615 would cost you. So what's the advantage of going the "upgrade" route instead of simply getting the PH-Pro-R in the first place?
Steve,
Did I not say in the very first sentence that you were correct for the most part? You stated that you believed "the NCE PowerCab can be converted to radio, but that the radio only works with an RB02-equipped PH Pro system..." [underscore mine] I merely pointed out that the RB02 base station could be used with the Smart Booster (SB3a), too. At least that's what is alluded to on pg. 3 and pg. 6 of the SB3a manual.
A note of clarification is also in order, Steve. What I meant by "upgrading the Power Cab to wireless" was merely adding wireless capability to one's Power Cab; just like you gave with the Zephyr. Unless I misunderstood you, you weren't changing the configuration of the Zephyr unit, were you? I understood it as you were "adding" a UR91 (or UR92) and a Digitrax wireless throttle to the Zephyr, yes?
For the sake of argument, one could send in their Power Cab to NCE to have it physically upgraded to wireless, thereby eliminating the need to purchase an additional wireless throttle. However, I can't tell you right off hand the cost of converting a Power Cab to wireless. And, yes, I never disagreed with you nor implied that, in order to go wireless with a Power Cab, you had to "buy a more powerful system".
Now, getting to the point at hand, Steve, about whether upgrading from a Power Cab to wireless and purchasing a PH Pro-r system would essentially be equivalent in price, let's use the discounted prices on TTE's web site as a comparison, as you suggested:
PH Pro-R system: $590.90
Power Cab upgrade to wireless: $442.82
*Again, Steve, I am basing my calculations on the Power Cab having already been purchased.
So, by the figures above, an upgrade to wireless by purchasing a SB3a, Magna Force MF615 wall transformer, RB02 Base station, and CAB-04pr throttle is nearly $150 cheaper than purchasing the PH-Pro-R system outright. And, if one eliminated the CAB-04pr throttle and physically upgraded the Power Cab to wireless, one might surmise that the cost would logically drop a bit further. And...I've increased from 1.7A of total output power to 5A....and I have an additional throttle. (As compared to the PH Pro, that is.)
But, as noted in my earlier post, Digitrax's upgrade to wireless would be cheaper with the Zephyr:
Zephyr upgrade to wireless: $219.90-$229.90
- i.e. assuming that what you stated in your earlier post, Steve, is indeed true. And I have no doubt of that.