Staging yard block detection

[Renegade1c]

I recently added a 3 track hidden staging yard to my layout. The yard is completely hidden from view. I would like to setup a panel on Facia that indicates if the track is occupied. I would like to also have a section at the end that lets the operator know when to stop. I would also like them to have an indicator that they have clear the switches leading into the yard. 

I drew up a basic diagram of what I was thinking. The green and red  dots are LED's. Off would indicated empty track. The reason for the red dots are help the operator stop before the end of the track.

I do have a block detection system on the rest of the layout (all cars have resistor wheel sets) What I am looking for is something that does not require input to a computer. I simply want something that would indicate if a track is occupied or not on a fascia panel.

Can anyone suggest a circuit that i can use to do this. Even IR sensors are an option.

Thanks!

[rrinker]

This: http://home.cogeco.ca/~rpaisley4/DccBODvt5.html

Cheap, and it will drive LEDs directly. No need to conenct it to anything else other than a power supply.

                              --Randy

 

[CSX Robert]

You did not state if you are using DC or DCC, but if you are using DCC here are a couple more options:

 Digitrax BD4

Team Digital DBD22 

[MisterBeasley]

Thinking in an entirely different way, you might want to consider using a cheap miniature "spy camera" and an old TV screen.  This would give you a direct view of he hidden staging.  Not only can you tell when tracks are occupied, but also which train is there and which direction it's heading.

I have an old video camera and an old "travel" TV.  The former has a broken tape transport mechanism, and the latter has no sound.  Between the two, I have a great system for looking at my hidden subway staging tracks.

[Renegade1c]

Sorry I forgot to mention I am using DCC. I use RR cirkits block detection (BOD-8) on the rest of my layout and their boards have LED's on them to show which blocks are occupied but unfortunately there doesn't seem to be a way to output those to a Fascia panel. I plan on contacting them and see if they know a way to do that.

Thanks for the suggestions on detectors. I need to research them all a little more. I'll post the results when I get it all installed.

 

[CSX Robert]

Renegade1c

...I use RR cirkits block detection (BOD-8) on the rest of my layout and their boards have LED's on them to show which blocks are occupied but unfortunately there doesn't seem to be a way to output those to a Fascia panel...

My first thought was to just remove the LED's from the board and add wires to them to extend them to the fascia, then I looked at a picture of the board and realized the LED's are apparently surface mount and not real easy to get to.  This may still be an option if you feel comfortable doing so(you could use different LED's at the fascia to make them easier to mount).  If not, the outputs from the board can most likely drive LED's, but I would definately check with RR-Cirkits to make sure.  If they can, simply wire an LED between +5 and the matching output, being sure to use an appropriate current limitng resistor and making sure to match the polarity on the LED.

[RR-CirKits]

Hi,

Actually it is very simple to add panel LEDs driven from our RR-CirKits BOD-8 block detectors. The outputs are 5V logic levels, active low. Use the 5V supplied in the ribbon cable on pin 6 connected to the panel LED anodes. Use about 1K resistors in series with each LED to limit their current. Drive each panel LED's cathode with the appropriate one of the detector card's 8 output lines. There is even a card to make this simple. (FOB-A) It has a pass through connections for the ribbon cables, locations to mount the resistors, and compression connectors for the leads out to the fascia LEDs.

Dick :)

RR-CirKits, Inc.

http://www.rr-cirkits.com

[Renegade1c]

Thanks guys for all your input. I will probably go with Dick's suggestion and continue to use the RR cirkits detectors since I am already familiar with them and now know how to wire them

I will post some pictures when  I get it all wired up and working.

[rrinker]

 I ifgured if you emailed Dick he'd get back to you. I didn't expect he'd sign up and post here! Great guy to talk to (spent a hour or more at his table at the Timonium show a few years back) and he has all sorts of awesome ideas. And great products.

                   --Randy

 

[Renegade1c]

Dick actually replied here on the forums before I got a chance to email him. I have had great luck with his RR cir-kits stuff. It works great and its fairly easy to use. I am definitely considering using his system for signaling as well since it is simply a few add one cards.

[DigitalGriffin]

Is your track supply, DC or DCC?

I can draw you an easy cheap diagram to solve your problem if you don't mind a little voltage drop on the track feeders.

[Renegade1c]

The track supply is DCC but I really don't want something that will drop the voltage to the tracks. I specifically chose the RR cirkits detection system because it completely electrically isolated from the DCC system (except for the Loconet connection). It uses current transformers around the feeders to detect current. It works really well and I'm gonna stick to it.

 

Thanks for all the help!

[Urbane Cowboy]

Hi all,  just wondered if there are any current thoughts on this problem with newer technology.  I am working on a DCC layout with 4 hidden tracks, and would like to know when to stop the locomotive from either direction with block occupancy detection.

Thanks!

[gregc]

Automatic Stopping Blocks

[ATLANTIC CENTRAL]

gregc

Automatic Stopping Blocks

 

Interesting solution.

Many modelers I know have used infrared or optical detectors for staging tracks, but they do require operators to be awake.

I have several DC solutions, and have not settled on which one I will use on my new layout, but can say this for sure, with 28 hidden staging tracks, it will not involve two of my regular detectors for each track, which are inductive.

Infrared or optical are also under consideration. Actually an optical detector could be connected to a relay and kill the track power stopping my DC powered trains in a very short distance.

And this could be fully automatic, the stop curcuit is in play if the exit turnout is against the train. When the turnout is thrown to exit the track, the stop circuit is bypassed and power is restored to the block.

Only a few of my staging tracks are specificly designed for more than one train and they have "escape" turnouts allowing the second train to escape, or allowing the whole track to be used for a longer train.

Most of my trains will be long, 35 to 50  freight cars, 8 to 15 passenger cars.

Sheldon 

[CharlieM]

gregc

Automatic Stopping Blocks

As an amplification to GregC’s approach, I use a block occupancy detector on the stopping section to turn off power to the preceding main staging track section. The main section is powered through a normally closed relay controlled by the block detector such that when the first engine stops in the stopping section all power is removed from the preceding section of track. This does two things. It removes power from all following engines in a consist and, if the main track section is longer than the longest train to be stored, will protect the train from rear end collisions by another train if you forget to reset track routing. This just automates one of Greg’s last steps for his distracted operators.

 

 I use a Digitrax BD4N with a 10K resistor in series to detect occupancy of the stopping section and drive the relay via a single transistor.  The 10K resistor allows the block detector to work but does not allow the engine to power up. No motion and no noise! Applying track power directly to the stopping section via a switch will power up the train and allow it to leave the staging area. LEDs can be added as desired to indicate status and train positions.

 

This works well for a single train per track with entry always from the same end. Multiple trains or entry from either end can be accomodated with additional complexity, This is left as an exercise for the student.

 

Charlie in Northern Colorado