MRC DECODER DEFENCE!!!DARE YA

[DANSGRANDPAPA]

 Hi Guys,

I know, I know, keep the gunfire low till you hear me out,

 I have MRC transformers that almost per date me. (50) that are still employed on DC. When this whole DCC thing showed a profit to the inovators , things were NOT good as I recall. I remember my LHS with STACKS of returns.It didnt matter who MADE them, they were botched in one form or another. Somehow not doing as promised.

Fast fwd to 2009, I personally would not sell them short, The Day will come. Go ahead and throw rocks if you like, I BELIEVE  that thay can pull the collective head out and be one of the finest decoder mfg with sites set in the finest at half cost.........where it belongs. Sound dexoders buy thr "permierm" mfg's is 1119-139. In dollares. Who is gettong fooled here? Might be you, wont be me.

Thereis no good reason in this technological climate, for the FINEST decoder to be beyound 50 bucks. that with sound and EXCELLENT motor control.

BOTTOM LINE. MRC  Come back and show the doomsayers! I OWN many Sheer Bliiliace with no isssue. I Alsow own a 4-6-6-2 that has given me no trouble.

Doug

[jeffrey-wimberly]

 That's to get guys like me and you to open it and see what's happening.

[simon1966]

DANSGRANDPAPA

Thereis no good reason in this technological climate, for the FINEST decoder to be beyound 50 bucks. that with sound and EXCELLENT motor control.

There is every good reason....... 

If a retail price of $50 does  not provide enough revenue then the company will go out of business, plain and simple.  We are talking about quite low volume devices here.  These things are being manufactured and sold by the thousands, not the millions.  There is significant investment in develpoment that has to be recouped over quite a small production run.  You can't simply look at the component cost and conclude that the selling price must be some low number.  If a viable business can not be built then there is no incentive to develop devices for the market.

MRC has tried to cut cost by outsourcing to China and spending little or nothing on quality control.  The vast majority of modellers are willing to pay more for a reliable we designed product.  I don't doubt for one minute that MRC would charge more for thier product if anyone would pay the extra price.

[selector]

There's no doubt in my military mind that MRC can come up with good...uh....goods.  The question, when it comes to their premium decoders, is....why haven't they?  And if anyone claims that they have, I would counter with another question...why do they have so many complaints about them posted on about four major forums that I visit daily?  And it isn't as if the complaints are about how complicated they are to use, or to programme (although that last one shows up now and then), it is about them evidently being 'non-serviceable' as we say in the military...that means broke.

I can't imagine an intelligent person wanting MRC to fail.  They have a good history.  They just need to get with the proverbial programme and provide decoders that work for more than 30-40% of their owners.  It would be good for everyone if MRC could compete, but when Athearn begins to distance itself from that company (as they appear to be), surely someone over at MRC should be taking notice...?

This isn't much of a dare, BTW, it is as shameful as shooting fish in a 50 gallon drum.

-Crandell

[jeffrey-wimberly]

selector

This isn't much of a dare, BTW, it is as shameful as shooting fish in a 50 gallon drum.

In that case you wouldn't need to hit the fish. A near miss would do it. Couldn't resist.

[rrinker]

 While there's no denying that MRC DC packs seem to last nearly forever, I invite you to take one apart sometime. I thinbk they're only rugged and reliable because a DC power pack is a rather simple device. The insides of an MRC pack (and to be honest, everything else I've ever seen in a similar price range) look like someone put them together in their basement. Some of the really high end ones are actually built with top quality circuit boards and so forth, but those are the ones that sold for $200 at a time when an equivalent MRC unit went for $20.

 What gets me is it took MRC 3-4 tries before they finally got the concept that sometimes peopel start out small but actually stay interested in this hobby and build larger and larger layouts and don;t want to throw out their entire control system just to get a bigger one. This is amazing since before DCC peopel did this all the time - unless MRC thought people always threw out their old small pack when they upgraded to the new big one capable of running their new bigger triple track railroad. Or even just upgrading to new technology - did they think people threw out their perfectly good Golden Throttlepack 501 when they upgraded to a transistorized Tech 2 2500? I really doubt many peopel did that, they kept that old 501 and ran a yard, or used it to power their structure lights and switch motors. MRC FINALLY got it right, now you can start with a Prodigy Express and upgade to the features of the Advance Squared without tossing the entire Express system, but it wasn't like that with their previous DCC attempts.

                                      --Randy

[DANSGRANDPAPA]

 divid,

 why are you so defenxeive? past experiance ok? Can I assume that the "past" MRC servered you well? Dont be foolish, when companieis change handos as this did there are massive growing pains. Foremost to none the cash cow made of a good name. pride s a sin,

Doug

[Texas Zepher]

DANSGRANDPAPA

Thereis no good reason in this technological climate, for the FINEST decoder to be beyound 50 bucks. that with sound and EXCELLENT motor control.

There are lots of reasons the "finest" decoder could cost much more than $50.   The current technological climate has not even begun to make the "finest" DCC anything.   Why just because we mere mortals can't afford it.   Take the finest audiophile stereos that currently sell in the $4000 range.   I can't even imagine how much it would cost to make a triode small enough to go on a DCC decoder, let alone getting enough power to it to run the thing.  That would be space program / Area 51 level technology and probably cost in the range of $50,000 per unit.

[Driline]

DANSGRANDPAPA

Foremost to none the cash cow made of a good name. pride s a sin,

 

Seriously dude.....are you on something?

[Paul3]

Doug,
1). MRC makes (and has made) great DC analog powerpacks, and no one has ever said otherwise.  My father's golden throttlepack lasted for 40 years before finally giving up the ghost.  Tech II's are still the standard to which I compare all other DC powerpacks to.  MRC is simply a superb supplier of DC analog powerpacks.

2). All DCC manufacturers have had bad product from time to time.  Digitrax had their bad DH121's and DN163's, NCE had their Atlas S1/2/3/4 decoders, etc.  The difference is that others have upgraded or fixed their problem products.  MRC never has.

3). Why do you believe that MRC will "get it right" with DCC?  They never have yet.  Just because they can build great analog powerpacks doesn't mean they can build digital items.  It's completely different, and whoever is leading their DCC dept. must have compromising pictures of their boss or something...I can't think of any other reason why they still have a job.

4). HO non-MRC sound decoder prices currently are:
Soundtraxx Micro Tsunami :$139.95 MSRP, $111.95 at Tony's 
Soundtraxx Tsunami DSD: $119.95 MSRP, $95.95 at Tony's
Soundtraxx Tsunami AT 1000 (Atlas format): $99.95 MSRP, $78.95 at Tony's
Soundtraxx Tsunami GN 1000 (Athearn Genesis format): $99.95 MSRP, $78.95 at Tony's
LokSound 3.5: $139.00, or $109.95 at Tony's
QSI Revolution-U (Universal format): $119.95 MSRP, $109.95 at Tony's
QSI Revolution-A (Atlas format): $109.95 MSRP, $99.95 at Tony's
Digitrax DH12D + SFX064D $89.94 MSRP, $70.90 at Tony's
Digitrax DH165 + SFX004 Sound Bug $76.98 MSRP, $65.90 at Tony's
Digitrax SDH104K1 Combo: $79.98 MSRP, $64.95 at Tony's

Sound Decoders from MRC:
MRC HO Diesel Modern EMD Snd w plug: $119.98 MSRP, $89.95 at Tony's
MRC HO EMD Switcher: $119.98 MSRP, $77.99 at Tony's
MRC HO Brilliance HO Steam/Diesel: $89.98 MSRP, $67.50 at Tony's
MRC HO Universals: $99.98 MSRP, $64.99 at Tony's
MRC HO Drop Ins: $89.98 MSRP, $58.49 at Tony's
MRC HO Atlas S2/4, HO mini Diesel/Steam: $86.98 MSRP, $56.54 at Tony's
MRC HO Syn Diesel/Steam: $79.98 MSRP, $51.99 at Tony's
MRC HO Atlas Diesel Decoder: $55.98 MSRP, $36.39 at Tony's

5). I am in a 68-member model railroad club, and we've been DCC for over 10 years.  No other decoder brand has given us the problems that MRC has.  None.  We currently have 1000 locos on our loco register, and so I've seen literally hundreds and hundreds of locomotives with DCC decoders.  MRC is, quite simply, the least dependable DCC decoder ever made.  It's gotten so bad that our local LHS (owned by a club member) refuses to order any MRC-equipped locos unless specifcally requested by a customer.  Even then, he'll try to warn them so that they buy the non-sound versions.  He's giving up the extra money because he knows what a pain these decoders are.

6). MRC is the most arrogant DCC company in the entire world (MTH doesn't count).  Go and read the Digitrax, NCE, Lenz, CVP, ESU, Zimo, or any other DCC company's website or ads.  Note that they talk about how wonderful DCC is: "Control your trains, not your track!", "Unleashing the power of DCC!", "The Power of DCC",

Then compare that to MRC's website and ads.

MRC's slogan: "Technolgy.  Perfected" - Um, no, it's not "perfected" since they have so many problems.
MRC's description of the PA2: "The ultimate DCC experience" - Um, no, they don't even come close.  Zimo blows them away.
MRC says they have a "...world beating model railroad decoder line-up..." - Um, only if they are beating the path to the bottom.
MRC's sound decoders are called "Sheer Brilliance" - Um, calling your product some over-the-top adjective does not make them good.

7). They are liars.  I approached them about the Atlas S-unit sound board when they came out at the Springfield show, and when I asked if the sound recording was correct, the factory rep told me with a straight face not to worry but that their sound recording was correct for that engine.  Alco S-units had 539 prime movers that have a straight 6 cyl.  What MRC did was record an Alco 244 as found in RS-3's, and 244's have 12 cyl.  They sound very different.  MRC now even advertizes that their Atlas S-unit board is a 244...and they are lying this time by omission on their website when they don't even mention that these loco never had 244's.  It's sort of like pretending that your Ford Escort has a V-8 in it.  Not good.

8). You say you have "many" working MRC sounder decoder.  Congatulations.  You have beaten the odds.  In my personal experience with many versions of MRC decoders spread out over many years, they have a 50% failure ratio.

9). I want MRC to improve.  Desperately.  Why?  So I don't have to deal with their problems.  I'm not holding my breath, and apparenly, neither is Athearn/Horizon.  If you think they are so great, why don't you ask Athearn/Horizon why they dropped MRC?

Paul A. Cutler III
*******************
Weather Or No Go New Haven
*******************

[MisterBeasley]

NCE, Digitrax, Soundtraxx, QSI, LokSound and Lenz are all "DCC" companies.  They really weren't players in the train market until DCC came along.  As such, they have built their business on DCC, and staked their entire reputations on their ability to turn out a good product.

MRC, to my knowledge, is the only major player in the DCC business that started out as something else.  Maybe their culture is just wrong for what they're trying to do.

[Tilden]

Randy,

 I have an AMPAK ( made by MRC) from the 50's, came with my first train set.  I still use it to power switches and lights.

Tilden

[Hamltnblue]

Many badmouth MRC because they don't last.  I however have found a proven solution that results in the decoder never smoking or going bad for many years. 

1. When you first get your loco run it around the track one time to make sure it works.  

2. Carefully remove the shell and locate the decoder.

3.  Remove the MRC decoder and place it in a static free bag. 

4 . Install a non-MRC decoder.

5.  Place the MRC decoder on a shelf or other safe spot and leave it there.

 

[selector]

Hamltnblue

5.  Place the MRC decoder on a shelf or other safe spot and leave it there.

 

Aaaawwww.....!  Where's the fun in that?  I thought there was supposed to be a step involving a hobby hammer and a center punch.

(Good one, though......)

-Crandell

[tbdanny]

You could give them to an artistically-inclined friend to use as part of a sculputre - 'Futility in Pieces'

[Allegheny2-6-6-6]

 Now I am not the most DCC savvy guy on the planet and most here will attest that I was a supporter of MRC the key word WAS. MRC has made good DC power pack for a long time and their DCC systems are ok and can stand with most other manufactures on an entry level but as far as decoders go they missed the boat. They most definitely have outsourced their manufacturing like a lot of American companies have done in the quest for more a larger profit margin to China. If you have ever had any experience with Chinese manufacturing such as I have these people don't know what a clean room is when it comes to electronics and also do not know the English to Chinese translation for quality control. That being said I had 6 MRC decoders in use in various brands of locomotives 4 of the 6 had problems ranging from just plain stopping and restarting on their own to loosing sound completely, loosing all the functions that were programed into them by myself, to just simply total failure. Not to mention that they employ poorly trained Chimpanzees and most like under paid as well on their tech support staff. Who mangle your properety in the name of customer service.

Now working strictly in a microcosm of my little train world why is it that I have 4 Digitrax, 6 TCS , 4 Loksound and 1QSI decoders in my fleet and have never had one single solitary issue with any of them. Some are in plug & play applications some have been hard wired either by myself or the local DCC guru at my LHS?  As mentioned earlier I am not the sharpest tool in the shed when it comes to DCC but you don't have to hit me in the head with a shovel to see who's product is the worst.

As mentioned by another poster why do they have so many complaints then, I would be willing to bet if one were to take a poll MRC would have more complaints then the rest of the decoder manufactures combined.

Hey if you think MRC junk is fine and the rest of us are warped in out view of MRC then happy happy joy joy for you. If my MRC decoders weren't smashed out in my driveway with a 5lb hand sledge a few weeks a go I would have gladly sold them to you at a very cheap discount.

I will be willing to best that you will experince decoder failures with your MRC stuff sooner or later I am just curious to see if you tell us about it and join the club.

[cacole]

 One thing the OP didn't mention in his defense of MRC decoders is, how many went up in smoke before he got the five or six that are good?

My experience over the years with my own and fellow club members' MRC decoders is that only one out of more than 20 is still functioning (only because the loco in which it was installed is just sitting on a shelf unused).

[AntonioFP45]

MRC DC powerpacks: Outstanding

 

 MRC sound?   Stop, stop. My ribs are hurting!

This photo might be of an HO modeler that taped a batch of MRC decoders onto a metal sign and put them to good use:  http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_1WaO1OGuwzI/SY9qCegTDbI/AAAAAAAAH2Q/FSS_jiy04Uw/s400/31105-funny_sign_no_target_practice.jpg