I’m looking for help in selecting a DCC system for my layout. I realize there are many posts that I’ve searched through but most seem to be in the line of Digitrax versus MRC or whatnot. Rather than walking into this question with a preference for a system in mind, I need help selecting a system given what I want to do in the future and current needs.
Some background info:
For the past couple of months, I’ve been working on a modular layout that is “around the walls” in an area about 14’ x16’. I’m planning two mainline tracks; one for passenger trains and one for freight. There will be some minor switching but no real “yard work” to speak of. Currently though, my son enjoys watching one train run around a plain oval nailed to a plywood panel. We’ve been using a Bachmann starter set control for this but I just discovered today that it died on us (nothing coming on in the control and the smell of burning circuits is never a good sign).
This has prompted me to finally look at investing in a DCC system. So what system should I examine with these requirements, listed in order of priority:
1. I don’t want to spend over $400.00 in total.
2. It has to be a system I can use on the plywood oval right now and shift to the layout as it is built.
3. I have a mix of DCC trains and DC trains. My son is particularly fond of the Blueline trains because of their sounds. I have several decoders I have yet to install in these but eventually they will be upgraded to DCC.
4. I have an interest in running double-headed trains in the future.
5. We aren’t planning on running more than 4-6 trains at a time, if even that many.
6. I have no DCC experience whatsoever so I need something a non-engineer can understand.
7. No reverse loops are planned for the layout.
8. We are going to have to move in 3-4 years due to work so nothing is going to be permanently mounted to the walls.
9. Most switches are Peco but some are Atlas.
10. I’m not “great” with computers; just passable. I’ve read that being able to program decoders from a computer is simpler. I have absolutely no experience with programming decoders and need something that can assist with me user deficiencies.
11. Given that my Bachmann seems to have “burned”, I’m a little worry about power surges. Are there steps to take to reduce the chances of this occurring with a more expensive system?
Does anyone have any recommendations for a DCC system for us that address these issues?
I'll let the guys more up on the various systems address that question, but if...if...a power surge or series of them is what you think has caused you trouble in the past, you will have to pay some considerable bucks for a surge protector. I see them going for anywhere between $20-$200, and my guess is you get what you pay for. Monster sells fancy, and expensive, power filters and surge protectors for expensive home theatre systems. For my own railroad, I went to Future Shop and purchased something in the CDN$60 range as a hedge against frying any of my decoders.
-Crandell
Flynn, I all so have a surge protector, it is a Surge Master. Cost was around $30.00 and it is used to protect my computer,I all so have my DCC system hooked to it.
I tried the Zepher and I did not care for its throttle. Lets say you want to run 2 trains, start train 1 and have it at 60% power, release control of train 1, move throttle back to 0, take control of train 2 and say run it at 40% power. Want to take control of train 1 again, release train 2, move throttle to where you had it for train 1 and take control again. In that respect it no better than my old Bachmann E-Z command. I bought the Zepher, 1 UP 5 faces plate and a UT throttle. Never used them after Simon brought over is Zepher so I could give it a try.
I took it all back and up graded to a Digitrax Super Empire Builder for only $80.00 more. You should be able to get a SEB with power supply (does not come with one) for right around $320.00 or less. You will get a UP 5 face plate, DB 150 booster, 5 amps of power, power supply for the SEB and the best part, a DT 400 walk around throttle. What I really like about the DT 400 is it is 2 cab controls in 1. At the top of the DT 400 is two thumb wheels, each one will control a train.
Far as programing, I bought a PR 3 and uses decoder pro. Talk about simple, takes most of the work out of setting CV's. Cost of the PR 3 and its PS-14 power supply was right around $70.00.
My 2 cents.
Cuda Ken
I hate Rust
Thanks all for the surge protector advice. Obviously that's something I should have invested in. I figured something as simple as a surge protector used for computers would work.
Cuda Ken,
Thank you very much for the explanation of the difference with the SEB versus the Zephyr. That was a bit of information I was clueless about. The PR3 thing; does that only work for Digitrax or can it program other decoder types as well?
Flynn,
I have a relatively small layout, 4 x 10, to be exact. While Ken is right about having to switch back and forth to control more than one train with the Zephyr, it only applies if you are not using the "jump ports". I have two MRC 1300 power packs attached to the jump ports on my Zephyr. That gave me 3 separate throttles to control three trains. If you want to be able to control the functions, that complicates things. Another point, you can run one DC loco at a time with a Zephyr. It can be assigned to the main throttle, either of the jump ports or to an external throttle. This capapbility is not available on all 'starter systems'. An important point, I think if you are in the process of 'converting' to DCC.
I added a DT400 throttle to my system, which has two fully functional throttles on it, that makes for a total of five now.
My Zephyr was a gift from my son several years ago, but it cost about $150. The DT400 cost me another $130 at a train show. I added a LocoBuffer-USB (about $50) so I could use DecoderPro and my PC to program decoders. The whole ball of wax adds up to just over $300.
One thing to remember is the Zephyr comes with its own power supply. While its not a 5 or 10 watt monster it is adequate for my layout and probably for yours. I have run as many as 8 locos with sound all at one time and never suffered an overload.
Really, the choice is up to you. But as you get deeper into DCC you are going to want/need the capabilities of a "full featured" DCC system. The Zephyr is that right out of the box and it is expandable.
I'm happy with my Zephyr. It took less than five-minutes to attach to my then 4 x 6 layout. And worked as advertised too. The key is reading the manual and following the 'quick start' instructions to the letter.
Good luck with your quest and layout. The idea is to have fun.
Remember its your railroad
Allan
Track to the BRVRR Website: http://www.brvrr.com/
NCE PowerCab will fill the bill really nice.
Larry
http://www.youtube.com/user/ClinchValleySD40
http://www.flickr.com/photos/52481330@N05/
http://www.trainboard.com/railimages/showgallery.php/cat/500/page/1/ppuser/8745/sl/c
First of all, welcome to the forums!
Other than non-expandable starter systems like the Bachmann, pretty much any DCC system will satisfy your requirements. Even better, they are all pretty good, and you won't just be satisfied, you'll be thrilled.
I always advise trying out the throttles. That's how you will interact with the systems. Personally, I have a Lenz system, largely because I like the big-button throttle rather than squinting to find the right cell-phone sized button on some of the other manufacturers' hand-helds. But, you're different, and I'd expect you to have different preferences. The Zephyr, a very good starting point for most people, is a base station, not a hand-held throttle, so if you buy one you should think about adding a hand-held unit right away.
I assume that your son will be "helping" run the trains right away. So, consider having two throttles. A Zephyr-plus-hand-held would do the job, or use an add-on throttle with any other system. While you're in the shop, take a look at non-wired throttles (radio or infrared) and see how those work for you.
Skip the PR3 for now. You can do basic decoder programming without it. Later, when you're more comfortable with the concept, it can make life easier, but when you're starting out I think you're better off just doing the simple stuff from the throttle.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
I just went through the same thing - trying to decide on a DCC system. I researched all the literature including a recent article on MR comparing the various systems. I settled on the Digitrax Empire Builder and then I hunted around trying to find the best deal which I found at Factory Direct Trains - they were great to deal with. While it was intransit I ran the bus wires, replaced my old block wiring, loaded decoders in my locos so when it arrived, I was up and running in an hour. I am very happy with the entire set-up and have never looked back.
There's never time to do it right, but always time to do it over.....
"My Zephyr was a gift from my son several years ago, but it cost about $150. The DT400 cost me another $130 at a train show. I added a LocoBuffer-USB (about $50) so I could use DecoderPro and my PC to program decoders. The whole ball of wax adds up to just over $300."
The above is the reason I went with the SEB and PR-3, my total cost was $370.00 with the PR 3. Plus I have 5 amps if I ever need it. While Simon had his Zepher over we did run 6 engines with no lack of power so power alone is not the reason to get a SEB. In my case, up grading to a DT 400 throttle, retuning the UT 4 throttle worked out to the same cost of the SEB.
Far as the PR 3 working with other decoders, yes and no. Mine will not read sound decoders for some reason as a stand alone unit, yet other peoples will? Its power supply is to small to read the sound decoders. I will need to hook the PR 3 to the SEB to read and write to them. Little more work, but it can be done.
PR 3 is the hardware, Decoder Pro is a free soft ware you can down load. Other makers have hardware like the PR 3 so PR 3 is not the only way to go. One of the reasons I went with the PR 3 is it can be hooked to a Digitrax system, and you can run the trains with your computer with Decoder Pro if you want.
One great reason to have Decoder Pro is if you have smalls ones around or fat fingers like me! With Decoder Pro you can create a rooster of your engines and there CV's. Last night I hit the wrong button and changed around 14 engines address to 22. Just places them on the PR 3 track and reset them to the CV's I had programed and all was good again.
One other thing to consider. If you have any MRR clubs around you, or people you operate regularly with on DCC, you will probably want a compatible system by the same maker. You'll need the throttle to match there, and to make it worht the while, it probably will need to work your own layout, or else get aheck of a workout at other people's to earn its keep.
Oh, and while almost if not all DCC systems treat DC engines as default 00, you can doublehead them, if you turn the engines around or swap the pickups on them. I've got an Athearn Genesis SD70 I run with a Proto SD60 that haven't been decodered yet, and they'll pull the walls down together.
-Morgan
Take a look at the MRC Prodiugy Express. It has more functions than the Zephyr and is far easier to use. I started with Digitrax a number of years ago but it was too complex and hard to puse to program.And then after looking at what MRC offered I switched to MRC. In fact i am now wireless although still have kept the Prodigy Express handheld that still works in the system. Get a demo of both systems and then you see. Sometimes it is a matter of personal choice but do compare features and get a demo bfore deciding.