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My Super Empire Builder hates my Blue Lines?

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  • Member since
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  • From: Maryville IL
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My Super Empire Builder hates my Blue Lines?
Posted by cudaken on Thursday, March 19, 2009 11:48 PM

For some reason my Digitrax TH 400 does not like my Blue Line engines.

 Simon 1966 came over two weeks ago with his Zepher and a TH 400. Ran the bench and all was fine. He pluged in his TH 400 and Blue Line stopped running and rear lights came on? Simon thinks his TH 400 is bad.

 Next time Simon came over the Super Empire Builder was up and running, we installed the UP 5 faces plates. Power was on, Simon pluged in the Loco Net Wire. Blue Line stopped working and rear lights came on again?

 Tonight (Simon was not here) I wanted to program a M 1 a BLI address (not Blue Line). Pulled the track power from the DB 150 command station, and wired in the programing track. (DB 150 was in sleep mode) changed the address of the M1a. Hooked track power back up, Blue Line Rear Lights where on again and need there decoders set again! 

 Nothing happens to the other engines, just the blue Line decoders.

??????????????? Ken

I hate Rust

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Posted by selector on Friday, March 20, 2009 12:43 AM

Ken, have you posted your question here?

http://precisioncraftmodels.com/forum/index.php?sid=3b2a1c8d3dd773ac78ac30a6177ada11

 

Or, phone BLI and ask them what the heck is going on.

-Crandell

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Posted by jbinkley60 on Friday, March 20, 2009 4:25 AM

cudaken

For some reason my Digitrax TH 400 does not like my Blue Line engines.

 Simon 1966 came over two weeks ago with his Zepher and a TH 400. Ran the bench and all was fine. He pluged in his TH 400 and Blue Line stopped running and rear lights came on? Simon thinks his TH 400 is bad.

 Next time Simon came over the Super Empire Builder was up and running, we installed the UP 5 faces plates. Power was on, Simon pluged in the Loco Net Wire. Blue Line stopped working and rear lights came on again?

 Tonight (Simon was not here) I wanted to program a M 1 a BLI address (not Blue Line). Pulled the track power from the DB 150 command station, and wired in the programing track. (DB 150 was in sleep mode) changed the address of the M1a. Hooked track power back up, Blue Line Rear Lights where on again and need there decoders set again! 

 Nothing happens to the other engines, just the blue Line decoders.

??????????????? Ken

Ken,

Bluelines can be a little tricky, due top the dual decoders.  A couple of questions:

1.  Are the lights running off the Blueline or the motor controller decoder ?  This is controlled by whether you move the 4 wire plug from J4 to J7 when you install the motor controller.  I move the wire.  Not everyone does. 

2.  When you program the Blueline address, are you doing it on the programming track or via Ops mode on the main ?

3.  When you program the address what value are you setting for CV29 ?

 

Engineer Jeff NS Nut
Visit my layout at: http://www.thebinks.com/trains/

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Posted by simon1966 on Friday, March 20, 2009 6:11 AM

To keep things simple, in one case the address has been left at 03 in the other it was changed to 02.  The BL decoder has to be reset by placing the loco on a program track using DIR program mode.  We have been writing 8 to CV 8 which I understand to be the full decoder reset.  This is being done with the Digitrax motor decoder removed.  The BL sound decoder responds to this reset with the acknowledgement sound. The short address CV is then changed.  Motor decoders put back in and then everything works fine.

It is the weirdest thing.  These BL sound decoders clearly don't like anything to be happening to the loconet or track connections.  There must be some sort of electrical spikes that upsets these decoders that has no effect on any others. 

I personally don't have any BL locos so have no real experience with them other than the headache at Kens.

 

 

Simon Modelling CB&Q and Wabash See my slowly evolving layout on my picturetrail site http://www.picturetrail.com/simontrains and our videos at http://www.youtube.com/user/MrCrispybake?feature=mhum

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Posted by rrinker on Friday, March 20, 2009 7:03 AM

 It is my understanding that hte Blueline decoders support decoder lock, which allows you to lock the settings so that programming another decoder (say the motor one) on the same address will not change anything in the sound part. You might want to try setting the lock once the sound aprt is programmed, that SHOULD keep it from seeing other program cammands as possibly being directed to itself and changing things that shouldn;t be changed. Also instead of 6 for CV29 try 2, turnign off DC conversion, that seems to help some decoders ignore track power spikes when it turns on and off and thinkign it's DC or 0 stretching or some other junk.

                                --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by DigitalGriffin on Friday, March 20, 2009 10:25 AM

rrinker
 It is my understanding that hte Blueline decoders support decoder lock, which allows you to lock the settings so that programming another decoder (say the motor one) on the same address will not change anything in the sound part. You might want to try setting the lock once the sound aprt is programmed, that SHOULD keep it from seeing other program cammands as possibly being directed to itself and changing things that shouldn;t be changed.

 

+1 Sign - DotsI most whole heartidly agree.  You need to match the lock address before programming can take place.  This is a pain in the duckass and why I avoid dual decoder installs when possible.

Don - Specializing in layout DC->DCC conversions

Modeling C&O transition era and steel industries There's Nothing Like Big Steam!

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Posted by simon1966 on Friday, March 20, 2009 11:00 AM

TH400 is Ken-speak for DT400.  Knowing Ken it stands for something rude, summarizing current frustrations!

Simon Modelling CB&Q and Wabash See my slowly evolving layout on my picturetrail site http://www.picturetrail.com/simontrains and our videos at http://www.youtube.com/user/MrCrispybake?feature=mhum

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Posted by selector on Friday, March 20, 2009 11:01 AM

Geez, David, I thought you were pretty current with DCC stuff.  Haven't you heard of Digitrax's newest throttle.

Tch!

Big Smile

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Posted by selector on Friday, March 20, 2009 1:12 PM

Only on the manual.  Seems some folks don't get a good grasp of them. Laugh

Sorry, Ken, we're poking fun at you...I hope you don't mind.  Let us know.

-Crandell

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Posted by cudaken on Friday, March 20, 2009 11:19 PM

 DH 400, TH 400 what ever the 400 thingie is!Big Smile Getting use to the lingo, it is a DT 400. Far as you Crandell or any one else that has tried to help me taking a cheap shoot, that is fine. God only knows what you say off line about me.Big Smile

 When I program I unhook the track power from the DB 150 and install wires to my programing track that is on my desk. There is no power to the main bench at this time. To change the address of motor decoder, I install it in my SD 7, shell just lift off, fast and simple.

 Tonight I changed some CV's in one of the BL GE AC 6000. Changed CV 240 from 24 to 18 for more random sounds and CV 185 from 10 to 5 to increase brake squeal. To be safe, I did have the BL RSD 15 off the bench when I powered up. Tonight there was no problem with either engine!

 On the lights, they are still controled by the sound decoder.

 I am startig to understand why you folks like to play with CV's. The few changes I have made to the 6000 are great.

 By the way, on the GE AC 6000, what CV and setting can I use to make the ditch light flash all the time?

 Simon, if you have the time on my days off, maybe we can play with a BL with your computer interfaces. Looks like I may have to buy the PR3 from a shop that has them in stock. Digitrax has them on back order.

        Cuda Ken, thanks to all his friends 

I hate Rust

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Posted by selector on Saturday, March 21, 2009 12:47 AM

Ken, if I could make a suggestion for you:  I have my turntable lead as my programming track.  It is front and center, so it is very handy.  The one end dead ends at the lip of the turntable, so it is a natural gap.  I left a gap at the other end just as it meets the turnout that permits access to the turntable.

How I wired it was to wrap the feeder wires around the posts of a double throw, single pole toggle switch.  Also wrapped around those posts are the main heavy wires that come off my DB150 output posts.  My bus wires to the rest of the turnout come off the other two posts on this toggle. 

Picture a toggle with four posts...two mid-way and two toward one end of the steel box.  The power from the DB150 goes to the center posts, and the bus wires come off the two end posts.  When the toggle is thrown one way, the power flows from the DB150, through the switch, and out the end posts, down the bus and to the rails everywhere.  If I flip the toggle, the power still comes to the switch via those middle posts, but it now can only go on to the programming track, whose feeders are also wrapped around the middle posts.

If you follow all that, it saves you the hassle of trying to take wires off your DB150, programme an engine, and then re-install the bus wires.

Just a suggestion to speed things up for you.

-Crandell

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Posted by jbinkley60 on Saturday, March 21, 2009 4:56 AM

cudaken

 DH 400, TH 400 what ever the 400 thingie is!Big Smile Getting use to the lingo, it is a DT 400. Far as you Crandell or any one else that has tried to help me taking a cheap shoot, that is fine. God only knows what you say off line about me.Big Smile

 When I program I unhook the track power from the DB 150 and install wires to my programing track that is on my desk. There is no power to the main bench at this time. To change the address of motor decoder, I install it in my SD 7, shell just lift off, fast and simple.

 Tonight I changed some CV's in one of the BL GE AC 6000. Changed CV 240 from 24 to 18 for more random sounds and CV 185 from 10 to 5 to increase brake squeal. To be safe, I did have the BL RSD 15 off the bench when I powered up. Tonight there was no problem with either engine!

 On the lights, they are still controled by the sound decoder.

 I am startig to understand why you folks like to play with CV's. The few changes I have made to the 6000 are great.

 By the way, on the GE AC 6000, what CV and setting can I use to make the ditch light flash all the time?

 Simon, if you have the time on my days off, maybe we can play with a BL with your computer interfaces. Looks like I may have to buy the PR3 from a shop that has them in stock. Digitrax has them on back order.

        Cuda Ken, thanks to all his friends 

Ken,

On My AC6000 I moved the lights to run off of the motor controller.  Simply move the wire from J1 to J7.  It will ensure that the motor and lights are in sync.  Then if you have any issues, it will just be with the sound.  Make sure CV29 is 34 or 35.  For the blinking ditch light question, this is controlled through CV160-164 .  Use these to adjust the time on/off.  Set CV225=3 and then use F7 to turn them off/on.  What motor decoder are you using nowadays ?

Also, from BLI's website. here's their answer to your question:

Q: Are the ditch lights adjustable on my BlueLine AC6000? A: The ditch lights are very adjustable. The default is to come on when the horn blows.

Some DC options:
-Aux button on DC Master controls ditch lights if CV220 and CV222 are set to 3.
-If CV221 is set to 1, the ditch light come on with the bell.

Some DCC options:
-Set CV226 to 1 to make the ditch lights come on with the bell. Set to 0 to return to default.
-If CV225 is set to 3, F7 controls ditch lights.

To Make the lights on solid all the time set: CV225-3, CV160-3, CV161=50, CV162=2, CV163=3 and CV164 is 10. F7 turns them on and off.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Engineer Jeff NS Nut
Visit my layout at: http://www.thebinks.com/trains/

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Posted by cudaken on Saturday, March 21, 2009 10:03 PM

 Crandell, thanks for the idea. But you would have to see the current bench to understand why that idea may not work for me. My desk / work bench is a good 5 feet from the bench at the close point and 20 feet from the far end. DB 150 is on the desk and I hook up the DT 400 into one of the LOCO NET ports most of the time. If, I where to use a switch so I can program at the desk, it would be the old knife throw switch like in the Frankenstein movie.

 Main thing to remember is when I get the PR 3, then I will not be using the SEB for programing at all anyway!

 

jbinkley60

On My AC6000 I moved the lights to run off of the motor controller.  Simply move the wire from J1 to J7.  It will ensure that the motor and lights are in sync.  Then if you have any issues, it will just be with the sound.  Make sure CV29 is 34 or 35.  For the blinking ditch light question, this is controlled through CV160-164 .  Use these to adjust the time on/off.  Set CV225=3 and then use F7 to turn them off/on.  What motor decoder are you using nowadays ?

 Jblinkely60, I know how to move the plug. When you say make sure CV29 is 34 or 35 is that the motor decoder or the sound decoder? I am using a Digitrax DZ 143. Would I not have to change the CV's in the DZ 143 if it is controlling the lights?

        Cuda Ken

I hate Rust

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Posted by jbinkley60 on Sunday, March 22, 2009 6:48 AM

cudaken

 Jblinkely60, I know how to move the plug. When you say make sure CV29 is 34 or 35 is that the motor decoder or the sound decoder? I am using a Digitrax DZ 143. Would I not have to change the CV's in the DZ 143 if it is controlling the lights?

        Cuda Ken

Set CV29=34 or 35 on both.  One thing I do when programming Bluelines on the programming track with my SuperChief system is use PageMode programming for the motor controller (I use he same one you do) and Direct mode programming for the Sound decoder.  With this I haven't found the need to lock the decoders.  Also there ae few overlapping CVs between the Blueline sound and the Digitrax motor controller and any that I can think of have the same value.

 

Engineer Jeff NS Nut
Visit my layout at: http://www.thebinks.com/trains/

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Posted by cudaken on Sunday, March 22, 2009 9:17 PM

 Jeff, thanks and I will try that. Well, I should say I will try to get Simon to try that! Big Smile

 On the Blue Line front. I have found that when I turn on the SEB, the rear lights are on in the Blue Line, but after I power up the engines, light goes off and engines work. Just a little odd and may have jumped the gun on this posting. 

          Cuda Ken

I hate Rust

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