I'm sure this has been talked about before, but the Search is a litttle cumbersome to use. I am looking at an Athearn Genesis F7A/B with sound. Before I plunk down a fair amount of money, I wanted some opinions regarding this series. I have Atlas, Proto and BLI which I like, but have no history with the Athearn Genesis.
Thanks,
Jeff
jtsgarageI am looking at an Athearn Genesis F7A/B with sound. Before I plunk down a fair amount of money, I wanted some opinions regarding this series. I have Atlas, Proto and BLI which I like, but have no history with the Athearn Genesis.
As previous poster already suggested, I would recommend purcshasing the locomotive(s) without sound, and adding a sound unit from another vendor such as QSI, LocSound, or Soundtraxx.
The Genisis line uses better motors and has better detailing than the regular Athearn line. However I would check Walthers to see if they offer the F-7 road you like in the Proto 2000 series. If you shop around, you will find they are a similar price. AND the Proto 2000's have better details, as well as a much better QSI DCC drive.
For the record: I own 1 Walthers F-7 and 3 Athearn Genesis F7 A-B-A. The later is frustrating because the engines don't all run at the same speed and they have no programable speed tables per NMRA OP registers CV67-CV94.
Don - Specializing in layout DC->DCC conversions
Modeling C&O transition era and steel industries There's Nothing Like Big Steam!
Thanks to all that posted. Kind of confirmed my suspicions regarding the Athearn Genesis. I will look for non-sound unit and add a sound decoder. Any recomendations?
Since I was also considering a sound equipped Athearn Genesis, I found this discussion very helpful, especially the responses that actually explained their problems with the factory installed decoders.
The question that follows is, do non-decoder equipped Genesis series locomotives come DCC ready? Also, is part of the problem with MRC sound quality in the Genesis series the speaker? In other words, in replacing the decoder, should the speaker go as well?
According to the Athearn website, the non-decoder equipped models are DCC ready. I have a Genesis sound equipped SD60M which is in my junk pile. The model was fine until I bumped it while it was stationary on the rails. From there everything went down hill. At first it had a difficult time running in the forward direction, and from there it lost the sound and all functions. I've tried resetting it and everything. I would say if you are going to replace the decoder replace the speaker too. The sound from the speaker I had was too tin-like, I've heard the same thing throughout these forums. Try listening to the LOK Sound samples on their website, those are pretty good.
Texas Zepher jtsgarageI am looking at an Athearn Genesis F7A/B with sound. Before I plunk down a fair amount of money, I wanted some opinions regarding this series. I have Atlas, Proto and BLI which I like, but have no history with the Athearn Genesis.In my opinion the Athearn Genesis F units are mechanically appoximately equal to all that you have mentioned. The "Highliner" shells used on them are definitely first rate in the detail and accuracy category. The issue with the unit is the "with sound" part. Athearn uses MRC electronics and I find their sound units to be poor quality both in the sound(s) produced and the reliability of the units. The sound is coarse and blarry (did I just make up a word?), some is due to the lack of control of volume so that even on the lowest setting they are too loud. As previous poster already suggested, I would recommend purcshasing the locomotive(s) without sound, and adding a sound unit from another vendor such as QSI, LocSound, or Soundtraxx.
I also have a four engine set of Athearn Genesis that I want to add sound to. I've been doing a lot of reading as I'm new to this DCC & Sound world. It appears to me that the QSI Revolution and the Tsunami are at the top in terms of best possible decoder/sound uinits.
And it would appear as though it might be best to utilize the newer HB (high bass) spearker(s)?? In looking at various photos of these units, it appears as most installations utilize a single speaker at the rear of the frame, and pointed downward?? 1) Will this single speaker fit in the stock frame without any milling?2) Are all installations with the speaker facing downward?
I heard mention on another forum that Model Railroader had a recent article about this subject of "'adding a decoder to an Athearn Genesis F unit' sometime in the fall of 2008? Can someone tell me which month or where I might view this article?
I have a freind who recently purchased a 3 unit set of F3 Genesis engines, all with sound. I have not had the occassion to view inside these units yet. but it does appear to be really good sound. I believe he has indicated that they are MRC decoders.And most interesting they appear to project sound thru the top rear grills (two small rectanges on F3) and the side grills at the rear. Is it possible that this speaker is mounted in the up position? I had also been led to believe that sound was generally best if from two speakers and pointed downward??
Brian
My Layout Plan
Interesting new Plan Consideration
Thanks for all the info - won't be buying the Genesis units with factory sound. You mention installing a dual speaker system to achieve good bass and treble. Makes sense just as in a car or home theater. But I look inside the SD 70 hood and go, "Where is there space?".
Any one making water expandable speakers? Campbells?
duckdogger Thanks for all the info - won't be buying the Genesis units with factory sound.
Thanks for all the info - won't be buying the Genesis units with factory sound.
Have a look back at what I said about his Genesis F units....GOOD sound.
I wrote, "but it does appear to be really good sound. I believe he has indicated that they are MRC decoders. And most interesting they appear to project sound thru the top rear grills (two small rectanges on F3) and the side grills at the rear. Is it possible that this speaker is mounted in the up position? I had also been led to believe that sound was generally best if from two speakers and pointed downward??"
From another forum, "Since the F units have see through fans, mounting the speakers upward seemed to work fine. He drilled out the exhaust stacks to give a little more open area for the sound and they sound like a real F unit to me. He had to mill the weights a little to get the top firing speakers but he said it was way easier than trying to mount them so they were down firing."
I wrote, "Here is the photo I have of the 'stock' Genesis speaker installation in an F7 unit. I don't see vented areas above the speaker location on the F7 locos. What ever model F unit my friend has, has two retangular vents (like those in the front of this F7 loco) right over this rear speaker location. So there appears to be good sound out of those top vents, and the vents on the sides at the rear."
He responded, " That's a Phase 1 F-7. That model has the two horizontal slits on the roof for dynamic brakes. They were replaced with a 48" dynamic brake fan on units so equipped. On my friend's engines, the side grills are open at the rear of the body to let out sound. My friend mounted the QSI speaker a little forward of that position and then drilled out the two exhaust stacks you see between the fans since his road doesn't have dynamic brakes. The combination seemed to provide more than enough sound."s another responce fro another forum,"Since the F units have see through fans, mounting the speakers upward seemed to work fine. He drilled out the exhaust stacks to give a little more open area for the sound and they sound like a real F unit to me. He had to mill the weights a little to get the top firing speakers but he said it was way easier than trying to mount them so they were down firing." http://www.modelrailroadforums.com/forum/showthread.php?p=115395#post115395
Hi Jeff,
As the proud owner of 5 Genesis F units, I would whole-heartedly recommend buying them without sound. I have had nothing but flaky problems with them. Three went back to Athearn for warranty repairs and they still had problems when I got them back. Problems range from horn and bell not working to units not 'taking" a new address.
They are nicely detailed and beautifully painted, so it would be worth just putting a DCC sound decoder in yourself.
Regards,
Greg
Greg Shindledecker Modeling the =WM= Thomas Sub in the mid-70s
Raised on the Erie Lackawanna Mainline- Supt. of the Black River Transfer & Terminal R.R.
I have one of the Genesis Challengers and have not experienced any problems. It was worth every penny.
I have a Genesis Challenger too. It works most of the time. I did have troubles when it was new with setting the long address. I finally had to resort to resetting it in analog mode. After that, it seems to be doing better. Other than being a bit loud (even when I adjusted it), it does sound nice.
I wish Athearn would get their act together with the sound decoders and the F7s. I want to give them my money, I really do!
Take care,
I also have one of those Challengers that I experienced a problem with at first, but I chalked that up to my lack of knowledge of DCC and programing. I had to get a more experienced person to reprogram it (or reset defaults ?) to get it to run.
Now that I think about it, I believe I recall one of the websites I visited lately commenting on the fact that some of the Soundtraxx decoders come preset to DCC mode even though they are duel-mode decoders (DC & DCC)....strange for the DC person to have to seek out a DCC system to get his loco to work on his DC layout.
I have just over 200 diesels on and off my railroad. I don't really like a lot of sound, especially during an operating session. Therefore about one fourth of my diesels have sound, the rest are silent. Of the sound units, all but a couple are Atlas. I have Genesis diesels, SD45-2 and FP45's, all have had the sound removed that came from the factory. Enough said.
Bob
Capt. GrimekHow long have you had yours and approx. how many running hours? I'm just starting to lay my track so only have a couple of hours on mine. Thanks. Those MRCs make me nervous. The models are beautiful things and I'd like to get another of each eventually.
I've had the model for about nine or ten months now. Sorry I really can't think of the approx. running hrs on it. I only have one, UP 3985. If I was a steam era modeler I would definitely get a few more of the UP ones.
We gave our grandson an Athearn Challenger as a Christmas present in 2006. The loco has had its wheels run off on the BRVRR layout since then. We haven't experienced any problems with it at all.
I have a few MRC sound decoders installed in locomotives of my own. I have yet to have a failure. My Zephyr has had no problem programming them either.
My major complaint with the 'self installed' MRC decoders is the poor motor control. Beyond that they are/were a bargain at the time I purchased them. About half the price of a Soundtraxx DSD-100LC at the time.
Remember its your railroad
Allan
Track to the BRVRR Website: http://www.brvrr.com/
railandsail And it would appear as though it might be best to utilize the newer HB (high bass) spearker(s)?? In looking at various photos of these units, it appears as most installations utilize a single speaker at the rear of the frame, and pointed downward?? 1) Will this single speaker fit in the stock frame without any milling?2) Are all installations with the speaker facing downward? I heard mention on another forum that Model Railroader had a recent article about this subject of "'adding a decoder to an Athearn Genesis F unit' sometime in the fall of 2008? Can someone tell me which month or where I might view this article? I have a friend who recently purchased a 3 unit set of F3 Genesis engines, all with sound. I have not had the occassion to view inside these units yet. but it does appear to be really good sound. I believe he has indicated that they are MRC decoders.And most interesting they appear to project sound thru the top rear grills (two small rectanges on F3) and the side grills at the rear. Is it possible that this speaker is mounted in the up position? I had also been led to believe that sound was generally best if from two speakers and pointed downward??
I have a friend who recently purchased a 3 unit set of F3 Genesis engines, all with sound. I have not had the occassion to view inside these units yet. but it does appear to be really good sound. I believe he has indicated that they are MRC decoders.And most interesting they appear to project sound thru the top rear grills (two small rectanges on F3) and the side grills at the rear. Is it possible that this speaker is mounted in the up position? I had also been led to believe that sound was generally best if from two speakers and pointed downward??
Well I got a look at my friends F3 Genesis engines and sure enough the speaker is located at the rear of the chassis just like the MRC factory installation. BUT, I was surprised by the orientation of the speaker itself. Its front wave face projected into the 'back-cavity enclosure' and its rear face was pointed downward toward the truck opening ?? I wrote about it here, but it might bear repeating in this subject thread:I was just listening to your 'sound samples', and had a question about the EMD 567 Sound of the F7 locos. (BTW, great presentation !! )http://www.ulrichmodels.com/Sound_Samples/SoundSamples.htm
I assume the speaker is installed similar to the factory MRC installation on the rear of the metal chassis. But I believe I have been exposed to two different speaker orientations:1) the front wave of the speaker faces downward and the rear face of the speaker is cover by a round plastic back-wave cavity enclosure.2) the front wave of the speaker faces into the round plastic back-wave cavity enclosure while its rear face faces downward in the loco.
I would think the second orientation would be less effective than the first ?? Doesn't the already small front face of these small speakers produce a much more positive sound than the back face that is greatly cover by the metal frame of the speaker itself ?? Why would one install these small speakers 'backwards' ??
I've run into a similar situation for the P2K PA/PB locos where the speaker has been installed in a relatively shallow box up in top of the shell. First off in one case its installed with the front wave of the speaker projecting down into the shell. In the second case the speaker's front face projects into the small cavity box.....Strange??And in both cases I would question the size of the 'back-wave' cavity enclosure box. It seems so shallow as to not really allow for full speaker excursions. Shouldn't these back-wave cavities be 'allowably large' so as to not impend full speaker excursions??
...cross thread referencehttp://cs.trains.com/trccs/forums/p/148086/1643654.aspx#1643654
I have a Genesis F7. It runs and looks great but like others have said the sound could be better. I have also had problems with different sound features activating themselves as the train goes around the layout.