I have a Walthers 3-way turnout that is giving me fits electrically. I have trouble with shorts on two of the three paths of the turnout. One (to the right) way everything is fine, but as the loco uses the center path or the left path it creates a short as it crosses over the insulated joiner. If I put the loco past that point everything works right. Forward is forward and reverese is reverse just as it was entering the turnout. It is just that spot where the insulated joiner is. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
John, I have three of the Walthers 3-way turnouts lined up end to end in a coach yard on my layout.
My suspicion is that the shorts are occurring as the wheels touch rails of opposite polarity where the rails converge near the frogs. A quick but effective solution is a small dab of clear nail polish at that point.
Rich
Alton Junction
When I have used that turnout, I place a gap at the end of the turnout on the three exits. I don't use a joiner between the tracks that follow and the three exits. It works that way for me. I have had continuity problems, though, and ended up soldering a single 25 gauge strand of wire between one of the closure rails and the point attached to it.
I don't have shorts at any of the frogs. If you are sure you are getting shorts there, simply paint about 1/4" outbound of the split rails at the frog point rails. That is, where the insulator is, go outward and paint another 1/4" of one of the two rails with clear varnish. Let it cure fully.
I have a code 83 one that needed some help to prevent the shorting. Look over the threads below, one from Oct 2013 and one from January 2013 that explain the problem(s) and fix(es). I think the earlier one had photos pinpointing one of the offending small pieces (especially the one by Middleman) but the links to the photos seem to be void. Sorry I don't remember how to make these old links clickable.
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/11/t/221070.aspx
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/744/t/214350.aspx?sort=ASC&pi314=2
Update: Here's a thread from 2008, on double crossovers, but where another member shows a photo of one of the 3-way problem areas that he solved with nail polish. I think I did the same. Don't know it this is your problem area.
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/744/t/122369.aspx
Paul
Modeling HO with a transition era UP bent
Is there a possibility that the "polarity" on the two routes causing the problem, is opposite from that of the turnout?
jjackso8 I have a Walthers 3-way turnout that is giving me fits electrically. I have trouble with shorts on two of the three paths of the turnout. One (to the right) way everything is fine, but as the loco uses the center path or the left path it creates a short as it crosses over the insulated joiner. If I put the loco past that point everything works right. Forward is forward and reverese is reverse just as it was entering the turnout. It is just that spot where the insulated joiner is. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
FloridaFlyer
I don't think so as if I push the loco past the gaps it continues on as if there was never a short.
Tell us more.
Has the 3-way turnout just been installed or has it been in place and just now started to exhibit shorts?
Can you provide us with a track plan?
jjackso8 FloridaFlyer I don't think so as if I push the loco past the gaps it continues on as if there was never a short.
Understood. However why would the loco direction and speed be unchanged from when just before hiting the short?
I will try tonight after I figure out how to upload one.
jjackso8 Understood. However why would the loco direction and speed be unchanged from when just before hiting the short?
jjackso8 I will try tonight after I figure out how to upload one.
Would love to but not sure how to get your e-mail address to send it.
when I had just used plastic rail joiners there was no problem. I reinstalled it and created gaps further down the line and now there are shorts. got the track plan but cannot figure out how to post the scanned drawing.
jjackso8 Would love to but not sure how to get your e-mail address to send it.
I have one of these. I wired it without gaps, and with feeders on both sides. "DCC Friendly" implies that you can do that, so I did. I have no problems of any kind with these turnouts.
DCC is not polarity dependent. Auto-reversers, in fact, work by actually flipping the polarity to avoid such conflicts. You can't, however, have half of the engine on tracks with one polarity and the other half on the opposite polarity. That will cause a short, and I'd suggest that's what you're seeing.
If it turns out that your polarity is correct, take a look at your frogs. Did you power them? Did you run them through a Tortoise or other device to properly set the frog polarity based on point position? There may be something funky here.
If you didn't power the frogs, they should be dead. While they should not cause a short in that situation, they may cause dropouts, and it's advisable to power them. These are fairly long turnouts with long frogs, after all.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
Another question.
Are you sure that it is a short?
Or could it simply be a stall (no power)?
Indeed, this sounds more like a stall. That 4" section may have no power. Conversely, if there are feeders applied to that 4: section it would cause a short. The rails past the frog need to take the polarity of the frog, so if there are fixed feeders instead of switched power of some sort, there will be a short in certain routes.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Sometimes walthers/shinohara applies jumpers beneath the track to adjoining rails. These jumpers become loose requiring resoldering or another jumper wire.
I sometimes just push down on the solder ends with a hot soldering tip for a second or two...enough to resolder the point but not enough to do a lot of damage to the plastic ties. But before you do this, make sure this is the case by testing with a continuity testor/ohm meter.
Don - Specializing in layout DC->DCC conversions
Modeling C&O transition era and steel industries There's Nothing Like Big Steam!
John, congratulations on solving that problem. It is always good to hear from someone who digs in and investigates and solves his own problem. Kudos.