Looking for a good prototype RR - northeastern, urban, waterfront . . . see post

[Anonymous]

For my second layout attempt (now in the armchair phase), I have been reading up on layout design realism that goes beyond the models and scenery - thanks to Tony Koester for his excellent books on the topic . . . !

I have not decided on whether to model a prototype or to freelance based on a prototype, but I am looking for something to provide some inspiration. I particularly like northeastern cities, particularly if they involve a waterfront rail/shipping interface and some heavy industry. I'd like to model some piers, a car float, some drawbridges, an oil refinery etc. . . . this is probably because I grew up in northern NJ and got to see a lot of this firsthand in Newark, Jersey City, etc.

I don't have a huge amount of space for a layout - I am probably going to stick with HO and I have about a 14 X 10 foot space for an l-shaped around-the-walls situation, perhaps with return loops at either end to double the length of the main line. So I am probably looking at a short or branch line with interchange possibilities.

Does anyone have a suggestion for where to start, either with a prototype or a reference book? I was historically an avid model railroader, but I admit I am a bit ignorant on my knowledge of prototypes. I am not even sure what RR's ran through northern NJ at any given time, and now that I am in PA I am a bit far removed. Any suggestions are welcome! I'd like to see where I can start looking for pictures, and the choices for books on prototypes in the back of the Walthers catalogue are a bit overwhelming. Thanks a bunch . . .

[David_Telesha]

The New Haven RR gives you many options.

The NH operated to Belle Dock in New Haven,CT, - Oak Point, NY, New Bedford Harbor, MA, Newport, RI, Boston, MA, Providence, RI, Buzzards Bay, MA, Cape Cod, MA, Bridgeport, CT, and many other waterfront places!

Just the ones I mentioned could give you anything you want - an industrial line, car floats, waterfront yards.

Based on what you said I think you might especially like either NY or Belle Dock in NH. Oak point had carfloats and Belle Dock had lots of factories, piers, an oil loading facility (which led to oil unit trains going over the middle of a auto/rail bridge), lots of great stuff. Bridgeport was also very industrial with power plants on the shore, steel companies, yards on the shore and the NH electrified mainline in the middle of it all.

If you want more info please visit the NHRR forum at www.nhrhta.org - lots of experts and former employees and modelers there.. They can give you operations info, diagrams, etc. etc.. Anything you need - plus the org sells back issues of Shoreliner magazines (photos, diagrams, text) and a full line of NHRR books.

[ndbprr]

Well if you want to do your hometown area you could try the CNJ or PRR later PC and then Conrail or CSX now I assume. Lots of docks and transfer barges which is how most freight got to New England from the PRR Greenville yard. Several years ago there was a series of articles on just such a railroad on Boston that used GE 44 ton engines primarily and tied into the NH. I would guess late 80's in MR. Model Railroad planning in one of the issues had an article on the Brooklyn COnnecting which serviced industry and barges there. Almost any NE city on the water could serve as a prototype - Baltimore, Philadelphia, New York, Newark, Boston with a full variety of railroads - B&O, C&O, PRR, Reading, CNJ, NYC, B&M, BAR and others.

[David_Telesha]

QUOTE: Originally posted by ndbprr

Well if you want to do your hometown area you could try the CNJ or PRR later PC and then Conrail or CSX now I assume. Lots of docks and transfer barges which is how most freight got to New England from the PRR Greenville yard. Several years ago there was a series of articles on just such a railroad on Boston that used GE 44 ton engines primarily and tied into the NH. I would guess late 80's in MR. Model Railroad planning in one of the issues had an article on the Brooklyn COnnecting which serviced industry and barges there. Almost any NE city on the water could serve as a prototype - Baltimore, Philadelphia, New York, Newark, Boston with a full variety of railroads - B&O, C&O, PRR, Reading, CNJ, NYC, B&M, BAR and others.

The railroad tied into the NH in Boston you mention would be the Union Freight RR. They had their own 44-tonners for a while and then started using NH switchers. The UFRR was a really neat operation - lots of street trackage and industry. I'm glad you brought the UFRR up, I forgot to mention it!

The neat thing about the NHRR is they connected to many other roads in NY and MA. Also the NH had a neat selection of switcher units and many different paint schemes.

1940-1956 they had fleets of HH600, HH660, S-1, S-2, GE 44-tonner, and Lima 1200hp switchers.

In 1956 they took an order of 20 EMD SW1200's..

The 1940's units were delivered in a Pullman Green/gold lettering scheme, late 1940's got a variation of a Orange/Green scheme (different greens and slight design variations depending), and post 1954 got a variation of a McGinnis (red-orange, black, white) or Alpert (orange, black, Scotchlite or white lettering).

[Anonymous]

I really appreciate your help! This is a great start! Thanks . . . !

[marknewton]

Scotty, you might find these links useful:

http://home.att.net/~Berliner-Ultrasonics/railmarn.html

http://www.trainsarefun.com/lirr/licity/licity.htm

http://www2pb.ip-soft.net/railinfo/car-floats/nyc-carfloats.html

http://www2pb.ip-soft.net/railinfo/car-floats/car-floats.html

http://hbs.railfan.net/

http://www.trainsarefun.com/urbanmodeling/urban.htm

Good luck with your project!

Mark.

[rtstasiak]

Go to Brooklyn, rookie! The Brooklyn Eastern District Terminal ran a fleet of little engines (including steam tank engines into the 1960s) through densely urban territory. Sharp curves, car floats, and pastrami. What more could you ask?

[Anonymous]

Again, more great information. Thanks very much - there seems to be quite a few good places to start . . . !

[Anonymous]

See my reply (below) in the New England Trackplans forum.

If you can make the trip, go to College Park, MD to the NARA (National Archives and Registration Administration) and get copies of track plans from all over the nation. Visit the NARA site: http://www.archives.gov/research/arc/

Click on the yellow button "Search", type in this number "587535" (the ARC identifier number). It'll take you to the info page. Here's a summary of that page:

Title of document: Revised Railroad Valuation Maps, ca. 1920 - ca. 1960

Location: Cartographic and Architectural Records LICON, Special Media Archives Services Division (NWCS-C), National Archives at College Park, 8601 Adelphi Road, College Park, MD 20740-6001 PHONE: [phone], FAX: [phone], EMAIL: [e-mail]

Scope & Content: This series consists of revised right-of-way and tract maps, station maps, profiles, and related indexes. Also known as detailed land maps, they usually are in the form of annotated blueprints measuring 25 by 54 inches. The series coverage is nation wide and the map sheets contain information on land acquisition (grantor and grantee information) and engineering details such as the layout of track and the locations of roads, buildings, and bridges.

For anyone who is looking for PRR or PC track plans, also visit the Pennsylvania State Archives at: http://www.phmc.state.pa.us/bah/dam/railroadPRRlandmaps.htm
You'll find a list of track plans, etc on microfilm available to copy.
Again, you have to go there to get them.

Anyone in need of Boston and Albany track plans (more like schematics to me), with curvature and grades of the main line, from Rensselaer, NY to Boston, see: http://www.zekedev.com/sites/boston_line/index.cfm

The Maptech site is good too but lacks detail that I'm looking for.

In fact, does anyone have info on the track plans (detailed with industry spurs) of the Framingham, MA area?

I'm planning a model layout of the Framingham Wye (plus North yard and Nevins yard) in Massachusetts, during the 50-60's period, including the Saxonville Branch and Medfield Junction. Any detailed track plans are welcomed.

See pictures of Framingham at: http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/
Click in the keyword "Framingham" in the sites search machine.

Note:
The right-of-way of the North yard in Framingham was under NYNH&H and then NYC ownership during the 50-60's - not sure of when NYC took over NYNH&H's right-of-way in that area. Any source (NYC or NYNH&H) will work.
And, B&A sold out to NYC in the same period. So, NYC had right-of-way between the mid 50's to 60's, before being consolidated under PENN CENTRAL..

SO, until I can make a trip to Maryland and Pennsylvania, if anyone has material that can be sent by e-mail, I surely do appreciate it.

Daniel
This post has been edited by SmithBrazil on Today, 12:49:22