How often are deer and livestock hit?

[Anonymous]

Just wondering... especially out here in the sticks where I live, deer are a nightmare on back country roads, and I know there are long stretches in rural areas where there's not a crossing for miles. As big and loud as trains are, I know it's still possible for one to sneak up on a human if he's walking down the tracks and the horn isn't blowing. How often do deer, elk, bison, livestock, etc get hit by oncoming trains? And what's usually done about it once an animal's been hit?

[Anonymous]

I imagine they probably hit deer about as often as automobiles do. I doubt they really do much about the dead deer as the carcass is probably splattered allover the place and unless the engineer is going slow or it happens to be right in front of him he'll more than likely never see or know he hit it. Maybe they'll call the game warden to take the remains to some potter's field or wherever. I remember hearing somewhere the Alaska Railroad raffles the meat to residents who live along the right of way.

Livestock like cattle and horses used to be a major problem back in the olden days and caused a few derailments so they invented cow catchers on the steam locomotives. The animal was still on it's way to the next batch of dog food or hamburgers if it got hit but the cowcatcher acted as a plow and pushed the dead animal to the side of the track rather than under the wheels. What really cut that down is the invention of fencing and brabed wire along with the fact that there really aren't that many people with horses anymore or cattle ranches around.

[Anonymous]

I figured that was probably the case (I knew the history of cowcatchers already, just didn't know about modern times). I guess I just expected there would be instances where a deer tried to jump across the tracks or out of the way... and ended up high enough on the engine, like stretched over the coupler, or on the front deck, or mangled in the railings, and in rural areas you'd see a loco with a deer carcass hanging from it.... sorry that was probably more of a visual than most people wanted. Just one of those things you never hear about (probably never think about) but I'm sure it happens, and I was wondering what the crew does when it happens.

[Anonymous]

Probably not more than once per animal per incident! [:o)]

[rdettmer]

well here in northern il. a deer will get hit by the passenger trains on the harvard sub a few times a year. usually mangled up pretty much. we just drag them off to the side and the fox crows and hawks will take care of them quick. once i was called to woodstock to get a fawn off the platform area ,must have stuck to the coupler and when they made trere stop to pick . up in woodstock it fell off. they sure don't l;ook like good eatin. rick

[jimrice4449]

Rats! jnkbritz posted my answer befpre I got to.

[rdettmer]

i'm sorry where in the sticks do you live? i lived in no. wisconsin and there are dead deer on highway yuccki. northern ill. is not as bad but deer are here too.on the railroad tracks deer are not as big a problem as coons and possums they commit suicisde every night. but ma nature takes care of everything.crows fox and hawks take care of things

[Anonymous]

I live in GA, and the deer down here commit suicide almost as often as the coons and possums. IIRC, deer account for about 75-85% of all single vehicle car accidents in GA, so I figured the deer must be a problem on the rails as well. Maybe they're more sensitive to the rumbling of locomotives than I thought, I just thought it'd happen more often than was ever mentioned. Might make for an interesting side scene on my layout.... pulling a dead deer off the front of a loco.

[route_rock]

Ok so far hit on the BNSF Chicago Div . 9 horses 3 cows a ton of "track walkers" (possums) coons birds turkey a chicken deer up the wazoo ( I have seena deer get its skin blasted off after getting hit by a z doing 70) Had an owl fly in an open window and perch on the control stand while the train was moving! The conductor and brakeman went out the front door the engineer out the back. Had to use a broom to swoosh him towards an open window.
Fences? HA! They have to be maintained first. Those 9 horses were all hit by one train btw.What do we do as crew? Call the DS and let him deal with it.No sense stopping and backing up trains .(Unless the DS says we have to and wait for a trainmaster to come out and talk to the owners if they can be found)

[csmith9474]

In regards to the Alaska Railroad, you may hear the term "mosse gooser" used. They are erecting fences along the ROW in certain areas to reduce these "meetings". What makes matters worse is that the moose will actually charge a train. I believe the carcasses are being sent to the state prisons for processing for human consumption. I also think I remember hearing that the ARR gets fined for each moose they strike. Anybody know anything about that????

[wjstix]

I worked with a guy here in the Twin Cities (MN) area who had a "roadkill license" from his county. When a deer got hit and killed, he would go and gather up the dead animal and butcher it for meat (which he usually donated to a local shelter). He had many (frankly kinda gross) stories about it on the highways, don't remember any about deer hit by trains but unless the deer was hit at a grade crossing I suppose no one would know about it.

BTW a key lesson he learned from that job was before you start loading a dead deer in your truck, be sure it's really dead and not just stunned !! [B)][:O]

[csmith9474]

Somewhere I have a pic of a cow that was struck by a train. There is flesh up into the traction motors and everything. I believe I aquired it somewhere on the internet.

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by jshrade

I guess I just expected there would be instances where a deer tried to jump across the tracks or out of the way... and ended up high enough on the engine, like stretched over the coupler, or on the front deck, or mangled in the railings, and in rural areas you'd see a loco with a deer carcass hanging from it.... sorry that was probably more of a visual than most people wanted.

Didn't bother me. I used to be a janitor at a blood lab. Nothing grosses me out much anymore. Plus I live in back of a highway and semi trucks are often tagging deer. You usually see them splattered allover the place.

[pcarrell]

QUOTE: Didn't bother me. I used to be a janitor at a blood lab. Nothing grosses me out much anymore.

I know what you mean. Many years ago I was the clean-up guy at a slaughter house. Nasty job!

The place was located next to some RR tracks but we never had anything come in to be butchered due to trains. Of course, the tracks weren't very busy, so that might be the reason too.

[jwar]

Wester Pacific would hit or cut a swath thru a herd of sheep comming accross Nevada, and as the new laboror at the time my job was to steam clean the locomotive. One time a machinist refused to drop a traction motor as there was a small hunk of dried up sheep wedged in the traction motor spring pack, got chewed out about it, have no clue how it got into his tool box, LOL

Riding the CZ noticed the deer were so use to trains, they hardley got out of the way.
Also noticed during deer season a train crew walking out to the outbound lead and getting on there units with rifles, three or so hours later they would call in that they had one problem or another, so much for road kills and an irate dispatcher..LOL John.

[jecorbett]

Several years ago I saw a news report about problems with moose and Maine railroads. The moose are just plain stubborn animals. It's not in their nature to yield to anything that moves. They are used to being the biggest thing out there so they figure whatever is coming out to get out of the way. To make matters worse, when they come across a rail line, they often will walk down the rail line since it is a clear path. Nobody said they were smart. They actually showed footage of a train coming up on a moose traveling in the same direction. Despite the engineer blowing his horn, the moose kept walking slowly down the track until it disappear under the hood of the engine. Goodbye moose.

[rdettmer]

sure would like to those antlers.

[Mailman56701]

QUOTE: Originally posted by dirtyd79

I imagine they probably hit deer about as often as automobiles do. I doubt they really do much about the dead deer as the carcass is probably splattered allover the place and unless the engineer is going slow or it happens to be right in front of him he'll more than likely never see or know he hit it. Maybe they'll call the game warden to take the remains to some potter's field or wherever. I remember hearing somewhere the Alaska Railroad raffles the meat to residents who live along the right of way.

Livestock like cattle and horses used to be a major problem back in the olden days and caused a few derailments so they invented cow catchers on the steam locomotives. The animal was still on it's way to the next batch of dog food or hamburgers if it got hit but the cowcatcher acted as a plow and pushed the dead animal to the side of the track rather than under the wheels. What really cut that down is the invention of fencing and brabed wire along with the fact that there really aren't that many people with horses anymore or cattle ranches around.

An animal hit by a car or train, with the massive blood shock that entails......and someone actually tries to eat it ? Hmmm.........
Years ago when I dealt with car/animal accidents, we just tossed them to the side of the road, as the only thing that would touch such meat was the scavengers.

Regarding horses/cattle ranches, go out west and you'll see plenty of 'em next to road, tracks, whatever [:)]

Especially in the open range areas.

[rdettmer]

i don't think most of the ones i've seen would be good for sausage much less meat. just get them off the tracks and the scavengers have a party. gone in a short time

[caldreamer]

On Nov 1,2005, UP took out 31 head of cattle near Kismet, KS. Seems 91 head broke loose during a ligntnig storm. According to the post on the Trains web site, there were cattle all over the place. The other 61 were still roaming the country side. It still happens here.

[rdettmer]

i remember one morning about ten years ago i got a call about 20 head of cows was roaming down the railroad tracks and were looking in the resturant windows and all over town. one got stuck between the ties of the ailroad bridge and had to be shot and lifted off the bridge with an endloader. they all were coming to town to see our cow statue harmilda every one said. the commuter trains were a little slow getting out of town that day.all but one survived.

[Th1nkG33k]

QUOTE: Originally posted by rdettmer

well here in northern il. a deer will get hit by the passenger trains on the harvard sub a few times a year. usually mangled up pretty much. we just drag them off to the side and the fox crows and hawks will take care of them quick. once i was called to woodstock to get a fawn off the platform area ,must have stuck to the coupler and when they made trere stop to pick . up in woodstock it fell off. they sure don't l;ook like good eatin. rick

I take it most of the hits are between Crystal Lake and Harvard then?

[rdettmer]

yes they aremostly betweeen harvard and crystal lake but ive seen them between barrington and fox river grove to. right on the river bridge once to.

[reklein]

an aquaintance who used to engineer fro the Camas Prairie showed me a picture of a young black bear they'd run over. Didn't know they did it till they ccme back dow to Lewiston from Orofino. It was cut cleanly in half with no particular mess. Wish I got a copy of that photo.

[Anonymous]

I have heard about incidents of moose being hit on the Iron range in N MInnesota. But any animal that will face down a logging truck and win has to have some kinda baravada. I know we had to sit and wait 2 hours onetime until one would move. Also as long as you get them quick road kill dear aren't that bad!

[fwright]

In Alaska, road kill is reserved for licensed charities. Charities are called by Highway Patrol to come collect their meat. Hunters are required to field dress and remove/pack their meat out. I would assume (but could be wrong) same rules apply to moose killed by Alaska RR.

Interesting story in the Anchorage paper a few years back about a couple of Alaska women returning from a party in January found a road kill moose on the edge of the highway. Got out in party clothes in -25 degree night and field-dressed the moose (800 lbs plus). Loaded the meat in the car and took it home. Three days later, the Highway Patrol comes around to claim the meat for charity and thanked the women for butchering the animal. Ended up having to make the women give up the moose at gunpoint. My wife commented, being an Alaskan immigrant from Virginia, that those were real Alaska women!

regards

[Anonymous]

Here in Maine critters meeting the pilot of a locomotive is common.

Back a few years ago I heard that the Bangor and Aroostook hit a huge amount of Moose (Not surprising considering the amount in northern Maine), more so than most railroads up here because the F3's (The B&A used F-units well in to the 1980's) had duck-horn's that sounded, supposedly, like a moose mating call. This is just what I heard, could be true or not.

-Justin Franz

And yeah, B&A stands for Bangor and Aroostook, not Boston and Albany![;)] At least in Maine.

[Anonymous]

You smelt one of the things after a couple of hours in the sun?
Here in the UK we get track kill every so often. Almost never edible except once a DMMU (RDC) dropped a pheasant right at my feet. Even without hanging it made a pretty good lunch. (The guy I was working with went an interesting shade of green). The big stuff takes too much impact to kill it to be usabale. Cows are a disaster... all those stomachs. We had about ten (difficult to count the bits) hit by a DMMU doing 85 on a grade crossing (farmer hadn't got permission). Bits wet everywhere... mostly both sides of the barrier... the one with the local control in it. i never did figure out why the guys didn't get it hosed down. the flies were awful. that lot derailed the train. By torchlight (later the same day) you could see the ripple stopping from 85 in about 200 yards on the balast put ito the steel frame.
We had air hostesses living in the houses backing onto that bit of line. one of them came home to find half a cow in her back yard. unphased she just wandered up to our guys at the crossing and asked "Have you lost half a cow"?
When line speeds are increased the animal fatalities go up for a week or two. The smell can be awful.

We used to use horses for shunting [switching] (before my time). Old guy I knew said that if a horse sensed a problem it was long gone before any human started to follow... fast.

I also used to do a lot of research. One of the things I should have a copy of somewhere... One of the African railways (West Coast I think) the train hit a wild elephant and crippled it. The locals and passengers killed it, butchered it and ate much of it before they put the train back on the track (2' or 3'6" gauge)... now that's sensible!

Most animals (like people) get caught out by the speed and quietness of the things... especially with the more hi-tech modern things. When they ride smooth they don't tell you they are coming.

[BigJim]

Almost everyday in our neck of the woods.
I guess possums are the big losers. I've had as many as eight confirmed kills in one night.
Deer would be next, with several kills per week. One buck couldn't decide if he wanted the doe on the left or the doe on the right, now he lays right in the groove. Men I work with that are hunters say that a deer killed by a train isn't worth eating as the meat gets bruised up too bad.
Poor old dogs, while not numerous, are the most likely NOT to get out of the way. Almost everytime they get between the rails and get I guess what would be akin to tunnel vison. They just will not get out from between the rails. I hate killing dogs[:(]
My highest total was a herd of goats that got tunnel vison. Nine confirmed kills that day.
I never have made a "double ace in a day".

[rdettmer]

been out of here awile but couple weeks ago guy missed his stop in crystal lake gets to end of line at harvard and starts walking back to c. lake, gets run over by next train into town. now hes walking right against the current of trafficand gets run over and they call it an accident cuz hes legaly blind. guess he couldn't see the headlight coming at him. when i got there he was in the bag already. thank goodness but the fire dept still had to wash down the tracks. nasty