On my layout based in present day Northeastern America, one of the roads on the layout will be the CHR(Chicago Heavy Railroad) which runs from the Appalachian Plateau in Virginia to Chicago carrying coal. All the locomotives in the fleet will all be diesel locomotives built before 1990. I already have a SF B23-7, UP F7A, and a MR C-420 that I will paint in custom CHR liverie (will show pics when done), what other locomotives should I use for the CHR?
Wow, I totally misread the question ...
pre-1990s era locomotives, I'd say you'd probably do well to get some dash-7s or dash-8s. Depends on how far back you want to go though in terms of age. I mean, a couple GP9s might not be untoward - but those were last produced in the mid 1960s.
-Dan
Builder of Bowser steam! Railimages Site
For a coal road still running an F7A after 1990, I expect you'd need another A and two B's. It's tradition. And the F's would have been lovingly maintained to last that long, and/or highly modified. Sounds like fun.
BN was famous for fielding ABBA helper sets over Marias Pass. And there's a photo of BN F's in iron ore service in 1980. You might track down photos of them in service for inspiration.
Staying with the coal road concept, one could add more modern power. That would be either EMD or GE. I would seriously consider getting SD38's and/or SD38-2's (See Athearn and Kato).
That takes care of the coal.
The B23-7 and C-420 will do well for "other" freight, especially MU'ed together as a way-freight local set.
For faster (than coal) through freights, you can't beat SD40-2's. They are kind of bland (except for the porches), so you could argue for something "different". But the SD40-2's would likely be THE best choice. OR. You might get something like SD45-2's. Or even argue for F45's.
Ed
An alternate use of the F7A, since F-units were most all retired from general freight service a long time ago, would be to power an excursion or dinner train. One F-unit with 3-4 dining cars or coaches might be a nice diversion from the usual coal trains. It wouldn't matter if the cars were all from different railroads either, as historical societies and railfan rail organizations often 'mix and match' equipment.
So your present day railroad only uses 30 year old locomotives? Um ok. Then you will need several SD40-2 locomotives. They were built until 1989. Also GP50 or GP60 locomotives. You might also want some SD40T-2 tunnel motors. Of course you don't have to paint them all in your railroad's livery. You can do what the real railroads do when they buy used locomotives and just renumber them. If your railroad can't afford new locomotives then it probably can't afford paint either.
I'd suggest using locomotives from only one manufacturer, as it would cut down on the parts inventory that your road would need to have on-hand, and also simplify maintenance, as the shop forces would need to be familiar with only one brand.It would also make sense to standardise on the models to choose: one type for the mainline trains and something else that's suitable for switching, perhaps.
While from a modelling perspective, it might be less interesting visually than having locos from different manufacturers, I'd think it to be more prototypical.
If you want to include variety in your fleet of similar locomotives, buy the same models, but in different roadnames and paint schemes, then simply "patch" them with your freelanced road's reporting marks and numbering system.
Wayne
So present day, but all locomotives are nearly 30 years old?The EMD SD40 series as previously mentioned is an obvious choice. If you like the look of GE locomotives, the GE C40-8 series as another option if you want older locomotives on line.An EMD SD50 is another option. They were gas guzzlers, but a railroad looking for some high horsepower options might snag them up and use them into the present, despite their reputation for burning fuel.
As for classic F units? You could see those in service on freights up until the 1990's; but if its the present day I can't think of any railroad still running those unless it has a tourism or museum operation of some sorts. You might be able to get away with using an F45 though in freight service, if you justify it as some second hand engine picked for its common EMD parts despite being poorly designed for switching. Shove it into the middle of a consist to sell the image that its not used for switching and just really on the train for the added horsepower. Speaking of switching, yard or local power can easily run on EMD GP9 or GP15 engines. Maybe some SW1500's or some older switcher units can work yards. The Rapido GE B36-7 coming out soon might be another unique choice for an old yard or local engine although those are somewhat rare engines in comparison to the EMD models previously mentioned.Or go crazy... a few railroads still run ALCO diesels. Those are rare operations, but those that do have managed to keep those old engines running well for over 50+ years now. In short, use some online photos to look at area shortlines and start grabbing ideas were you see them. Make sure the power has a common 'look' to them. Even buying second hand locomotives, chances are your railroad's power department looked for specific classes or unit types to compliment the roster, or bought batches or second hand engines together in auctions. You don't want it to look like the roster of some museum with "a little bit of this and a bit of that," but you can still have a varied look ala the Kyle Railway for example as long as there is a sense of history in how these strange units all ended up on the same railroad.
Keep in mind EMD built F-7s from 1946 to 1954, so the OP's F-7A would be somewhere between 64 and 72 years old!
Regarding Alcos - Montreal Locomotive Works continued building "Alco" engines for 10+ year after American Locomotive Co. quit making them in the 1960s. Minnesota Commercial RR runs some used MLW "Alcos" built in the 1970's ('80's?) - along with a few actual US Alcos. Several companies make models of MLW engines.
Just wondering, does the Chicagoland area nowadays receive a significant amount of inbound coal traffic? I know southern Illinois has several coal mines, but not sure what level of coal traffic Chicago has (maybe Gary, Hammond and what remains of industry in NW Indiana, SE Chicago?) Maybe this can help you if you haven't already seen it (Illinois State Freight Plan):http://www.idot.illinois.gov/Assets/uploads/files/Transportation-System/Reports/OP&P/ILFreightPlan_FINAL.pdfI took a bit of a look around, including that report I linked to. In 2014 Coal comprised 40+% of all rail traffic in Illinois (which is not that great for future traffic levels). Inbound coal seems to be thermal coal (for power production), and a number of articles mention at least 6 coal power plants fully or partially closed down in the north Illinois since 2012. Maybe the OP might want to diversify their planned traffic flows...
You can't go wrong hauling coal to Chicago with Century Series Alcos.
Coal road? 1990's?
SD40-2's, SD40-2's, SD40-2's. Maybe a set of C40-8's for new power. Oh yeah, get some SD40-2's.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
chutton01Just wondering, does the Chicagoland area nowadays receive a significant amount of inbound coal traffic?
Yes, they recieve a lot of coal from the Powder River Basin.
So Ill coal isn't very useful since its very high sulpur and causes emissions problems.
SD40-2s and GP50s.
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Both of these were available in Undecorated in Athearn Blue Boxes. The freelance railroader's best friends.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
SeeYou190SD40-2s and GP50s.
I would go with GP38-2's, more parts in common with the SD40-2's, they have the same 500 hp/axle as SD40-2's. GP50's are good for higher speed, lower tonnage trains such as intermodal, automotive or perishable service. Not so good for bulk service. Actually they weren't so good for any service since the SD50's were retired by the class 1's pretty quick, but they wouldn't know that yet in 1980-1990.
C40-8's (or C36-7's) had more tractive effert than an SD50.
And, on BNSF, the GP50's have mostly been effectively downgraded to GP38-2's, anyway. Pretty common for wayfreight work on the north bank of the Columbia will be a GP38-2 and a former GP50, running back to back.
I agree that a railroad would be well served by buying only GP38-2's and SD40-2's. But most of us can't exercise such restraint.
So I will still advocate for getting some SD38/SD-38-2's for coal.
And, if you want some F45's mixed in, it is not at all unreasonable. Your railroad might have bought some from BN when they sold theirs around 1985. You could have a patched BN one, and/or one repainted for your railroad.
And, noting the existing U23B and C-420, there might be other interesting remnants. Who knows, maybe a cow and calf (and another calf?)(C&O) SW7. Just don't get carried away with wide variety.
But to field a reasonably prototypical roster, I advocate the coherence of MOSTLY those dash 2's mentioned earlier.
How come nobody is mentioning U-Boats? Six Axle. U33C, U36C.
Or C30-7s.
I'd think that if the railroad used B23-7's, they'd have more GEs.
- Douglas
Amtrak 42 On my layout based in present day Northeastern America, one of the roads on the layout will be the CHR(Chicago Heavy Railroad) which runs from the Appalachian Plateau in Virginia to Chicago carrying coal. All the locomotives in the fleet will all be diesel locomotives built before 1990. I already have a SF B23-7, UP F7A, and a MR C-420 that I will paint in custom CHR liverie (will show pics when done), what other locomotives should I use for the CHR?
wjstixJust to refresh everyone's memory, we're talking about a layout set in 2018, but using locomotives that were built before 1990.
Its a fantasy line. Got it.
Then he can use whatever strikes his fancy, pick which engine he thinks looks best. What the prototype would do becomes irrelevant.
Now, back to the chit-chat:
It's been sticking in my head that there's the little U boat and the little Alco. How to explain them, if everything else is EMD.
So, the argument to go GE DOES have a good point. You could have a mix of Century's and GE's. Instead of the dash 2's. And you'd also need a really good crew in your shops to keep them happy. There's a reason the dash 2's won.
I think the point of the question is how to assemble a roster that looks sorta kinda half-way reasonable. And fun.
dehusman wjstix Just to refresh everyone's memory, we're talking about a layout set in 2018, but using locomotives that were built before 1990. Its a fantasy line. Got it. Then he can use whatever strikes his fancy, pick which engine he thinks looks best. What the prototype would do becomes irrelevant.
wjstix Just to refresh everyone's memory, we're talking about a layout set in 2018, but using locomotives that were built before 1990.
I'm not seeing where the OP said "primarily second-hand units". They COULD be. They could also be leftovers on a frugal railroad.
OP might want to change from "insisting" that all locos in 2018 are required to have been built before 1990. But "frugal" combined with talented shop crews might pull it off.
Sometimes people come in with a certain idea, and leave with a modified version.
wjstixAs a free-lancer myself, not sure I'd agree with that. I try to use equipment that is plausible for what my railroad would use if it really had existed.
Just take into consideration that many of the engines suggested (Alco's, U boats, F units) had already been scrapped for a decade or more before the 1990 cut off.
The NEWEST engine he could have is almost 30 years old. SD40-2's are over 40 years old. On any railroad that runs coal trains, those engines have been down graded to switch engines, maybe locals or transfers.
If the question is, "What would the prototype do in 2018?", the answer would be not use 40 year old engines for long distance coal trains. Now he could ask the question, "What would the prototype do in 1990?" and then do that. That question has been answered. If its not one of those two questions, then it pretty much opens up the possibilities to anything thing he wants (and that's fine).
Some great suggestions for this person.
I model modern and have U boats on the railroad, Alco engines, lots of geeps. It's what you're comfortable with and can afford. It's fictional, to a degree and like Dave stated, what would the protoype do?
Whatever you decide, please post pics so we see what your railroad fleet looks like!
Neal
Altough it was a short line, the Transkentucky Transportation Railroad used old GE diesels to move coal. The linked article says they shut down the railroad after losing the coal contracts and weather damage to trackage. A look at the corporate website shows only transloading, car storage, and warehousing as the services now provided.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transkentucky_Transportation_Railroad
I think the take away from the article isn't the use of older power for moving coal, but that if the time being modelled is the last few years (instead of sometime 1990/95 to 2010) that a railroad is going to need something other than coal to survive. Coal still moves, but in most places it's not what it was 10 years ago.
Jeff
While generally I dislike whimsical things like this, it isn't without real world analogue. The Western New York and Pennsylvania has a fleet of around 19 locomotives and everything is ALCO and MLW. The baby of the fleet dates to 1971.
No cutesy scenic line or anything. Just a work a day regional with a decided atypical fleet.
7j43k Now, back to the chit-chat: It's been sticking in my head that there's the little U boat and the little Alco. How to explain them, if everything else is EMD. So, the argument to go GE DOES have a good point. You could have a mix of Century's and GE's. Instead of the dash 2's. And you'd also need a really good crew in your shops to keep them happy. There's a reason the dash 2's won. I think the point of the question is how to assemble a roster that looks sorta kinda half-way reasonable. And fun. Ed
Wasn't GE thought of as the successor to Alco?
Depends also on the size of the railroad. The Escanaba and Lake Superior still occasionally runs its Baldwins.Here in South Dakota I've seen SD40-2s start popping up as switching power at elevators. There were a LOT of them built, so they aren't hard to find on the secondhand market.GP40s also show up fairly often in regionals. The Milwaukee was using GP40s for yard switching in the early 80s, for that matter.There are real, actual "used locomotive for sale" brokers out there. Check their web sites; what your railroad has would be influenced by what's available.
Disclaimer: This post may contain humor, sarcasm, and/or flatulence.
Michael Mornard
Bringing the North Woods to South Dakota!