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What is the last year before graffiti became commonplace

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Posted by rrebell on Saturday, March 3, 2018 10:02 AM

Graffiti is starting to disapear out in the west, the so called artists are getting jail time now.

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Posted by NWP SWP on Saturday, March 3, 2018 12:20 AM

Kilroy was here...

I keep trying to post a picture of MASH Kilroy was here reference but it's not working, just Google images "mash kilroy" and you'll see it.

Anyone ever hear the story about the conference at Potsdam and the special outhouse for Roosevelt, Churchill, and Stalin? Stalin was the first one in and when he came out he said to his aide in Russian of course, "Who is Kilroy?"Laugh

 

Steve

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Posted by joe323 on Wednesday, February 28, 2018 8:30 PM

Funny thing is that I am thinking of using Welcome back Kotter music as background for video of my subway display when completed. But I have no intention of covering my proto subway in graffiti.

Joe Staten Island West 

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Posted by dknelson on Friday, February 23, 2018 10:51 AM

Maybe it is more useful to use the word "tagging" to refer to the kind of graffiti seen today -- the really large and obtrusive stuff that uses up cans of spray paint: the works of "art" as well as the more or less meaningless symbols and emblems and nicknames.

In looking through my rail photos and slides -- I got my first 35mm camera around 1979 -- I am surprised by how relatively little tagging there is in the shots from the decades of the 1980s.  There is some to be sure but car after car has none.  By the mid 1990s everything had changed.  So speaking purely personally, I'd say seriously "tagged" cars were in the minority into the early 1990s but then things seemed to explode, and all the ratios got reversed rather suddenly.  It was the untagged cars that became the rarities.

Just one guy's impressions, for what they are worth.

Dave Nelson

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Posted by wjstix on Thursday, February 22, 2018 3:44 PM

IIRC "graffiti" is a Latin term, so apparently it goes back to Roman times.

One thing about freight cars is the chalk markings on them were often not done by hoboes (like "J.B.King esq." or "Bozo Texino") but by railroad yard workers. Chalk marks were used in working out cuts of cars to be added to a train, sometimes looking like fractions ("1/8" "2/8" etc. in an eight car cut). I believe railroaders might also mark a car to indicate it had been inspected, or that there could be a problem that needed to be checked, or which train it was to go out on, or for other reasons.

Stix
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Posted by SeeYou190 on Thursday, February 22, 2018 1:33 PM

Outside of Miami there is very little Grafitti in Florida. 

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We fight it by immediately painting over it. Most munincipalities have crews that go out and cover at as soon as it is reported. You see the beige paint-outs on nearly every overpass, but very little grafitti remains more than a day or two.

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The paintings on train cars are another issue. No real way to fight them

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I will say the grafitti murals have become much more funny in the recent years. I saw one painted up like a billboard for The Big Bang Theory, and another like a Skittles package.

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Weird.

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-Kevin

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Posted by Lone Wolf and Santa Fe on Thursday, February 22, 2018 12:02 PM

    Graffiti started being common in New York in the 1970s. The subway cars in the opening sequence of the TV show Welcome Back Kotter are covered in it. Also in the movie The Warriors the gang members were instructed to tag everything with their mark.
    Graffiti didn’t really make it to the west coast until the late 1980s or early 1990s when it started showing up everywhere around here. It’s timing coincided with the popularity of rap music and ghetto culture, crack cocaine, the collapse of the economy and the Rodney King riots.  In the 80s everyone in southern California had salmon pink block walls around their yards. By the 90s they had all be tagged with graffiti and then repainted primer gray by municipal governments in a vain attempt to rid cities of this blight.
    The farther away from major urban cities the longer it took to reach there. Some areas that are more affluent or rural still have very little or none.

Modeling a fictional version of California set in the 1990s Lone Wolf and Santa Fe Railroad
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Posted by BRAKIE on Thursday, February 22, 2018 11:21 AM

chutton01
but I cannot say when freight car graffiti (as we know it, with sizable "murals") really took off and became common - early 1990s maybe?

When I first notice graffiti  was on cars from the Western or Chicago area railroads and that was in 2,000.

A lot of railroad videos from the 90s shows graffiti free cars.

Larry

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Summerset Ry.


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Posted by chutton01 on Thursday, February 22, 2018 8:57 AM

BRAKIE
You can model the 90s with very little graffiti then it seem to explode in 2000.


It depends on your location. I grew up in the NY area in the 1970s and 80s, and Graffiti was pretty darn common - even in less dense residental area, the "artists" would often mark a garage door or wall with their tags. 
Subway graffiti was common in the 1970s as images will show, but an intensive MTA campaign to combat it showed results by the late 1980s.
Truck trailers and such would get marked as well, but I cannot say when freight car graffiti (as we know it, with sizable "murals") really took off and became common - early 1990s maybe?

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Posted by RR_Mel on Thursday, February 22, 2018 7:49 AM

The City of Bakersfield added a Graffiti crew in the mid 90s and a second crew in the late 90s so it was in full force by then.  In the early 2000s the Police Department added two officers to fight Graffiti.
 
 
 
Mel
 
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Posted by BRAKIE on Thursday, February 22, 2018 4:25 AM

You can model the 90s with very little graffiti then it seem to explode in 2,000.

Larry

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Summerset Ry.


"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt  Safety First!"

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Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, February 22, 2018 2:50 AM

It depends what kind you mean. If you mean the old fashioned hobo markings, probably the very moment a hobo picked up a piece of chalk and wrote markings on a train car to send messages to other hobos. Chalk was and still is used by yard clerks and yard foremen to mark cars in yards for things like routing and such. Some even got creative and drew little symbols for cars they handled. 

If you mean the elaborate tags and murals I think those started in the 60s and 70s on the sides of subway cars in New York. Gang tags, peace signs, jokes, political messages, Kilroy was here, and other generic graffiti like so and so loves whoever probably started in the 60s and 70s too. But from what I've seen graffiti, especially the elaborate tags and murals on freight cars really became much more common in the 90s and 2000s.

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Posted by marksrailroad on Thursday, February 22, 2018 2:14 AM

I model the 1940s and 50s so I don't have to worry about graffiti...

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Posted by gmpullman on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 11:43 PM

SeeYou190
I got on this thread before it got locked!

No reason for it to be locked.

Mr. Otte is very reasonable when it comes to discussing graffiti. It is very much a part of today's railroad scene. The OP was merely inquiring as to when it became "viral" as it were.

Pros and cons of graffiti are on a par with weathering, ballasting or, dare I say DC vs. DCC Confused

I admire some of the fantastic work done by modelers in replicating present day graffiti. It simply doesn't fit my era. 

Regards, Ed

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Posted by NWP SWP on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 10:05 PM

Kilroy was here is the name of a Styx album... and Mr. Roboto is Kilroy...

Here's the Wikipedia article on the phrase...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilroy_was_here

Steve

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Posted by SeeYou190 on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 9:23 PM

I got on this thread before it got locked!

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Cool

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-Kevin

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Posted by RR_Mel on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 8:16 PM

Got this with a Google Serach
 
The first modern graffiti writer is widely considered to be Cornbread, a high school student from Philadelphia, who in 1967 started tagging city walls to get the attention of a girl. But it was only in the 1980s that galleries began to showcase graffiti as artwork.
 
 
Mel
 
Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951
  
 
My Model Railroad   
 
Bakersfield, California
 
I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
 
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Posted by BigDaddy on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 7:51 PM

James A Kilroy, tank inspector in WW2 invented modern graffiti writing "Kilroy was here" in the tanks he inspected.

Before that, Hobos had an elaborate symbolic system that they used on rail stock and adjacent structures.

It really took off in the 60's with the generalized decline in morality.  Having gone to college in the 60's I can't be more specific as I don't remember much of it.  Big Smile

Hobos and graffiti are specifically banned subjects so read quick before this thread vanishes.

 

Henry

COB Potomac & Northern

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What is the last year before graffiti became commonplace
Posted by yellow_cad on Wednesday, February 21, 2018 7:28 PM

I don't model graffiti so just wondered what is the last year (roughly) before graffiti showed up.

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