Hi, I just acquired some attractive P2K PS-2CD 4427 Cu Ft covered grain hoppers for the Cooperative Marketing Association and the Midwestern Grain Company. I am wondering if anyone knows whether these are / were real companies, and if so, where based? I have googled both but without being able to identify either, amongst a plethora of similar named companies whose title is usually followed by "of Indiana", or "of Kensington MN". I found a more widespread enterprise, "Midwest Grain", but this was not formed until 2000, whereas these cars seem to be for the late 60s - 70s era. There is a reference on the Walthers instruction sheet to "Mainline Modeler" magazine for March 1995 for "photographs, scale drawings and a complete roster" of the 4427 PS-2CD cars, and I could hunt this down, but a list of 4427 PS-2CD lessors will not answer my question, "who were these companies, where based, and when?"
I would be grateful for any info.
Best Regards,
Bill.
This is just a guess, but if those companies are real, they likely don't have any fixed assets outside of the actual covered hoppers. The companies likely act as middle men hauling grain from the elevators to the consumers. In this arrangement, the elevators that are served by the 'marketing associations' are typically all owners of the association.
Omaha Road Man they likely don't have any fixed assets outside of the actual covered hoppers.
I'm pretty sure that in most cases those cars were leased.
Good chance, though the entity that owns and leases the cars could have substantially similar ownership as the marketing association.
Business is fun.
Hi, thanks for your replies. I should have said that the cars for both companies carry TLDX reporting marks, and so are leased from a company which had its origins as "Transport Leasing, a Division of Pullman Inc.". The Pullman empire, which was broken up in stages from 1944 under anti-trust legislation, originally included "Transport Leasing, a Division of Pullman Inc." , which became independent as Pullman Leasing Company (reporting mark PLCX) in 1981. Wiki says this was then absorbed by GE Leasing, but Bloomberg indicates that it still has a separate identity as a railcar leaser. Anyway, it appears that GE Leasing absorbed several railcar leasing companies over the years and carried their reporting marks forward, so the TLDX reporting mark does not firmly date the car to the pre-1981 Pullman Inc. era.
I have now found a photo of a much weathered hopper, TLDX 7638, lettered for the Cooperative Marketing Association, at McKees Rocks, PA, just outside Pittsburgh, dated 1998 (see link http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3723894), but the patched paintwork and the fact that the cars it is attached to at either side carry other companies' paint schemes suggest that it may by now be living a gypsy life far from its original Cooperative Marketing Association home turf.
Those 4427's were last built around the late 60's/early 70's. They were replaced in production by the 4740 and then the 4750 grain hopper. I suspect both versions of the 4427 are quite rare as they expired on the 40 year rule. I remember seeing newer 4740's marked to be returned to company shops after unloading in 2012...
Jim
Modeling BNSF and Milwaukee Road in SW Wisconsin
Hi Jim, thanks, I did not know about the 40 year rule. But it will not be a problem, they need to be at home being switched by Frisco mandarin and white locos and Rock Island bankruptcy blue locos, both of which species died of natural causes in 1980. So my main issue is still location. But if nobody knows, then nobody can object!
Will the cars be loaded at customers on your layout, or will they arrive loaded for delivery to your roads customers? Or will they simply be passing through? If the second or third option, I'd say you could plausibly use them anywhere. Perhaps the companies only served grain elevators in a certain state/region, but the products from those elevators would have likely been delivered throughout the country.
Ha! So in a fit of enthusiasm I bought Walthers 933-2492 Head House with Silos (8 silos), 933-3022 Concrete Grain Elevator (another 8 silos plus a large elevator tower), and 933-4047 Prarie Co-op (4 silos with integral elevator). These are to be arranged in a yet to be designed grain handling complex, in which I envisage 2492 + 3022 will belong to one coy, not least because the silo parts for both kits are the same, whilst the smaller structure 4047 will be on a different track and operated independently. So clasically if on the prarie all these silos would be filled by road and emptied by rail, but if in a big city, say Minneapolis or Oklahoma City, they would be filled by rail. I also have Centennial Mills (933-3160), which is the low relief version of Red Wing Milling, so the complex could become a destination. Either way the hoppers will not be travelling far!
What are the car numbers on the models?
The club had a copy of the March, 1995, Mainline Modeler.
According to the roster in the article, Pullman-Standard in early 1967 (March and April?) built about 526 cars in their lot 9154. All of these were owned by TLDX. There were 15 cars in the series 7002 - 7016 that are shown as being leased from TLDX by a company called Midwestern.
There were several more lots of these cars, the last being 9553, which was a 500 car series that was owned by the ATSF about June, 1971.
All of the cars had truck mounted brakes and low brake wheels.
I did not see any indication that any of the above were leased to CO-operative Marketing. However, Mainline Modeler in their November/December, 1994, issues had articles about the PS 4427 low-sided PS-2CDs. These would not be the P2K cars. The November issue had a roster. Per the roster, there was a 25 car series in lot 8910, numbers 2990-3014 that were owned by TLDX and leased to Co-operative marketing about July, 1964. Many of these cars came with high mounted brake wheels. I don't know if they came with truck mounted brakes.
I hope this additional info is helpful to you.
Hi, thanks, that is very helpful. My Midwestern Grain road #s are TLDX 7003, 7008, 7013. Your info confirms these are genuine. It also suggests that Midwestern might have been a small company if it only took 15 hoppers - it might have had others of different types, but it seems reasonable to equate batch size with fleet size.
My Cooperative Marketing #s are TLDX 7572 and 7590. The photo of a real Coop Marketing 4427 hopper #7638 in the P2K exact livery proves the company and paint scheme are genuine, and the car in the photo looks identical to the P2K model. If the P2k road #s are accurate then the range from at least as low as 7572 to at least as high as 7638 suggests a larger fleet, but maybe not the original lessees.
Portland BillMy Cooperative Marketing #s are TLDX 7572 and 7590. The photo of a real Coop Marketing 4427 hopper #7638 in the P2K exact livery proves the company and paint scheme are genuine, and the car in the photo looks identical to the P2K model. If the P2k road #s are accurate then the range from at least as low as 7572 to at least as high as 7638 suggests a larger fleet, but maybe not the original lessees.
If we assume that TLDX kept the same car numbers but then changed the lessee markings, which I think is logical, then the 7572, 7590, and 7638 were in a group of 100 cars (in lot 9156) ranging from 7557 to 7656. According to the roster in the MM March issue, these were originally leased to Farmers Union CO-OP Marketing Association in September, 1967.
My personal opinion is that anyone interested in things of this nature would do well to try to accumulate issues of Mainline Modeler when available. There was always a wealth of information in many of the issues.
Aha, then I'm guessing it is the same Coy, but that on these cars they did not paint the full name, just the "Cooperative Marketing Association" part.
Thanks,