If the EBT decided to purchase an EMD F unit, what color would it be?
South Penn
Well, the east broad top color pallet is Black, Orange, White and the Dark Green of the passenger cars. Some railroads when getting new diesel power made totally new color schemes though the logo should stay pretty much original.
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Wow. An interesting question with a lot of implications. You didn't mention regauging the EBT, so I'm assuming we're staying with a narrow gauge East Broad Top.
It's true that standard gauge cars did operate on narrow gauge trucks over the EBT, so I guess it might be possible that an F unit on narrow gauge trucks could fit through the tunnels. However, I doubt that such a unit would be very stable, and I would guess that something like the WP&Y's GE diesels would be a much more likely choice. An F unit probably would have much more power than needed for EBT's 22-car trains. Longer trains would mean the expense of lengthening all the sidings. Mike Lehmann might be able to make good suggestions here.
Over on the other side of Broad Top Mountain, the standard gauge Huntingdon & Broad Top Mountain did consider purchase of a diesel in the early 1950's, but an F unit wasn't considered. The road looked into buying a single C-C Baldwin road switcher to replace steam. It probably would have worked the mines and industries east and south of Saxton in the daytime, then made the run to the PRR interchange at Huntingdon at night. There was no thought that a second unit could be in the budget. In the end, the expense couldn't be justified and the road was abandoned as an all-steam operation, with a few miles on the south end being sold to the fledgeling Everett RR. I've never heard any suggestion as to a livery for the proposed H&BTM engine, but I've asked a friend who would know if anybody does. Now I'm waiting for his answer.
As mentioned, EBT steam locos were black with red cab roofs and orange lettering. Passenger cars were Forest Green. Freight cars and cabooses were red. Good luck coming up with a diesel paint scheme based on that. I agree with Casy: The traditional EBT logo is a nonnegotiable sine qua non.
Tom
Tom,
I think South Penn mentioned doing some standard gauge EBT stuff in another thread, so my guess is his assumption is for standard gauge ops. I'd certainly agree that if they did do NG diesels, it would be with hood units as better suited for its service and operations. Some version of the WP&Y Alcos seems likely The EBT likely wouldn't need that big plow and flangers. They might also skip the side door (added from what I understand, to help with crew exit in case of accident or slides). So a somewhat different appearance, but basically the same unit would be my prediction. Of course, EMD had some export biz, so there's possibilities there.
Now for paint, consider what the Rio Grande did. Both cab and hood units started as basic black, with the logo, striping, etc in some version of the several yellows that the Rio Grande used. Someone mentioned the black-and-yellow scheme, found on the Stewart FTs in Rio Grande flavor, was basically the same as the MEC's, which was cookie-cuttered from standard EMD artwork.
With the EBT being on a budget, some variation of that theme seems likely on a EBT F unit, with the logo and striping in the memorable EBT orangish on basic black.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
EMD designed most of the first generation paint schemes used on E and F units using common styling elements. Based on roads roughly in the same area, EBT colors would probably be a subdued darker color with some lighter striping.
Sorry about the lack of information.
The 'F' units will be standard gauge for two reasons: One, I don't want to add another element to my layout as I still have a lot of work to do already. The narrow gauge EBT will connect ( via a spur ) to the Blacklog at Neelyton.
Two, I already have 4 new in the box, undecorated, Stewart/Kato 'F' units. 2 'A' units and 2- 'B' units, all powered. Although Alco RS series engines might be a better match for the EBT, narrow or standard gauge. Hmmm...
I have been looking at pictures of EBT equipment and buildings. The station at Orbisonia is ivory ( or cream ) and green. This would be a good choice except the Blacklog RR is the same colors.
I looked at pulling the red from some of the rolling stock and doing a white and red combination, except that is the South Penn's colors. And red and green would look like a Christmas decoration.
'F' units in black are just plain ugly. Like the ones the PennCentral had.
RDG Casey mentioned that a lot of railroads went to a completely different paint scheme when they bought new equipment. So, I am leaning towards using violet ( purple? ) and white like the Atlantic Coast Line, or blue and grey like the Delaware and Hudson, or orange and grey ( silver? ) like the Western Pacific.
The FEBT have decals of the logo in different colors, and different scales.
Thanks for all your suggestions.
The East Broad Top did have 2 standard gauge 0-6-0s for switching the interchange yard at Mount Union with the PRR. One still resides peacefully sleeping in the Mount Union Engine House, which contains dual gauge trackage. The EBT could have very well bought standard gauge EMDs to replace the steamers, although I can't imagine that they would have been F units, but rather SW or NW switchers. So go ahead and create an EBT EMD paint scheme. It very well could have been.
If the EBT dieselized it would have done so with either GE 44 or 70 tonners. GE made several proposals to the EBT about using those engines to replace steam. It was just too late to make it worth while.
If you are going to have an standard guage engine, try a version of an EMD "stock" design. Basically its a variation on the Lehigh Valley design. Base color with a contrasting color in a broad stripe or stripes along the side and curves down to the anticlimber to a point on the nose. LV, B&M, DRGW, PRR, RDG and lots of others had some variation on that scheme.
Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com
Again referring to the standard gauge Huntingdon & Broad Top Mountain a few miles to the West, that road adopted Royal Blue and Imitation Gold for its passenger trains in the 1940's. There has been some speculation that those colors might have been applied to the Baldwin AS-616, if they had bought it. My own guess is that the scheme might have looked something like the freight scheme applied to B&O's first generation hoods. Of course that's just speculation, since it never happened. Also, the EBT and H&BTM had no corporate ties, so their commonality is purely geographical. In any case, the EBT logo ought to be prominent on the nose of your F's.
As the new owner of the EBT (I wish) I decided to set the railroad world on it's ear.
Yes, it's purple and white.
Great job. I understand the rivet counter mentality in the hobby, but I like the imagination aspect more.
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
If the ACL could embrace purple so can your updated EBT, looks good to me but then I have a reefer that is replete with purple sideframes as per its protoype!
Dave