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Do US and canadian trains exchange crews at the border?

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  • Member since
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  • From: Detroit, Michigan
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Posted by Soo Line fan on Sunday, October 5, 2014 10:33 AM

Here in Detroit, I used to see the SOO/CP Chicago to Montreal and Chicago to Toronto trains a lot in the early 90s as it was a good opportunity to photograph SOO power.

These trains ran over CSX from Chicago to Detroit using American crews. They always switched to CP crews near the Rougemere yard close to Detroit.

The CP crew would run the trains through the Detroit / Windsor tunnel. American crews never went over to Canada from what I saw but this may have changed.

Jim

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  • From: 4610 Metre's North of the Fortyninth on the left coast of Canada
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Posted by BATMAN on Thursday, October 2, 2014 4:29 PM

I still have a Passport as some countries are a little behind in the technology. On my drivers license there is my S.I.N. # , my medical #, my passport info and a few other things I can't remember. If I collapse the Paramedics can swipe my Drivers License and get my complete medical history, including the drugs I am on in an instant. The medical info is updated the instant I pick up a new perscription at the drug store. So is any other procedure I might have had.

Last time I went through Heathrow, I didn't even see a customs officer or any other human, I just swiped myself through. I think they must have some sort of facial recognition thing going on when you swipe, otherwise anyone could just use my stolen DL or PP.

I went into the hospital a while back and all I did was swipe my drivers license and went up to the ward. Didn't touch a pen or a piece of paper going in or out.

It is really nice having all that info on one card, my wallet is so much smaller.

Brent

"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."

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Posted by mlehman on Thursday, October 2, 2014 3:06 PM

Ah, but there's something more convenient people should know about...

You no longer have to tote around a passport for travel to Canada and a number of other nations in the Western hemisphere - it may have expanded beyond that, but it's been a few years since the wife got hers. What is it? Basically a passport-on-an-ID-card, so it fits easily in your wallet. AFAIK, for the usual tourist travel to Canada it's considered the same as a passport.

You apply for it the same way you do a passport. I think it was cheaper for my wife to combine renewing the passport with getting the card. In any case, the card is cheaper than the passport if that's all you'll need (based on where it's accepted in lieu of the passport by the US).

Brent's right about why Canada requires US citizens to carry the proper documents -- to get back into the US once they leave. It's been just the last few years this has been in effect and is, quite frankly, over the top in terms of maximum hassle to little effect. But I'm not a politician, so will be quiet on that topic.

Mike Lehman

Urbana, IL

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  • From: 4610 Metre's North of the Fortyninth on the left coast of Canada
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Posted by BATMAN on Thursday, October 2, 2014 1:18 PM

Actually the reason Canada Customs requires U.S. citizens to carry a passport is because the U.S. won't let them back in without them. We live a short walk from the U.S. border and we have had a few American friends and acquaintances at our house or parking their motorhomes on the property for days waiting to get it all straightened out. These were usually people that have come up for the dog show circuit and had no idea of the passport situation until they tried to return home. They were lucky our rates were so good.WinkLaugh

I had a good talk with a guy from Washington State that had come up with his club for a show. He said they had a hard time getting people to come up to shows, even if they are just over the border because so few of them had passports. As a result they were on a skeleton crew running the layout. In fact I was asked to help out for a while so the guys could get some lunch.

Brent

"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."

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Posted by wjstix on Thursday, October 2, 2014 12:50 PM

For many years, you only needed an ID to be able to cross the US-Canada border on vacation. Growing up, my family started taking vacation trips to Canada back in 1967, and continued into the 1980s. After 9-11, that was changed so that you now need a US passport to cross the border into Canada. (However, last time my wife and I crossed the border neither country's border agents asked for our passports.)

That reminds me...at one time, maybe 30 years ago, Canada considered model railroad equipment as "electronics", which meant they were charged a very high import duty - so US model train products were very expensive in Canada. I know there were guys in Winnipeg and Thunder Bay who were sort of latter-day 'rum runners' - they would drive down to Duluth or the Twin Cities, and load up their car with MRC power packs and such, and 'smuggle' them back into Canada to sell to their friends or for their model train clubs use.

Kinda like how long ago people from here in Minnesota had to drive to Wisconsin or Iowa to bring back margarine....

Wink

Stix
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Posted by davidmurray on Thursday, October 2, 2014 12:04 PM

Post Katrina our local union (CAW) sponsor tradesmen spending vacation time to help in New Orleans.  Even as a volunteer effort the right papers had to be filed, as their tools were going with them and they were obviously going to work.

Paper work done, no problem.

Someone mentioned length of vacation, one of my retired brothers, and his wife, spent 4 months in Mrtyle Beach last winter.  After 90 day the state government refunded the hotel room tax for the whole stay.

Dave

David Murray from Oshawa, Ontario Canada
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Posted by wjstix on Thursday, October 2, 2014 10:05 AM

Back to the OP, any time you work in a foreign country (or a citizen of another country comes to work in the US), you have to get a work permit or similar paperwork. It's much more complicated than just getting a tourist visa, student visa etc. If your friend's company sent him to work in Canada without having filed the proper paperwork and gotten permission from the Canadian gov't. to allow him to work there, that's his company's fault, not the Canadian government's.

 

Stix
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  • From: Calgary
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Posted by cx500 on Tuesday, September 30, 2014 8:03 PM

Depends on which route.  In some places the crews change at the border, and of course if they interchange with another railroad that is usually a case.  Other places the crews change near the border, at some convenient station perhaps 5 miles away.  But often, particularly if it is the same railroad both sides, the crew district can extend well into the other country.  I believe they still may at least pause at the entry point to get "blessed" by Customs&Immigration.

As to the person running into trouble at the border, that can and does happen in either direction crossing the border.  The paperwork is fairly minimal but needs to be in place ahead of time and carried with the person.  Without it there can be problems.  Obviously somebody didn't do their homework.

That's between Canada and the US.  Mexico is very different.

  • Member since
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Posted by BATMAN on Tuesday, September 30, 2014 6:42 PM

As a little side note. The BNSF Canadian employees get paid in U.S. dollars. Needless to say when the U.S. dollar is at a high level these guy's are pretty flush.

Brent

"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."

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Posted by NorthWest on Tuesday, September 30, 2014 5:58 PM

Now, crews are cleared to work across the border, and simply work through.

Stix, I think that was a trade thing, the railroads would have to pay duty on locomotives that hung around on the other side of the border for too long.

mh1
  • Member since
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Posted by mh1 on Tuesday, September 30, 2014 5:57 PM

Simple answer: yes. When trains enter the US the train and crew are subject to inspection. Customs and the Border Patrol like to check for aliens, etc. 

The crew will either head back on a train waiting for a crew, or take a cab.

If it's a US crew, train still stops, but crew is allowed to continue on.

A Canadian crew can bring a train into the terminal/yards, but may not switch cars, perform other work etc. 

Along with immigration laws, there are also union rules about crews and cross border traffic. 

Whole thing sounds complicated with red tape.

 

  • Member since
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  • From: Gateway City
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Posted by yankee flyer on Tuesday, September 30, 2014 4:20 PM

Thanks Guys

I'm not sure of the exact circumstances, but it just seemed kind of harsh to me.

Whistling

Lee

  • Member since
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Posted by wjstix on Tuesday, September 30, 2014 12:51 PM

I think since the passage of NAFTA in the 1990's a lot of the old restrictions have gone away. In the past, trains had to stop at the border to go through customs. On passenger trains, they might pick up customs agents at the border and they would ride the train checking that everything / everybody was OK. There used to be restrictions on how long equipment could 'linger' also. IIRC on Duluth Winnipeg & Pacific passenger trains, any CN passenger cars or engines coming down to Duluth/Superior on a train had to be returned to Canada within 24 (or 48?) hours.

Plus of course a Canadian railroad running into Canada (or vice versa) had to incorporate as a separate company in the other country. So, the 35 mi. or so of CN's mainline that ran through northern Minnesota (south of Lake of the Woods and the Northwest Angle - the little notch of MN that sticks up into Canada) was incorporated in the US as the Minnesota & Manitoba Ry (or Manitoba & Minnesota, I forget which).

Stix
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Posted by mlehman on Tuesday, September 30, 2014 10:36 AM

Yeah, if you're a tourist, just show up at the border with proper docs and temporary admittance (not sure about how long, as our vacations just don't last that long...) is permitted .

Work is an entirely different matter. That always requires more formal paperwork, perhaps a specific visa for the passport, etc, no matter which country you travel to. I'm rather surprised his employer wasn't aware of such requirements. Canada isn't the 51st state, after all. And the US certainly has its own share of such paperwork, bureaucracy, etc if you want to come here and work.

Mike Lehman

Urbana, IL

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Posted by BATMAN on Tuesday, September 30, 2014 10:13 AM

I live close to where the BNSF crosses the border and it doesn't even slow down. There are reciprocal agreements between the two countries on labour laws. Things like train crews, pilots, athletes of professional sports teams move seamlessly between the two. Obtaining a variance is not difficult and your friend should know the rules and reg's, especially if he is working for an international company. Canada (and most countries) regulate foreign workers just as the United States does. Why do you seem surprised by what happened to your friend? He was going to Canada to do work.

Brent

"All of the world's problems are the result of the difference between how we think and how the world works."

  • Member since
    December 2007
  • From: Gateway City
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Do US and canadian trains exchange crews at the border?
Posted by yankee flyer on Tuesday, September 30, 2014 8:24 AM

Enquiring minds would like to know. The Canadian's are very picky about americans doing any work in their country.

A friend, who is an accident investigater was detained by the Police when he flew in to Canada to work an accident for his multinational company   Grumpy

Have a good day.

Lee

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