I failed to mention Mitchell, Indiana, where the B&O and Monon (L&N) also interchanged.. That interchange was a little less rural and was probably more active back in the day. You may be able to find more information on that interchange. It was located on the B&O's St.Louis to Cincy line, whereas the Roachdale interchange was located on B&O's Indianapolis line. Both the EW and NS tracks were active until very recently. The ex Monon L&N is owned by the Indiana Railroad now.
Since you liked the photo in my last post, here is another, albeit later than your desired time frame.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/55203783@N06/5797671257/
- Douglas
Great picture, Doughless. I was looking at street-level view and you can still kinda see where those old B&O (I assume) east-west tracks were in the pavement, and the surrounding topography appears to at one time had tracks running east-west all the way through. That is perfect, thanks so much for the info!
rrlcommish I am looking to model the early to mid 1960s to match up with the equipment I have (plus a general interest in that era). As for where, that kind of depends on the results I get from researching these interchanges. I would like to model more rural areas, so central Cincinnati is probably not good. Some rural areas of Kentucky, Indiana or Illinois would be fantastic. Looks like cuyama's 1953 ORER has some interchanges in Illinois, that would be perfect. Where can I get a copy of an ORER for the period I want, are they available on eBay? I also would like some photos, obviously. I have some L&N photos but not interchanging with B&O. Even just a rough representation with some creative license would be good enough. I'm not that big of a stickler for perfection...I just want a railroad that makes sense and could be believeable. If it's believeable, that's "good enough" (as Allen McLelland would say). Thanks guys for your help.
I am looking to model the early to mid 1960s to match up with the equipment I have (plus a general interest in that era). As for where, that kind of depends on the results I get from researching these interchanges. I would like to model more rural areas, so central Cincinnati is probably not good. Some rural areas of Kentucky, Indiana or Illinois would be fantastic. Looks like cuyama's 1953 ORER has some interchanges in Illinois, that would be perfect. Where can I get a copy of an ORER for the period I want, are they available on eBay? I also would like some photos, obviously. I have some L&N photos but not interchanging with B&O. Even just a rough representation with some creative license would be good enough. I'm not that big of a stickler for perfection...I just want a railroad that makes sense and could be believeable. If it's believeable, that's "good enough" (as Allen McLelland would say). Thanks guys for your help.
The B&O interchanged freight with the Monon in Roachdale Indiana. Monon tracks became L&N in 1971, so you might check to see if the interchange was still active then. I would think your 60's equipment would still be useful in the early 70's.
Here is a google map of the remaining trackage. CSX only runs north/south and switches a grain elevator that uses the former B&O as a spur. Since some of those tracks are still in use, I would think the interchange was quite active in the day.
http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&rlz=&q=305+north+indiana+street+roachdale+indiana&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x886cd15fe6ab9533:0x71bbc812bb634d51,305+N+Indiana+St,+Roachdale,+IN+46172&gl=us&ei=8ucUT5vNGsPcggee_LWgCg&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=title&resnum=1&ved=0CCAQ8gEwAA
A previous post mentioned Montezuma Indiana
I would assume that any interchanging would have been through Cincinnati Union Terminal (passenger transfer) and Queensgate Yard (frieght). Everything from the north, south, east and west could funnel through that area. The terminal served seven railroads, Baltimore and Ohio Railroad; Chesapeake and Ohio Railroad; New York Central Railroad (Cleveland, Cincinnati, Chicago and St. Louis Railway); Loiusville and Nashville Railroad; Norfolk and Western Railway; Pennsylvania Railroad; and Southern Railway. There were smaller yards to the north, south, east and west where frieght could be sorted, etc. and continue on it's destination by another railroad.
Reprints of the 1943 and 1953 ORER are available from the NMRA. through their online store http://nmra.org/nmrastore/supplies/Store_Index.html to both members and non-members (slightly higher price).
Enjoy
Paul
The B&O operated until 1987.
The Monon merged into L&N in 1971, and part of the C&EI was merged into L&N in 1976.
Therefore, the junctions between B&O and Monon plus parts of C&EI would have become B&O junctions with L&N.
However, L&N became part of the SCL/L&N (Family Lines) in 1982.
Note: Dates are from Wikipedia.
GARRY
HEARTLAND DIVISION, CB&Q RR
EVERYWHERE LOST; WE HUSTLE OUR CABOOSE FOR YOU
Cuyama,
Yeah, I understand that I would not find pictures in the ORER. I am just looking for various resources for information, and that looks to be a great one. I would just want some pictures as a frame of reference for something to model, be it a replica or just an idea of what it would look like. Again, thanks for your input.
bogp40 maxman: bogp40: L&N, Seaboard and Family Lines (C&O) combined w/ B&O into Chessie System. Earlier interchange w/ C&O I believe, but not B&O. Could be mistaken though. It is my understanding that L&N, Seaboard (and others) were combined into the Seaboard System. B&O/C&O/WM were combined into the Chessie System. Then Seaboard System and Chessie System were combined into CSX. Of coarse and that is what I said but maybe misinterpreted using (C&O) for the combination. and then merging w/ the B&O (WM also) into the Chessie.
maxman: bogp40: L&N, Seaboard and Family Lines (C&O) combined w/ B&O into Chessie System. Earlier interchange w/ C&O I believe, but not B&O. Could be mistaken though. It is my understanding that L&N, Seaboard (and others) were combined into the Seaboard System. B&O/C&O/WM were combined into the Chessie System. Then Seaboard System and Chessie System were combined into CSX.
bogp40: L&N, Seaboard and Family Lines (C&O) combined w/ B&O into Chessie System. Earlier interchange w/ C&O I believe, but not B&O. Could be mistaken though.
L&N, Seaboard and Family Lines (C&O) combined w/ B&O into Chessie System. Earlier interchange w/ C&O I believe, but not B&O. Could be mistaken though.
It is my understanding that L&N, Seaboard (and others) were combined into the Seaboard System. B&O/C&O/WM were combined into the Chessie System. Then Seaboard System and Chessie System were combined into CSX.
Of coarse and that is what I said but maybe misinterpreted using (C&O) for the combination. and then merging w/ the B&O (WM also) into the Chessie.
One more time.
The C&O,B&O,WM was not merged repeat was not merged under Chessie!!! The Chessie System was the parent company of the three roads that made up Chessie..
The mergers took place under CSX with the C&O being the last "Chessie Road" merged into CSX.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
maxman bogp40: L&N, Seaboard and Family Lines (C&O) combined w/ B&O into Chessie System. Earlier interchange w/ C&O I believe, but not B&O. Could be mistaken though. It is my understanding that L&N, Seaboard (and others) were combined into the Seaboard System. B&O/C&O/WM were combined into the Chessie System. Then Seaboard System and Chessie System were combined into CSX.
Modeling B&O- Chessie Bob K. www.ssmrc.org
bogp40 L&N, Seaboard and Family Lines (C&O) combined w/ B&O into Chessie System. Earlier interchange w/ C&O I believe, but not B&O. Could be mistaken though.
First all three Chessie roads(C&O,B&O WM) was not merged and maintain their connections-cars bound for the B&O from the L&N would read L&N Chessie*(B&O Cin).This tells the L&N routing clerk to route the car toward the B&O at Cincy-this would be part of the direct route from shipper to end reciever.
*I have seen waybills that the routing read(say)SCL/C&O(Rich) without Chessie before C&O.
The January 1965 ORER lists the following Freight Conctions and Junctions
Cincinnati, OHEast St. Louis, ILEnfield, ILJunction, ILLouisville, KY
Check out Google maps anf Bing maps for the areas. It is possible some of them have not changed much since the 60's. Also you might be able to find historic USGS topo maps, other maps. or even photos on the Net.
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
rrlcommish Preparing to build my new layout and I have much rolling stock and locos for both railroads so I figured I would build a railroad where both lines are represented. Having trouble finding pictures of interchanges between these railroads. It appears that they might have interchanged in Cincinnati, but I am not sure. Coincidentally, I live in Cincinnati so if any of that trackage still exists I could get a first hand look if I knew where it is (if it still exists in some form). I would assume it's all CSX track now since both lines ultimately became part of CSX. Anyone have any information on this or know of any good books or online resources I could check out? Thanks!
Preparing to build my new layout and I have much rolling stock and locos for both railroads so I figured I would build a railroad where both lines are represented. Having trouble finding pictures of interchanges between these railroads. It appears that they might have interchanged in Cincinnati, but I am not sure. Coincidentally, I live in Cincinnati so if any of that trackage still exists I could get a first hand look if I knew where it is (if it still exists in some form). I would assume it's all CSX track now since both lines ultimately became part of CSX. Anyone have any information on this or know of any good books or online resources I could check out? Thanks!
There is a small, real small, interchange yard in the Hillsdale/Highland/Alta in southern Vermillion County, Indiana. Combined population of these towns maybe 250. The east-west line was B&O, which used to go to Indianapolis but stops in Montezuma now, and the north south line was L&N after it took over that part of the C&EI.And believe me, this is rural.
Brad Spear
Burnsville, MN
I thought SAL and ACL merged to become SCL, who held the L&N and others as subsidiaries. In turn, they were the Family Lines System. Then the Family Lines were temporarily merged together into SBD as a preparatory measure before Chessie absorbed tem.
ORERs have no detailed maps of the interchanges, which seems to be what you are seeking. Just the list of locations, as I posted before.
An ORER is a great resource for other things but just want to be sure you know what you are getting.
You may not find any photos of the specific interchanges anywhere (and certainly not in an ORER, which was a working railroad document). Not sure why you would need photos. Typically an interchange is just a track with freight cars on it.
Layout Design GalleryLayout Design Special Interest Group
Ccentral Cincinnati, as in an urban area. I just meant to say that if the interchange was somewhere in an urban setting (like Queensgate yard, which is where CSXs main yard is in Cincy), I would prefer to model more rural areas.
Great links to those ORERs on eBay, I will see if I can get one!
rrlcommish I would like to model more rural areas, so central Cincinnati is probably not good. Some rural areas of Kentucky, Indiana or Illinois would be fantastic.
I would like to model more rural areas, so central Cincinnati is probably not good. Some rural areas of Kentucky, Indiana or Illinois would be fantastic.
Central Cincinnati?
You can find ORERs at train shows, on ebay, and other places. Here are a couple on ebay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/BOOK-OFFICIAL-RAILWAY-EQUIPMENT-REGISTER-JULY-1953-/320816621862?_trksid=p4340.m185&_trkparms=algo%3DSIC.NPJS%26its%3DI%252BC%26itu%3DUA%26otn%3D5%26pmod%3D320683056830%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D5568486808517847485
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Official-Railway-Equipment-Register-October-1949-Original-Railroad-Book-/320826544435?_trksid=p4340.m185&_trkparms=algo%3DSIC.NPJS%26its%3DI%252BC%26itu%3DUA%26otn%3D5%26pmod%3D320683056830%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D5568516450503147185
Scroll to the bottom of this link and you'll see a copy of the 1965 edition that someone bought: http://www.ebay.com/itm/APRIL-1965-OFFICIAL-RAILWAY-EQUIPMENT-REGISTER-/320683056830
Okay I looked in my earlier ORER which is dated April 1986. It appears at that time that the L&N reporting marks belonged to the Seaboard System Railroad. The freight connection and junction point section for Seaboard shows a connection to the B&O in Cincinnati. Unfortunately it does not get specific for a location.
As noted, this is wholly dependent on era and area.
I happen to have a 1953 ORER at hand for a project. In that year, those two railroads interchanged in:Cincinnati, OHEast St. Louis, ILEnfield, ILJunction, ILLouisville, KYShawneetown, IL
About what year are you interested in? The ORER (Official Railway Equipment Register), which is basically a railroad car phone book of railroads and the cars they own, has a section called freight connections and junction points for each listed railroas. You can see a sample of this if you scroll to the bottom of this old copy: http://www.jon-n-bevliles.net/RAILROAD/ORER/dlw-orer-1899.pdf. These are published periodically, and probably at least once per year if not more frequently.
I have an ORER for (I think) 1985 and one for around 1988 or so. I'm not familiar with the dates that B&O/C&O became Chessie System, and when everything got blended into CSX. But if the above dates are about the time frame you need, I'll be glad to look up the info in the morning. Let me know.
If you need info for dates prior to 1985, I'm sure some of the forum members have earlier issues of the ORER in their libraries.
Regards