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Tank car positioning within freight trains

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Posted by dehusman on Thursday, December 20, 2007 12:57 PM

The numbers on the top are fairly new and assist the loading/unloading crews in identifying the cars from a loading rack.

Dave H.

Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com

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Posted by tcwright973 on Thursday, December 20, 2007 12:43 PM

Nick,

Glad you answered that inquiry, because I didn't really know the answer myself. I too just made the assumption that the last boxcar was to protect the crew of a following train. Speaking of those pictures I posted. on that particular train, most of the tank cars had the car owner's symbols and car numbers painted on the top as well as on the sides. In fairly large letters too, as I recall. Yet I have never seen this on model. Is it something new, or just something I saw for the first time as I was on a bridge?

By the way, good luck on your bid for a new position.

Tom

Tom

Pittsburgh, PA

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Posted by nbrodar on Thursday, December 20, 2007 9:37 AM

There are no specific requirements for buffers at the rear unless you have a manned caboose or helper.  The rear buffer car also makes it quicker and easier to "turn" the train at each loading and unloading point.

Nick

Take a Ride on the Reading with the: Reading Company Technical & Historical Society http://www.readingrailroad.org/

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Posted by R. T. POTEET on Thursday, December 20, 2007 9:14 AM

tcwright973, your photo's of the NS freight in Pittsburgh were illuminating but they do raise a question; I may have missed it in passing but it appears as if the placement of an idler car(s) on the rear of the chemical unit consist is to provide crew protection for any following train in the chance of a rear-end collision.

From the far, far reaches of the wild, wild west I am: rtpoteet

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Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, December 18, 2007 8:38 PM
What would have been the rules governing these cars back in the 50's through the 70's?  I remember seeing some trains back then that had no buffer cars.
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Posted by desertdog on Wednesday, December 12, 2007 11:29 AM

If you can find an employee timetable or rule book, there will be specifics as to where hazmat can be positioned within a train.  You may also see references to loaded cars (of any type) versus empties, short cars next to long cars, MOW equipment, scale cars, dead-in-transit locomotives, etc.

 

John Timm

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Posted by dknelson on Monday, December 10, 2007 8:39 AM

At the monthly meet for our NMRA Division yesterday here in Milwaukee, FRA inspector Dave Sima gave photographic examples of rule violations he has found.  He made an interesting point -- that shifted or shiftable loads don't include just the obvious ones like steel beams, pipe, or utility poles, but also a flat with Caterpillar loads, flats with wrecked cars or locomotives on them, and especially, a gondola filled with old railroad wheels.  He said that sudden starts and stops can send the wheels flying if they are loaded too high. 

Some of his photos were chilling showing shifted loads (broken chains, et) next to cars marked acid or propane -- with springs depressed showing they were loaded. 

Oddly, a cateripillar load with tires on it is regarded as a vehicle and can be next to a tank car, but take the tires off and it cannot. 

Dave Nelson

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Posted by tcwright973 on Tuesday, December 4, 2007 8:48 AM

Here is an example with two photos taken on Norfolk Southern's main on Pittsburgh's North Side this past August. It had one boxcar behind the engine, and one at the end.

Tom

 

Tom

Pittsburgh, PA

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Posted by Walter Clot on Tuesday, December 4, 2007 12:16 AM

Bow [bow]I give my thanks too!  I've been meaning to ask the question.

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Posted by dehusman on Monday, December 3, 2007 3:12 PM

Hazmat rules are set by the Federal Gov't. so they are the same for all railroads.

The rules comprise a small multi-page pamphlet so these will be suggestions and not comprehensive.

Loaded tank cars of hazmat, loaded cars of explosives (any type car), loaded cars of radioactive (any type)  must not be closer than the 6th car from an engine or caboose, train length permitting.  Under no circumstances can they be closer than the 2nd car from an engine or caboose.

Empty tank cars of hazmat and loaded cars of hazmat other than tank cars (other than the above) must not be closer than the 2nd car from an engine or caboose.

Cars of combustible (diesel fuel, lube oil) are not considered hazmat and can be anywhere.

A loaded car of hazmat can't be next to a running mechanical reefer or a shiftable load.  Loaded cars of radioactive, poison gas (TIH/PIH) or explosives can't be next to other hazmat cars (other than the same type).

A train has to provide the proper cover and will have to switch cars out of its train to make cover.  If you only have 9 cover cars available in your train, you have to use 4 on one end and 5 on the other.  The ethanol trains only have one car of cover because, being a unit train they don't have ANY cover in their train but the railroad has to provide at least 1 car to meet the requirements.

Dave H.

 

Dave H. Painted side goes up. My website : wnbranch.com

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Posted by shawnee on Monday, December 3, 2007 1:05 PM
Thanks guys, will help me to properly assemble my trains.  Wink [;)]
Shawnee
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Posted by nbrodar on Monday, December 3, 2007 12:58 PM

The Eastern HAZMAT Code, requires 5 buffer cars between the locomotive/occupied caboose/passenger or business car, and most loaded HAZMAT tank cars.  In the event 5 cars are not available, all available, but not less then one, buffer cars are required.

Empty HAZMAT tanks require 1 buffer car.

Additionally, loaded HAZMATs may not be placed next to cars with shiftable loads, cars with running mechanical refrigeration equipment, or cars from a different placard group.

Nick

Take a Ride on the Reading with the: Reading Company Technical & Historical Society http://www.readingrailroad.org/

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Posted by tomnoy3 on Monday, December 3, 2007 12:15 PM

I know for ethanol units one buffer car is required inbetween the power and first tank and another at the end of the train.  The railroad provided them, as in we didnt need to order the car, so it would be a different car type almost every time.  Whatever the railroad had on hand.  We shipped out unit trains using 50' box cars, bulkhead flatcars, gondolas, airslides, covered hoppers, etc as buffers.

-Tom

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  • From: Piedmont, VA USA
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Tank car positioning within freight trains
Posted by shawnee on Monday, December 3, 2007 12:00 PM

I remember reading that there is a special protocol for hazmat and/or empty tank cars within freight trains...that they have to be towards the end, away from the engine, or have an empty car in between them and  the engine for safety purposes...

Does anyone know about this, or the rules by which how freights trains that include chemical tank cars get composed?

Many thanks...

Shawnee

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