Newbie; Solder or not? Help

[Anonymous]

Well, this is my first layout in 30 years, and the first one wasn't that successful. I'd like to have more fun this time!

I have done the benchwork and layed the track about 2 months ago on a 4x8, and now I am wondering about whether I would be better off to solder the rail joints or wire each rail section. I origionally assumed that the rail joiners would be sufficient for regular operations.

From what I've read, soldering was glossed over a bit, but I assumed it was for the more ambitious and, well, picky (there's another word for it, but it probably wouldn't get by the filters).

So what is the hazard of NOT soldering or wiring each section?

Larry W.

[Anonymous]

Well, this is my first layout in 30 years, and the first one wasn't that successful. I'd like to have more fun this time!

I have done the benchwork and layed the track about 2 months ago on a 4x8, and now I am wondering about whether I would be better off to solder the rail joints or wire each rail section. I origionally assumed that the rail joiners would be sufficient for regular operations.

From what I've read, soldering was glossed over a bit, but I assumed it was for the more ambitious and, well, picky (there's another word for it, but it probably wouldn't get by the filters).

So what is the hazard of NOT soldering or wiring each section?

Larry W.

[Anonymous]

I believe that many modelers prefer to solder because the reliability of each connection is much greater over time. There is no risk of two soldered sections of track becoming seperated and therefore your modeling enjoyment is increased. Another reason, I think, is that it increases the reliability of the electrical current flow. I wouldn't suggest wiring each rail section as this would be much more difficult and time consuming than soldering. Additionally, with the increase in wiring and connections there would be an increase in the possibility of something going wrong in the current flow to the layout. If you are using a DCC system to power your layout, many people suggest placing bus lines to the track from the main current flow wires every four or more feet.

[Anonymous]

I believe that many modelers prefer to solder because the reliability of each connection is much greater over time. There is no risk of two soldered sections of track becoming seperated and therefore your modeling enjoyment is increased. Another reason, I think, is that it increases the reliability of the electrical current flow. I wouldn't suggest wiring each rail section as this would be much more difficult and time consuming than soldering. Additionally, with the increase in wiring and connections there would be an increase in the possibility of something going wrong in the current flow to the layout. If you are using a DCC system to power your layout, many people suggest placing bus lines to the track from the main current flow wires every four or more feet.

[Anonymous]

I'm assuming your soldering skills are zero or border line zero and hence your reluctance to solder. Don't be upset at this comment, until recently soldering was something else other people did. Now that I have installed one third of my layout track (about 110 feet) I am now good at soldering. After about your sixth solder attempt, and having melted 4 rail road ties, you get good at it quickly.

Here is the quick and dirty way to do it. First forget everything you have read about a clean iron and filed before you start - not necessary. The secret of good soldering isn't the solder but the flux. I solder in N scale which is even more challenging than HO. I have decided that real men solder in N...lol.

Okay. Tin your wire, which means add flux to it (I use liquid Rosen flux), put the wire end on the solder, heat the wire end, not the solder. The solder will flow into the wire (I use stranded wire). Next, some will say to tin the rail, don't do this - you could end up with a mess and it isn't necessary.

Now paint the rail on the outside with your liquid flux, tip the tinned tip into the liquid flux (prior to all of this bend the tinned wire tip so there is a 90 degree bend). Now this next part sounds hard but is easy. Put the wire where you painted the rail with flux. Puth the tip of the iron on top of rail, directly over the tinned wire touching the rail and flux. Now bend the iron down so that it touches the tinned wire. The solder will flow from the tinned wire into the rail, remove iron as soon as solder has melted, hold wire for about 5 seconds. And you are done.

More feeders is better than one set of feeders. If it were me on a 4 by 8, I would have at least 6 to 8 feeders; too many is better than not enough.

[Anonymous]

I'm assuming your soldering skills are zero or border line zero and hence your reluctance to solder. Don't be upset at this comment, until recently soldering was something else other people did. Now that I have installed one third of my layout track (about 110 feet) I am now good at soldering. After about your sixth solder attempt, and having melted 4 rail road ties, you get good at it quickly.

Here is the quick and dirty way to do it. First forget everything you have read about a clean iron and filed before you start - not necessary. The secret of good soldering isn't the solder but the flux. I solder in N scale which is even more challenging than HO. I have decided that real men solder in N...lol.

Okay. Tin your wire, which means add flux to it (I use liquid Rosen flux), put the wire end on the solder, heat the wire end, not the solder. The solder will flow into the wire (I use stranded wire). Next, some will say to tin the rail, don't do this - you could end up with a mess and it isn't necessary.

Now paint the rail on the outside with your liquid flux, tip the tinned tip into the liquid flux (prior to all of this bend the tinned wire tip so there is a 90 degree bend). Now this next part sounds hard but is easy. Put the wire where you painted the rail with flux. Puth the tip of the iron on top of rail, directly over the tinned wire touching the rail and flux. Now bend the iron down so that it touches the tinned wire. The solder will flow from the tinned wire into the rail, remove iron as soon as solder has melted, hold wire for about 5 seconds. And you are done.

More feeders is better than one set of feeders. If it were me on a 4 by 8, I would have at least 6 to 8 feeders; too many is better than not enough.

[Anonymous]

I also solder the rail joiners in much the same way as above. Solder them on the outside of the rail with lots of flux. I like the paste kind though. Solder before balasting as the glue gums up the works and makes it much harder to get a good joint. If you solder you will never get dead tracks as the joiners WILL work loose over time from train stress and warming/cooling cycles. This was even a problem on the real rails with bolted joints and was one reason the protos went to welded rail. One last note, and an import. one, use rosin core small diameter electronics solder... not pipe solder.

[Anonymous]

I also solder the rail joiners in much the same way as above. Solder them on the outside of the rail with lots of flux. I like the paste kind though. Solder before balasting as the glue gums up the works and makes it much harder to get a good joint. If you solder you will never get dead tracks as the joiners WILL work loose over time from train stress and warming/cooling cycles. This was even a problem on the real rails with bolted joints and was one reason the protos went to welded rail. One last note, and an import. one, use rosin core small diameter electronics solder... not pipe solder.

[Anonymous]

Solder joints especially on flex track curves with the track straight while soldering to avoid rail kinks at the joints when curved. But also leave some small unsoldered gaps in the joins for thermal expansion without buckling, using additional feeders as pointed out before.

[Anonymous]

Solder joints especially on flex track curves with the track straight while soldering to avoid rail kinks at the joints when curved. But also leave some small unsoldered gaps in the joins for thermal expansion without buckling, using additional feeders as pointed out before.

[Anonymous]

I also recomend using a 30 watt or so iron. All's I ever did with a big gun type was melt ties.

[Anonymous]

I also recomend using a 30 watt or so iron. All's I ever did with a big gun type was melt ties.

[emdgp92]

If you use a big gun, use a heatsink--a pair of Vise Grip pliers clamped to the rail, or bits of wet paper towel work well.

[emdgp92]

If you use a big gun, use a heatsink--a pair of Vise Grip pliers clamped to the rail, or bits of wet paper towel work well.

[Anonymous]

Hey, thanks for the answers, folks! Sounds like I will be happier in the long run if I don't count on mechanical joiners. Time to get a solder gun!

Actually I am not that uncomfortable with soldering, but I was just ready to move on to scenery. Don't need to make any shortcuts at this point, or I'll be frustrated in the end.

Larry

[Anonymous]

Hey, thanks for the answers, folks! Sounds like I will be happier in the long run if I don't count on mechanical joiners. Time to get a solder gun!

Actually I am not that uncomfortable with soldering, but I was just ready to move on to scenery. Don't need to make any shortcuts at this point, or I'll be frustrated in the end.

Larry

[trollw]

I am an electrical engineer by trade (design radar systems). PLEASE, don't get a soldering gun - get a nice 35W soldering iron (looks like an old wood burning iron). It will do a much better job.

[trollw]

I am an electrical engineer by trade (design radar systems). PLEASE, don't get a soldering gun - get a nice 35W soldering iron (looks like an old wood burning iron). It will do a much better job.

[der5997]

Picked up a 20 Watt iron at the local $ store ($1.99 Cdn) Works very well for soldering track joins etc. Bigger isn't better in this case. Will it last as long as "brand name" irons? Who cares at these prices[:)].

[der5997]

Picked up a 20 Watt iron at the local $ store ($1.99 Cdn) Works very well for soldering track joins etc. Bigger isn't better in this case. Will it last as long as "brand name" irons? Who cares at these prices[:)].

[Kent]

QUOTE: Originally posted by der5997

Picked up a 20 Watt iron at the local $ store ($1.99 Cdn) Works very well for soldering track joins etc. Bigger isn't better in this case. Will it last as long as "brand name" irons? Who cares at these prices[:)].

For that price I won't expect a long life from it. I use Weller solder iron and gun, they're both probably 15 to 20 years old and still work great. Sometimes I have the iron on for hours at a time.

The iron needs a new tip right now, but I plan to pick on up in the next day or so.

[Kent]

QUOTE: Originally posted by der5997

Picked up a 20 Watt iron at the local $ store ($1.99 Cdn) Works very well for soldering track joins etc. Bigger isn't better in this case. Will it last as long as "brand name" irons? Who cares at these prices[:)].

For that price I won't expect a long life from it. I use Weller solder iron and gun, they're both probably 15 to 20 years old and still work great. Sometimes I have the iron on for hours at a time.

The iron needs a new tip right now, but I plan to pick on up in the next day or so.

[IRONROOSTER]

Lots of different ways to paradise here, personally I use a gun with heat sinks - pliers laid across the rails close to the joint. Get in fast and get out. I have an iron but never could get good results from it. One thing not mentioned above, I clean the rail ends with a wire brush chucked into dremel moto tool.
Enjoy
Paul

[IRONROOSTER]

Lots of different ways to paradise here, personally I use a gun with heat sinks - pliers laid across the rails close to the joint. Get in fast and get out. I have an iron but never could get good results from it. One thing not mentioned above, I clean the rail ends with a wire brush chucked into dremel moto tool.
Enjoy
Paul

[cacole]

One thing that should never be soldered is a turnout. If anything on the layout is going to go bad, it will be a turnout, and it will be much easier to replace if it is not soldered in place. When I wired the Cochise & Western Model Railroad Club's 20 x 40 foot HO-scale layout, I soldered a power feed wire every 3 feet at the flex track joint to insure that we had no electrical problems; however, every other track joiner was left unsoldered for expansion or contraction, and the feeder wire was soldered a little further in from the rail joiner. Another thing that I try to never solder to is a crossover. In other words, only where two pieces of flex track join gets soldered.

[cacole]

One thing that should never be soldered is a turnout. If anything on the layout is going to go bad, it will be a turnout, and it will be much easier to replace if it is not soldered in place. When I wired the Cochise & Western Model Railroad Club's 20 x 40 foot HO-scale layout, I soldered a power feed wire every 3 feet at the flex track joint to insure that we had no electrical problems; however, every other track joiner was left unsoldered for expansion or contraction, and the feeder wire was soldered a little further in from the rail joiner. Another thing that I try to never solder to is a crossover. In other words, only where two pieces of flex track join gets soldered.

[Anonymous]

I have to agree with rsn48, real men solder in n scale...lol. I have just started soldering all the rails on my n scale layout & after 3 or 4 melted ties I realized it isn't as difficult as it sounds.

[Anonymous]

I have to agree with rsn48, real men solder in n scale...lol. I have just started soldering all the rails on my n scale layout & after 3 or 4 melted ties I realized it isn't as difficult as it sounds.

[Anonymous]

Soldering is the answer. Flex track is best worked when joined 2 0r 3 sections together prior to laling the track. When used joined sections together on curves the track are best cut with a rotary tool cut off disk to get even lengths. It makes a clean cut that rail joiners slip over. One "oh by the way" is is best to leave a few joints with rail joiners NOT soldered in place to allow for expansion and contraction. Just make sure you run power feeders toboth side of the unsoldered joint and there will be no problems.
The key to good soldering is using flux "paste or liquid" otherwise the soler will ball it. It is amazing how well solder will flow with flus pre-applied.

[Anonymous]

Soldering is the answer. Flex track is best worked when joined 2 0r 3 sections together prior to laling the track. When used joined sections together on curves the track are best cut with a rotary tool cut off disk to get even lengths. It makes a clean cut that rail joiners slip over. One "oh by the way" is is best to leave a few joints with rail joiners NOT soldered in place to allow for expansion and contraction. Just make sure you run power feeders toboth side of the unsoldered joint and there will be no problems.
The key to good soldering is using flux "paste or liquid" otherwise the soler will ball it. It is amazing how well solder will flow with flus pre-applied.