DCC engine on a DC layout?

[Anonymous]

I found a lot of posts about running DC engines on a DCC layout but what about the opposite? Can a decoder-equipped engine be run on a DC layout safely without damaging the engine? Will there be a drop in performance?
I ask this because I bought two Atlas engines recently, a B-36 and A DASH-8, and the non-decoder engine moves faster at the same power setting as the decoder equipped engine, even when the non-decoder engine is pulling 25 cars! Both have the "scale speed" engines. (Both were on sale and I didn't notice the other one had a decoder!)

[selector]

Maybe.

Most of the earlier, now less expensive decoders, such as the DSD 100LC by Sountraxx, is NOT able to be run on DC.

Most of the newer sound and loco managing decoders DO run on DC, but you won't be able to get all of the sound features, nor will you be able to configure CVs that alter the acceleration, deceleration, V-min for start, V-max, and so on.

If your decodered engine runs on your DC layout, you must be okay. As Randy Rinker would say, otherwise the magic smoke will waft up and out of your decoder in jig time, and you have a replacement to consider.

The reason that the decodered engine moves more slowly is that its voltage usage setting is set, currently, to use less voltage that does your DC engine at the same throttle setting.

[Anonymous]

"The reason that the decodered engine moves more slowly is that its voltage usage setting is set, currently, to use less voltage that does your DC engine at the same throttle setting."

Is this a setting that is governed by the decoder or by the engine itself? If it is by the decoder, can the decoder be (easily) disabled to allow it to run at a higher speed as a DC engine only? ( I know next to nothing about electronics at the moment). The decoder is a Lenz LEO63XF if this helps at all.

[selector]

Yes, the setting has been input by the factory, and it can be changed to suit your purposes, but not without a DCC control system that can alter the CV. If you want the decoder to run at a speed more closely matching your other loco(s), you must alter the voltage usage setting in the decoder. You must have a DCC controller for that...like a Digitrax Zephyr, or a MRC Prodigy Advanced.

The decoder, and only the decoder, is in complete control of the motor. When you increase the speed on your throttle, the decoder must agree, and then it tells the loco what to do. It is an intermediary, if you wish, between you and the loco's motor.

You can disable the decoder, but wouldn't that defeat the purpose of having a decoder in the first place? If you want to disable the decoder, you must remove it and rewire the loco so that it will respond to DC control. Are you sure this is what you want to do?

[Anonymous]

I don't really want to disable the decoder as I plan to upgrade to DCC eventually, I was just hoping for a quick disconnection of the decoder with the option of putting it back in, but I guess this isn't the case. (I didn't mean to get the engine with the decoder, I found out afterwards, but I didn't want to return it because the engine is out of production (BC Rail!)
When you say I could alter the speed with a DCC controller, I guess that means only on a DCC powered layout, and not somehow altering the decoder with a DCC system and then being able to run it on a DC system at a faster speed (like a "switch" could be electronically altered by the DCC controller?)

By the way Selector, thanks for the help!

[Anonymous]

Hi,

I guess you could put a little DPDT switch in there:

a - common - goes to the motor
b - One terminal goes to red & black
c - 2nd terminal goes to yellow and grey (from memory)

Switch one way - Direct DC, the other, DCC control.....

Having said that, Selectors comments bear careful reading - I *think* he's saying (and I *think* I agree with him btw), that if you have access to a programming track (and a controller of course) you can reset the speed table in the decoder, and the loco will then run at those speeds on a DC layout - It will also run at higher speeds on a DCC layout, but it sounds like you want to deal with that later,,,,

HTH,
Ian

[Anonymous]

Thanks to you both, now I'll go to my LHS to see if they have a track set up to try this out!