What layout software?

[Anonymous]

I have built two small layouts (2 x 4 and 2.5 x 7 ft) in N scale and I am now ready to embark on something a little more adventurous. Both of the earlier layouts were design "on the fly" in my head. But thhis time I want to prepare a properly documented plan because I wont be the only one working on it. Both my wife and daughter are quite keen!

What layout software have you had success with?

Why did you choose it?

And what do you really like / dislike about it?

And the first person who suggests AutoCad gets the booby-prozie as we are a SolidWorks office here!

John
(Toronto)

[SpaceMouse]

XtraCAD is a free open source program that is quite robust and intuitive.

I like 3rd planit because of 3d rendering, but it is not as intuitive and I don't recommend it to anyone because the paswords that people are getting whne they buy the program are not working and there is no way to contact the company.

I don't recommend the Atlas RR. It is quirky and you are limited to altas products. I have no expreience with CADrail.

[Anonymous]

Another vote for XtraCAD. The tutorial/demo is really helpful. The only negative for me has been the lack of a 3-D view. That means you have to be careful about vertical clearances, it won't find the problems for you. But it isn't hard to use, will generate easements, has a substantial library, will allow creation of custom/new items and it's free.

[fwright]

I have downloaded XtraCAD, but have not used it yet (another interest of mine is computer geek stuff). I still lean to graph paper, compass, and pencil for my small layouts. Also, laying some critical pieces of sectional track out full-size on a table works well.

I have used the Atlas product. It is frustrating at times, but gives a good sanity check on my attempts to cram too much into a given space. By being limited to Atlas products and their limited geometries, I know that if it will fit with the Atlas software, it will fit with my handlaid track. I generally don't bother filling in the flex sections between the critical areas (crossings, turnouts, minimum radius curves, and their inter-connections) in the software - the software plan is just a sanity check, not a time waster. The other tip would be to use whatever structures that are in the library in the plan. Again, the purpose is to avoid overcrowding.

My 2 cents
Fred Wright

[jdtractorboy]

Where did you get the XtraCAD software?

Chuck

[claycts]

Sorry guys, 3rd Planet, interface with AutoCadd and Turbo Cad. Good 3d and chance to run the layout in 3d.

[Anonymous]

XtrkCAD at:
http://www.sillub.com/

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by claycts

Sorry guys, 3rd Planet, interface with AutoCadd and Turbo Cad. Good 3d and chance to run the layout in 3d.

Interesting George, the interface to AutoCad or TurboCad does nothing for me, as I mentioned we use SolidWorks for all our 3D. Mainly so it can go direct to machine shops or toolmakers.

But I suppose I could be convinced if the software is good enough! I will go and take a look at 3rd Planit.

John

[SpaceMouse]

QUOTE: Originally posted by jdtoronto

QUOTE: Originally posted by claycts

Sorry guys, 3rd Planet, interface with AutoCadd and Turbo Cad. Good 3d and chance to run the layout in 3d.

Interesting George, the interface to AutoCad or TurboCad does nothing for me, as I mentioned we use SolidWorks for all our 3D. Mainly so it can go direct to machine shops or toolmakers.

But I suppose I could be convinced if the software is good enough! I will go and take a look at 3rd Planit.

John

Before you do, take a look at the 3rd Planit User Group on Yahho. All they have been talking about is that the passwords that they are getting don't work and they have paid for something that won't function. This is a one man show and he is incommunicato.

Buyer Beware.

[claycts]

If, 3rd planet, is playing take the money and run, I am sure there are folks who HAVE the keys to help those people unlock what they paid for. I got mine when it was supported by them. thaink I will drop in on that group.

EDIT:
I visited that group, they are talking about someone doing what I said. Guess the programmer has lost interest.
2nd choice is ? I am using AutoCadd 2000 .

[jxtrrx]

I also have have had very good luck with XtrkCad. Be sure to get the user code available free on the web site to unlock all features.

[Anonymous]

The ones I've tried are:
The one from Atlas.
XTrkCAD from Sillub Tech.

Altas' offering leans towards Atlas products (of course) and I find the interface to be frustrating at times. But I don't think there is a very high learning curve and it is free.

XTrkCad - I have found to be a little more flexible - It's open source, has quite a few libraries (you can also create and submit your own). Quite a few for NSale. And the look and feel is more like a CAD program. Plus You can't beat the price!

I'm currently building a little C55 test track (With more to come later). I've been playing with both of these packages and Atlas' freeware is about to lose out to XTrkCAD on my machine. Put in the track plan for my last pike into both and XTrkCAD was a clear winner. IMHO.

[hminky]

If you use Solidworks there should be a 2d drawing package. Get Atlas RTS and dxf them out of that software and into the solidworks and draw in 2d. I have done that with ProE. Real CAD software works better than the model railroad software.

Just a thought
Harold

[Anonymous]

So far XtrkCad seems to be the stand out winner, with a little side run from 3rd Planit.

Looking at the magazines there is also CadRail and something called RRTrack (I think) does any body use those?

[willpick]

I've used RR track to design several layouts, both in O and N scale. It's a pricey program, but it is a very good one. It has 3D rendering, you can add scenery, etc. I've used most of the programs that are out there, IMHO RRtrack is the best.
HTH

[orsonroy]

I still prefer pencil & paper. It's cheap, effective, and doesn't need to be plugged in!

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by orsonroy

I still prefer pencil & paper. It's cheap, effective, and doesn't need to be plugged in!

You must sell erasers! I'd be broke from buying them if I went this way!

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by baldwinjl

QUOTE: Originally posted by orsonroy

I still prefer pencil & paper. It's cheap, effective, and doesn't need to be plugged in!

You must sell erasers! I'd be broke from buying them if I went this way!

Well, despite the fact that I basically live at my computer, I still have a pad or book of 5mm graph paper (5 to the inch for you gosh darn 'mericans) in front of me all day, and I still keep my lab and/or bench notes in a hand written notebook, usually in pencil following the habits of over 30 years.

Even when I am using the very latest in 3D or solid modelling programmes, or some truly monumental simulation or modelling package I will often work things out on paper more so than on screen.

One thing that really ticks me off these days is that it is rather hard to get notebooks with old fashioned ruling any more. For many years I used an imperial size which is about 12 3/4 x 8 inches, faint blue ruled on watermarked wove paper. Ideal for handwriting. Sadly I cant buy them anywhere any more, but at least in Canada I can get nicely bound A4 size notebooks instead of those strange little 8 1/2 x 11 things I had to put up with living in the US! (Sorry folks!)

And on the subject of erasers, doesn't anybody sell gum erasers (the crumbly pale browbn ones) these days? I haven't seen anythingother than vinyl in recent years. Or do I need to look in the UK next time I am there?

John

[Anonymous]

I have to admit you are right. A little sketch to get a feel for an idea is easier on paper. But to get accurate dimensions, and a useable drawing that anyone else can look at, I have to resort to the computer!

[bn7026]

I use a program called Drafix Cad - no longer made as the company got bought out by Auto%$^& who promptly culled it's best features and released it a Autosketch.
Mainly because I work in the building industry and i'm familiar with the package.
What generally happens with any CAD package is that you get used to it's features (and bugs) and to swap and change to another involves a learning curve.
I tried XTrkCad but I find it easier to work with a general CAD package I know rather than learn a rail specific one....
Mind you I could always develop turnout libraries etc for use with Drafix - shouldn't be too hard.....

Tim

[tstage]

QUOTE: Originally posted by hminky

If you use Solidworks there should be a 2d drawing package. Get Atlas RTS and dxf them out of that software and into the solidworks and draw in 2d. I have done that with ProE. Real CAD software works better than the model railroad software.

Just a thought
Harold

Harold,

I'm going to have to try try that. I agree with you. I've used SolidWorks to sketch my brainstorms.


John,

I've also used the Atlas RTS software. They just upgraded it from 5.0 to 7.0. It still has it's quirks but Atlas has made some improvements in the design. Still worth a look see since it's FREE! [:)]

Tom

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by timbowa

I use a program called Drafix Cad - no longer made as the company got bought out by Auto%$^& who promptly culled it's best features and released it a Autosketch.
Mainly because I work in the building industry and i'm familiar with the package.
What generally happens with any CAD package is that you get used to it's features (and bugs) and to swap and change to another involves a learning curve.
I tried XTrkCad but I find it easier to work with a general CAD package I know rather than learn a rail specific one....
Mind you I could always develop turnout libraries etc for use with Drafix - shouldn't be too hard.....

Tim

Tim,

As I recall the original AutoSketch was a DOS application back in the days of trying to work out how to put a mouse on DOS! Back when mice were worth $80 or $90 dollars! This must have been in the late 80's. When did Drafix-CAD come out? Maybe when Auto-#$(*& got hold of it they merged it into the already existing Auto-Sketch. Sadly Auto-Sketch seemed to get left behind. One of my clients was using it up until 1999 at least, but it never really seemed to work properly on Windows 2000 and had problems even on Win-95.

John

[Anonymous]

QUOTE: Originally posted by hminky

If you use Solidworks there should be a 2d drawing package. Get Atlas RTS and dxf them out of that software and into the solidworks and draw in 2d. I have done that with ProE. Real CAD software works better than the model railroad software.

Just a thought
Harold

Interesting thought Harold. SOmebody else has mentioned that the Atlas product has been updated. I will have a look at it and see if it is an improvement for me over the version I tried a little time back.

Thanks! John

[tstage]

John,

The only problem I've run into with the newer Atlas RTS is that, if I zoom in, I can't seem to move around the page in order to see my entire layout. I don't remember having that problem with 5.0. Anyone else experience that?

Tom

[trollw]

I have used CADRail for over 10 years and really like it. I have used it for designing everything from home remodelling plans to my HO layout plans. If you have used any CAD tools before, it is very easy to pick up on. It will do 3-d but it is not as 'slick' as 3rd PlanIt. However, I don't like the way some of the drawing tools work in 3rd PlanIt. There is a fairly good library of track in both sets of software. The library of buildings for 3rd PlanIt is much smaller than CADRail. If you would like to discuss either or both of these 2 programs, shoot me an e-mail and we can set up a time to talk.

[Anonymous]

John, you should also consider Winrail. This is an easy-to-use program which, though lacking many of the features of the "true" CAD programs, IMHO strikes a great balance between complexity / learning curve and functionality. Also, the guys behind it are very responsive if you have a question.

[WaxonWaxov]

Personally, I've used 3D Railraod Concept and Design in the past and enjoyed it.

$49.99 Check it out here: http://www.theliquidateher.com/3drrconceptanddesign-windows.html

I've never used any of the other products so I can't comment on them.

[mechengr]

I'm a new member to this forum, but have been an "armchair model railroader" for over 50 years - in past haven't had space\finances to build an actual layout.

Well, now I'm hoping to start an actual layout and have been looking for a software program to help with layout planning. Seems most here like XTrkCad, so I've d/l'd and installed it.

Now I'm lost!! I know that I have "mental blocks" at times (it comes with age), but I have not been able to understand how to use XTrkCad, even though I'm tried to follow the tutorals. For example, I don't understand how to select a section of track and move it to the layout. should I be laying track first, or doing something else before laying track?

I was able to specify the "room size", but that is as far as I have been able to go.

I know that this forum isn't here to teach software program operation, but this is very frustrating and discouraging to me as this is the time I'm hoping to plan\build an actual layout.

I need help!!

mechengr

[Anonymous]

I found that getting started was the hardest part. I'll try to describe how I got going, maybe it will work for you.

First, although it took a while I stepped through most if not all of the demos. There are still a lot of the shortcuts I don't use, but I get along. Then, after creating the room, I drew the table edges that I planned on using. You can always change things as you get going, but it helped me to visualize what I was up to.

Then I picked a place that had a reasonable long chunk of straight track and drew it. Select the straight track icon, click (hold own the button) and drag to place the track. Then I drew another straight piece, then use the join (not connect) fuction to hook them together. Hold the mouse button down as you do this, and you can choose the radius of the curve. If you are using sectional track, it's a bit different. Then you click on the place turnout of sectional track icon, select the piece you want, and click where you want it. Then you can use the move and rotate to get it where you want it. After that, you just select what you want to add, and it will connect automatically.

Did you view the demos from the beginning? Some are really "simple" but it builds up. Watch everywhere they drag the mouse, whre they are selecting, etc. I think that once you get going you'll be fine!

[jxtrrx]

In XtrkCad with sectional track there is one thing that is confusing until you "get it." When you select a piece of track and place it, it just floats until you ** press spacebar **. This anchors the piece. Each subsequent piece of track will snap to the free end of the previous one, but until you press SPACE, it isn't placed.