I am looking for design suggestions for building an entry to the center of my around the walls layout design that will allow easy entry, electrical disconnect to approaching track when open and ensure track alignment, electrical continuity when closed. I will try to describe the layout accurately.
My layout design at the desired entry point is essentially a 30” deep 1x4” box frame topped by 1/2“ plywood topped by 1/2” homasote with the top at 26” above the floor. This level is for a staging yard. There is a single curved turnout located where I propose to make the entry. The turnout would be in/on the proposed opening.
This lower level is connected to the main layout level above by 2 separate outside perimeter around the walls 1 time around ramps in each direction parallel to each other (one rising and the other falling) which at the proposed location are just about at the surface of the main layout level at 38” above the floor.
The main level is also a 30” deep 1x4” box frame topped by 1/2“ plywood topped by 1/2” homasote with the top at 38” above the floor. Picture a table atop a table. There are 2 mainline tracks that cross the area at 41” above the floor in addition to the 2 ramps described above. Ideally, this top level of the proposed access opening would be fully covered in scenery in addition to the tracks.
I have identified an 18” wide area that I think is suitable, if narrow (I anticipate entering sideways). So to summarize, it has 4 tracks crossing at the main level 38-41” and a curved turnout at the lower level 26”. To make this wider will add additional turnouts to the opening on the lower level (which I think is wise to avoid) with no change to the number on the main level. Both levels are 30” deep as described above. So the proposed access opening is 18” wide, 38” and more high and 30” deep.
I would love to have a 36” wide x 30” deep opening, but I do not think it practical.
So if you read this far, I thank you for sticking with me. I think I needed to accurately describe the situation. It might help if you sketch out what I described. My brain hurts.
Do you have any suggestions and/or resources you can give me for a design that will cover all of this? I would like a swing out gate design first or maybe a “drawer” that would slide in and out through the opening, but I could tolerate a lift out (or 2 stacked lift outs) and I do not see that a duck under, swing up or down bridge design is practical.
Thank you
Early on my first layout was around the wall with a hinged lift up bridge, worked great.A hinged lift up has some problems. I wasn’t into scenery back then (1951) and a lift up doesn’t allow for much scenery at the hinge.As for lift out I would try to keep the width as narrow as possible to make removing and replacing I as easy as possible. Also storing it when the layout isn’t in use would be nicer for a smaller section.I would come up with an automatic interlock to prevent a train taking the big drop. A manual type is too easily forgotten, it needs to operate automatically when the lift out is removed.My hinged lift up was simple for a 14 year old, a doorbell button that connected the power to the rails when pushed with the lift up bridge down and in place. If the bridge wasn’t down and in place there was no power to the rails to either side of the bridge, no accidental big drop. Mel My Model Railroad http://melvineperry.blogspot.com/ Bakersfield, California I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
Yes, welcome to the forum. Mel makes some very good points. Here is a thread of interest:
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/11/t/278773.aspx
18'' is not a lot, but still way better than a duck under. If you can afford a few inches more, it would be better. It's not just a matter of passing through - it's also about passing through with something in your hands, like that expensive brass loco that you don't want to hit something with. Or worse, drop. You might also carry materials or equipment that is awkward to carry. The thread above has great advice about how to design one that will be robust and time lasting. Take your time and with the right braces in place, it should be solid enough to resist against the most careless visitors...
Simon
Good cabinet hinges will work if they are properly mounted and separated by at least 22". Also, the framework holding them must be quite rigid and the swing-up element must be well crafted.
What I do is to craft it all, prove it, adjust as necessary, and then wire it all for power. The power goes like this:
a. feeders from the closest bus wire to the closest hinge. Use a screw mounting the hinge to make contact with the hinge metal by winding the bared end of the feeder around the screw. Don't laugh...this works very reliably, twice now for me;
b.on the other half of the hinge, the one fastened to the swing up element, do the same thing. One bared end of a feeder wound around any one of the two/three screws, and then that wire serves as a sub-bus to two or more feeders feeding one polarity/phase of a single rail. On the other side of the opening, other hinge on the other end of the swing-up element, repeat...bared wire ends, one on the closest main bus, the other around the top part of that hinge, on that side of the element, fastened to the main frame of the swing-up supports. Yet another screw on the bottom half of the hinge holds the bared end of another sub-bus for the other rails on the swing-up.
This way, you always have positive contact from both sides of the gap to both hinges, and from the hinges down to the various feeders of whatever rails you put on the swing-up. This is rather simple once you get your mind around what I have described, and I will swear on me dear late ma's grave that is has been absolutely, categorically, and honestly, perfectly reliable. I even relied on barrel locks the last time. They were brass, and they supported a 'swing-down' diagonal that dropped down to vertical when I wanted my central operating pit to be clear for unrestricted and careless movement.
This part is critical: you need to lay contiguous elements of rail from somewhere near 6" back onto each side of the gap RIGHT OVER the ENTIRE swing-up. This will show you where you have air or bumps anywhere. You do NOT want them because you will have to cut gaps on all rails on both ends of the gaps. If there's a weak point that causes derailments and no end of frustration, it will be across those gaps. Also, the rail ends are very vulnerable to mangling by the frame of the swing-up if you don't make those hinges work smoothly and firmly, or if any parts of the framing are wobbly and will flex. Be warned!
One last thing. You will adjust your lie for the swing-up using the half-inch wood screws. You'll drive at least four into retaining blocks or a 'shelf' onto which the bottom stringers of the swing-up will come to rest. You will be able to adjust these up or down slightly to get reduced bumping at the cut gaps in the rails.
Hi Mark.
I am working on a Byron Henderson designed layout in an around the walls donut shape. The layout includes a 'rollout' section that allows me to open the donut to create a walking path into the centre. The rollout section has four passes of track at different elevations. Careful carpentry allows the rollout to return directly to the right position to line up the tracks and elevations. Brass suitcase latches were initially used to connect the tracks to the main layout electrically. I've since replaced those with multi-pin molex connectors that allow each track to be connected to it's own detection block.
All that as it is, I also have a duckunder right beside the the rollout section. The depth of the duckunder is 24" - kinda far for simple crouching. What I've found works well is a rolling stool I picked up from Canadian Tire. The stool is about 16" high and is on casters. Its deisgn is for auto repair. Anyway, I find that setting the stool just outside the duckunder allows me to drop my backside onto the stool and scooch under the layout into the donut-hole. Since I've picked up the rolling stool I've not once crunched my head or back stooping to get into the layout.
Anyway, lots of thoughts. Good luck.
Dwayne A
I had a narrow lift-out on my layout. It is 34 inches wide and 11 inches deep. It's essentially a bridge between two sections, one straight track, filly scenicked with truss bridged over a narrow creek in the center. I built it from pink foam surrounded with hardboard for protection and appearance.
Measuring both the liftout and me, it looks like 24 inch width would have been all right, but not much less. This lift-out accesses a narrow space on the back side of the layout, plus a window. It's not a room access, and honestly, I duck under it more often than I remove it.
The lift-out must carry track bus power across the gap. So, I use plugs and jacks on each end, plus wires. It's simple and fool-proof, but just having to disconnect and reconnect the wiring is awkward. That will change when I get around to putting the layout up again.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
I built a two-track lift out for a layout some years ago. Here it is in the foreground.
It was around 24 inches long and six inches wide. Alignment was accomplished using piano hinges with the pins removed at both ends. Track ends were solidly affixed to the supporting frameworks by soldering the rails to PC boards. Electrical connection was made using a simple plug that, if not hooked in, killed power to tracks on both sides of the lift-out.
Worked great for the short time I had it installed.
Mark P.
Website: http://www.thecbandqinwyoming.comVideos: https://www.youtube.com/user/mabrunton
Thank you and all of the others for your replies to my problem. I have decided that the only practical solution to my layout design with both low and high track levels and room location is a “pullout ‘drawer’ on wheels with routed out wooden rail slot and key along the sides of the drawer and opening to insure allignment each time” it is slid into place. The slot and key will also help tie the opening together when the drawer is in place. This should also allow the upper level to be sceniced. I will take all of your electrical suggestions into consideration. I appreciate all of you for taking the time to reply.
Hey no problem, and please post pictures when you are done!
These were simple to add, and are very stable as far as track alignment is concerned...
The multi-pin plug-ins energise not only the lift-out sections, but also the approach tracks on both sides of the aisle...
The lower one has been in use for 30 years, the upper one for five. Storage, when not in-use, is simple...
Wayne
I used wire connectors to power not only the swing-up section but also the approaches.
The power is wired directly to the swing-up section, then the approaches on both sides are powered from that section. When I disconnect the connector, the power to both approaches is disconnected.
The connector shown has enough wires to not only feed the tracks (swing-up section, approaches, and lighting for the structures on it.
I just loosely screwed a length of 1x2" to act as a locking mechanism when the section is in the raised position. The holes at the end of the section are to align with dowels inserted in the mating end of the static section.
The dowels are shown in this picture. I should have drilled the holes for them from the bottom with the swing-up section in place, not drilling all the way through the top section. That way the holes wouldn't be seen from the top.
This picture shows the section lowered into place. I COULD have made it the same width as the static section, but I did it this way to save weight. Once it's lowered into place, I clamp the sections together and glue the roadbed down. When the glue holding the roadbed down is completely dried, I lay the track down, glueing it with acrylic caulk. When that is dried, I ballast the track and once the diluted glue is dried, I cut the track at an angle, with the angle sloped with the track on the swing-up section being the long end of the track. I use a cutoff disk in a Dremel to cut through, both the track and ballast. In 3 years since I made this section, I've had NO issues.
Marlon
See pictures of the Clinton-Golden Valley RR
Marlon, your liftout (or access gate) is living proof that even wide liftouts can be strudy and functional. It's all about using gravity and good bracing where the liftout lands to ensure well-aligned track. My entire layout shuts off when I lift my liftout.