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Room Lighting

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  • Member since
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Room Lighting
Posted by Pruitt on Tuesday, April 10, 2018 6:24 PM

I'm planning to start basement prep for my revived CB&Q in Wyoming in May, with ceiling installation and new lighting. 

I'm considering installing 14-15 of these babies for general lighting: https://www.lightup.com/1ft-x-4ft-flat-panel-led-40-watt-dimmable-4000-lumens-lumegen.html?utm_source=googlepepla&utm_medium=adwords&id=280474030297&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI8vrupOSO2gIVhbrACh2dcQ7IEAkYHCABEgLYzPD_BwE

The CRI is only 80, which is a bit concerning. I'd prefer a CRI of 85 or higher. Anybody know of any similar LED panels that provide a better spectrum? Or does anyone have experience with a CRI 80-quality light they can share?

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Posted by gmpullman on Tuesday, April 10, 2018 7:43 PM

I replaced many of my lay-in "troffer" fixtures with LEDs. Some I converted the tubes and eliminated the ballasts and others I have used 2 x 2 lay-in panel LEDs.

They all have a "stated" CRI of 80. More important to me was the actual color temperature.

I see the ones you are looking at give you three choices of 3, 4, or 5,000°K. Which temperature did you have in mind?

I tend to like the lower temperatures. Some of the LED spot lights I use are 2700°K. To me they seem to be closer to what we are used to in incandescent lamps.

Others prefer the cooler-white shades of the higher spectrum lamps.

I vary my lighting with dimmable recessed and some track-light LED spot lights when I'm "running" and use the big, general LED panels illuminated when I'm working or doing maintenance.

I really don't pay much attention to CRI, myself. All the photography and rendition of colors to my eye look just fine. You can take a dozen LEDs with the same CRI number and get a dozen different color renditions which will actually vary by the person's perception of the color anyway.

Those 1 x 4 side-lit LEDs look pretty neat. I might have a place for some of those!

Good Luck, Ed

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Posted by SpaceMouse on Tuesday, April 10, 2018 9:19 PM

I'd take a good look at a room using those lights. We recently put a light in our bedroom that had a similar look to the light in your picture. The color distortion was so bad that we couldn't stand to be in the room. Eventually we took it out and it is now exterior lighting where we can't see it. 

Chip

Building the Rock Ridge Railroad with the slowest construction crew west of the Pecos.

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Posted by Sparky Rail on Tuesday, April 10, 2018 10:24 PM

Yup, try Cree brand flat panels. They have a CRI of 90.

http://lighting.cree.com/products/indoor/troffers/essentia-by-cree-flat-panel

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Posted by Pruitt on Wednesday, April 11, 2018 5:29 PM

Wow!

Those Cree panels are pricey - about $167 each!

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Posted by gmpullman on Wednesday, April 11, 2018 5:30 PM

Sparky Rail
Yup, try Cree brand flat panels. They have a CRI of 90.

That additional 10 points of CRI sure comes at a price, though.

https://www.platt.com/platt-electric-supply/LED-Indoor-Flat-Panel/Cree-Lighting/FP14-40L-35K-10V/product.aspx?zpid=35305

OP wants to install 15 of them. Maybe his budget allows $2763+ for lighting?

Overall, I've had pretty good luck with the knock-offs. Some of which actually have Cree® LEDs in them anyway.

Cheers! Ed

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Posted by carl425 on Thursday, April 12, 2018 7:50 AM

Brunton
Those Cree panels are pricey - about $167 each!

Yeah but...

The panels in your original post are priced at about half of everybody else's 80 CRI panels.  

The Cree's may be extra expensive, but the LightUp's are suspiciously cheap.

Remember, you don't always get what you pay for, but you never get what you don't pay for.

I have the right to remain silent.  By posting here I have given up that right and accept that anything I say can and will be used as evidence to critique me.

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Posted by ahuffman on Thursday, April 12, 2018 4:36 PM

One thing you might want to consider is the light distribution of those panels.  It's pretty narrow according to the data sheet.  If you're using them fairly close to the layout, the uniformity of the illumination may not be satisfactory.  I'd buy one or two and try them before I committed to doing the entire layout area with them.

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Posted by joe323 on Friday, April 13, 2018 6:02 AM

What is CRI?

Joe Staten Island West 

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Posted by riogrande5761 on Friday, April 13, 2018 6:55 AM

CRI is Color Rendering Index:

Color rendering describes how a light source makes the color of an object appear to human eyes and how well subtle variations in color shades are revealed. The Color Rendering Index (CRI) is a scale from 0 to 100 percent indicating how accurate a "given" light source is at rendering color when compared to a "reference" light source.

The higher the CRI, the better the color rendering ability. Light sources with a CRI of 85 to 90 are considered good at color rendering. Light sources with a CRI of 90 or higher are excellent at color rendering and should be used for tasks requiring the most accurate color discrimination.

It is important to note that CRI is independent of color temperature (see discussion of color temperature). Examples: A 2700K ("warm") color temperature incandescent light source has a CRI of 100. One 5000K ("daylight") color temperature fluorescent light source has a CRI of 75 and another with the same color temperature has a CRI of 90.

https://www.topbulb.com/color-rendering-index

I am planning to finish my basement and am not loaded so will be looking for some modestly priced LED ceiling mount lights (probably for a drop ceiling) so if anyone has any suggestions and sources, please let me know.

Thanks.

Rio Grande.  The Action Road

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Posted by bearman on Friday, April 13, 2018 9:36 AM

Rio, I had some spotlights and track lighting installed in the ceiling in my train room, which is a separate room in my house, not a basement.  EcoSmart 65W equivalent spot lights are 25$ package at Home Depot w/6 bulbs per package for the daylight bulbs.

Bear "It's all about having fun."

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Posted by riogrande5761 on Friday, April 13, 2018 9:52 AM

Thanks bearman.  That may be one option.  I was thinking about a twin 4 foot format fixture only LED's rather than the traditional fluorscent tube old types.  Now that LED's are becoming ubiquitous, I'm hoping some economical solutions can be found.

Rio Grande.  The Action Road

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Posted by mbinsewi on Friday, April 13, 2018 10:18 AM

riogrande5761
I was thinking about a twin 4 foot format fixture only LED's rather than the traditional fluorscent tube old types.

Thats what I'm looking for, to replace the regular 4' fluorescent hanging "shop light" fixtures that I have now.

I don't have a finished ceiling, so troffers are not needed.

Mike.

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Posted by RR_Mel on Friday, April 13, 2018 10:21 AM

I originally installed five 8’ two tube Fluorescent fixtures in my garage for lighting.  They really faded my scenery.  The Fluorescent bulbs don’t last very long so going LED is actually cheaper in the long run.  Last summer I re-lamped them with 5K LED tubes, got a really good piece on eBay at ten 8’ single pin LED lamps for $130 free S&H.
 
I bought one 4’ LED fixture (3K) and tried it in the bathrooms and Kitchen and my wife didn’t like the warm white so I went with 5K there too.  We had 5K Fluorescent bulbs in the bathrooms and kitchen so she was accustomed to 5K light.  We did like the 3K for the living room and bedrooms.
 
I use four R30 9 watt 3K flood light LEDs for daytime operating and the 5K strip lights for working.  I went with two R30 15 watt 4.1K LED floods for moonlight night operating.
 
 
 
Mel
 
Modeling the early to mid 1950s SP in HO scale since 1951
  
 
My Model Railroad   
 
Bakersfield, California
 
I'm beginning to realize that aging is not for wimps.
 
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Posted by sktrains on Sunday, April 15, 2018 8:21 AM
Do they have to be panels or surface mount fixtures or can you put in recessed down lights? if you can it might open up some more options 
I did a retro fit job where we used these in sofits in an office building and I liked them so ordered some for my basement layout, you will have to use  more but I think  it has a nicer look for a finished room
these are made by maxlight and are 5000K , 85 cri, 1000 lumens, and dimmable with no extra wiring they cost about $35- $40 i ordered them through a electrical supply house plus a cheap  housing from depot for about 8 bucks
STEVE   
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Posted by gmpullman on Monday, April 16, 2018 9:16 AM

I also like mini-can down-lighting. As I mentioned in my earlier reply, I like to have several options for the levels of lighting for either task lighting or "mood" lighting.

The 3" mini-cans I use can take an LED MR-16 lamp and they can be angled to a slight degree.

 IMG_1478 by Edmund, on Flickr

 

 IMG_1493 by Edmund, on Flickr

I forget what the price of them were but I seem to recall less than $20 each and the MR-16 LEDs in quantity are about $3/ea.

 IMG_1480 by Edmund, on Flickr

They cast a nice glow and are dimmable so that building and train interiors can be seen better. There are also LED 2x2 panel lamps and 2x4 former fluorescent fixtures that I have retrofitted with 48" LED tubes, eliminating the ballasts.

 IMG_8609_fix by Edmund, on Flickr

 

 IMG_8624_fix by Edmund, on Flickr

 IMG_8627_fix by Edmund, on Flickr

In the "old" part of the layout I use a variety of track lights and these goose-neck MR-16 lights that can be easily positioned to highlight areas. There's a few recessed cans here, too, but the ceiling is not as easy to install recessed lighting here.

 IMG_8648_fix by Edmund, on Flickr

 This is about full brightness on the can-lamps.

 IMG_4134 by Edmund, on Flickr

Thank You, Ed

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Posted by Pruitt on Tuesday, April 17, 2018 12:07 PM

I've been offline for a few days.

Great discussion!

My thought for the LED panels is for general room lighting. There's a really good chance they will become layout lighting as well, but I'm not sure of that yet.

I'm going to order one or two of the panels I listed and install them to see how they look. After that, I'll either order the full quantity I need or go back and rethink.

One thing I'm certain of is that the fluorescents I have now will have to go!

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Posted by selector on Tuesday, April 17, 2018 3:26 PM

Mark, I had four of the 24" square LED flush-mount panels installed in my train room.  I got them at Home Depot.  They weren't close to being cheap, but they really cast a lot of good quality light in my train room.  I would recommend them.  I liked them so much that we have the 4' version installed on our kitchen ceiling.  In the dark of winter, that beast is amazing.

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Posted by Pruitt on Tuesday, April 17, 2018 4:06 PM

Crandell,

Do you remember any more details? Home Depot has several different ones. I see that all of them are CRI 80, though.

I've been stuck on the 1X4 models because that's the size fluorescent I've installed between joists. Since the LEDs are flat, I can install them right across joists. Gotta stop thinking so rigidly!

gmpullman, 

I leaning towards the 4k temperature.

I DON'T have a large budget anymore - I retired recently and have to watch my money a bit more now.

Personally I'm a bit leery of having bright and dark spots from using mini-spots or can lights, but your installation looks really good!

carl425, 

I plan to buy one or two and try them out before I go for the whole bundle.

ahuffman, 

The lights will be 2-3 feet above most of the layout. One area that will be double-decked they will be closer.

 

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Posted by staybolt on Tuesday, April 17, 2018 7:29 PM

I chose a Metalux 92SL (92"...just under 8 ft. long) led strip light for bright (8,000 lumens) general illumination. It's has a CRI rating of 80 and a color temp. of about 3,500K. I attached it to mid-ceiling (8 ft. high) in my 11 ft. x 14 ft. "railroad room". I'm building my layout on a 45 in.-high, 8 ft. x 10 ft. table. This strip provides very good lighting for the size of my layout and room. It cost $90, but I think I've got good lighting for the money.

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Posted by selector on Tuesday, April 17, 2018 8:17 PM

Unfortunately, Mark, now three years on, I have forgotten the details.  HD had only introduced them in their product line recently, and the floor walker was keen on getting some sold.  I think they were Feit, 2X4, white thin metal frame that isn't really flush mount, but tucks up fairly tightly against the ceiling.  It wires into the standard box, but there's a thin metal plate that must be screwed into ceiling joists first, centered around the junction box.  The plate has six flat hooks that snags the underside of the frame.  You lay the light and frame up against it and slide it one way to engage the hooks, and that's it...let go and flip the switch.  It looks so much like a bright skylight that we both clapped with delight.  Remember, we live in the gloomy PNW, and it gets almost desperate by Christmas to get a nice sunny day.

They're pricey, but once you swallow hard and get them in place, several 2'ers in your train room, you'll do a jig.

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Posted by mbinsewi on Tuesday, April 17, 2018 8:55 PM

Wow, Laugh, so we get a climpse of your layout?  Laugh

Mike.

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Posted by gmpullman on Tuesday, April 17, 2018 9:32 PM

Sorry! Duplicate post Embarrassed How did that happen?

See below

VVVVVVVV

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Posted by gmpullman on Tuesday, April 17, 2018 9:36 PM

This photo, which I shot with the camera stopped-down a bit, shows the difference in the light output of a 2x4 POFF (Plain Old Fluorescent Fixture) and beyond, a 2x2 LED flat panel (not edge-lit, though).

 IMG_8608 by Edmund, on Flickr

There's four T-8 High output tubes in the fluorescent fixture.

I replace them as time permits. Right now I have eight including one over my work bench and one over Mrs. Pullman's sewing machine.

I get them from Amazon.

Brunton
Personally I'm a bit leery of having bright and dark spots from using mini-spots or can lights, but your installation looks really good!

Thank you.

The camera seems to make the shadows more noticable than in reality. In some areas I want to highlight, what did they call them?, LDEs or something, Layout Design Elements. Anyway, I can highlight certain areas of interest. I sometimes choose lamps with a wider or smaller beam-spread for this reason.

I only mentioned recessed cans as a reply to Steve, AKA sktrains, since he mentioned the LED adapter fittings which actually don't recess too much at all and have a much wider beam spread.

Thank You, Ed

 

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