Hi guys, first post, been into HO for years, built a 4x8 til about 80% done, left for the USMC and have my first home.
I got a N scale loco and a couple cars, and overall I'm pretty impressed. But I've seen other people's layouts on youtube, and the jumpy cars and way fast speeds are kind of disheartening.
My next layout will be in a simlar vein as the Beer Line - a sectional layout that can arranged a number of ways. I really like the way it wanders though an industral sector, and the switching required.
I love N scale for more "world" per foot, but can I get HO-comparable realistic, low speed operation?
Sure. Just operate your layout slowly. If you're using DCC, you can program your decoders for an appropriate maximum speed using CV5 (Vhigh).
--Steven Otte, Model Railroader senior associate editorsotte@kalmbach.com
Sure you can but remember, mass can not scale and the room you have to compinsate for this in smaller scales is smaller therefore more difficult but can be doable.
Also the larger the scale the easier it is to see the slow movement. An N scale engine moving 1mph looks like it is not moving but a G scale one dose as the distance accually traved is more in G scale.
Yes, many model train videos have exaggerated speeds that the layout owner might not use in actual operation, because of a perception that people get bored seeing model trains run at slow speeds. Some of the old Allen Keller videos in particular make the freight cars look jerky because of the speeds Keller asked them to run at.
With N I think truck mounted couplers and the very light weight of the cars also tend to make the rolling stock look more jerky on videos. Don't some guys put small springs on the axles to give the cars more drag -- to help prevent that "slinky" look.
Dave Nelson
I have built layouts in both N and HO scale.
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For the kind of operation you would get from the Beer Line, I would really recommend HO scale for the project.
N scale really shines with big scenery and long trains, but for industrial switching I would only consider it if real world space limitations make it a necessity.
Oh, by the way... to the Model Railroader forums. Your first few posts are delayed by moderators for a bit. That will end soon enough. Please stick around and join in the conversation.
-Kevin
Living the dream.
dknelson With N I think truck mounted couplers and the very light weight of the cars also tend to make the rolling stock look more jerky on videos. Don't some guys put small springs on the axles to give the cars more drag -- to help prevent that "slinky" look. Dave Nelson
Yes, the idea was to put those tiny Kadee springs between the axle point and the truck frame in the caboose to create a little drag stretch the train out so the caboose doesn't oscillate back and forth unrealistically.
I had N scale for around 5 years and the Micro Trains couplers worked great although they don't look quite as good as the HO Kadee's. Even back in the early 1980's, some engines could creep very slow and smooth. One in particular was an Atlas FA.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
Many folks do switching on N scale layouts and it works fine with the majority of locomotives released in the last 10-15 years -- which can really crawl. (And there were many good engines before that, as well.)
The way to know for sure would be to buy or borrow a few pieces of N scale equipment to see if you like it.
The space versus scale trade-off is one that each individual must make for themselves.
Good luck with your layout.
Byron
Layout Design GalleryLayout Design Special Interest Group
Hi Lucky-13, Welcome to the Forum!
I model N scale and it is possible to get realistic, low speed operation when you are switching. Some of the newer engines (Kato and Atlas come to mind, among N scale manufacturers) have very silky slow operation, and are fun to operate. One thing-you'll want to make sure you have clean track-this is a must with N scale.
You may want to check out the video reviews that MR does for many N scale locos. The reviewer usually operates them at realistic speeds and starts/stops/reverses the engines.
Good luck!!!
Jeff
With newer engines and rolling stock and especially newer decoders with back EMF, you should have no trouble getting N scale trains to creep along smoothly at 1 scale MPH. Better wheels, better couplers, better handrails, better paint and details, more roadnames, improvements all around. No reason to look askance at N scale. Well, sound systems need a little work, but otherwise . . .
Robert
LINK to SNSR Blog
The beauty of N Scale is you don't need very much room..A 1' X 8' board will yield a very nice ISL..A 2'X4' board will yield a nice portable N Scale layout. A 36" x 80" HCD will yield a super nice layout with lots of options. A 36" x 80" HCD would also make a excellent beer line.
Larry
Conductor.
Summerset Ry.
"Stay Alert, Don't get hurt Safety First!"
I have the same debate with myself periodically... I'm currently in HO I prefer long trains and big scenery N could give me more of that BUT then I talk myself down with the thought that N is better because it's smaller while it's worse because it's smaller! If you have the room to get what you want go HO, IMHO because its still compact, but you still get a "feel" for the impressiveness of the real deal... but to each their own! Good luck and welcome to the forums!
Steve
If everything seems under control, you're not going fast enough!
NWP SWP, IMHO because its still compact, but you still get a "feel" for the impressiveness of the real deal...
You want the feel? Dump HO and go O Scale 2 rail then you will know what feel is all about. I'm not talking about Bachmann On30.
You'll have both mass and weight and you can feel the viberation.
I would also consider how hard N scale might be to work on for you. A larger scale might make easier for you. I have HO and I can't imagine how hard it would be to install a decoder in an N scale engine. Or putting on a coupler. Assembling a small building kit might be a real challenge.
Now that I am older, I wish I would have considered S scale or maybe 2 rail O scale. I have triple lens glasses, I need a magnifying glass, and have arthritis in my hands. Even HO is becoming too small.
Myths..N Scale is no harder to work on then HO. I have limited use of my right hand and modeled in N from 2007-2012. There is a lot of 60/70 year olds in N.
My biggest mistake was selling my N instead of my HO.
While I haven't tried it N scale, I have found that DCC is easier than DC to get really slow speeds in HO, S, and 3 rail O gauge.
Having built layouts in N, HO, S, O, and G, I find that S is the sweet spot for me. Easy to see and work on and small enough for a reasonable layout. But as noted above, each of us has to find the one that best works for them.
Good luck with N.
Paul
And they were coming out with a lot of new scale items in S-scale. Are they still, or have a good number of importers dropped off?
Brian
My Layout Plan
Interesting new Plan Consideration
IRONROOSTERWhile I haven't tried it N scale, I have found that DCC is easier than DC to get really slow speeds in HO, S, and 3 rail O gauge.
Paul,I will agree but,I can't forget the fancy DC power packs with Advanced Slow Speed Circuitry that slows those DC locomotives to a crawl for better slow speed control.MRC's Tech 6 in the DC mode allows the modeler to adjust momentum,start voltage and braking.
While I have no first hand experience with MRC's Tech 7, I been told its the best in the game for DC control.
railandsail And they were coming out with a lot of new scale items in S-scale. Are they still, or have a good number of importers dropped off?
Due to problems with the Chinese manufacturer one of the big players in S, S Helper went out of business and eventually sold out to MTH. MTH has been slowwwwwly bringing the line back.
Lionel has revived the American Flyer line, but it is mostly highrail with a few pieces suitable for the scale side.
American Models continues with a nice selection - mostly for a 50's-70's era.
River Raisin is an importer of brass models mostly steam locomotives.
There are several small manufacturers of kits.
The NASG site has a Resources section that lists manufacturers/importers.
The major problem at the moment is the lack of steam locomotives. American models has a 4-6-2 and a 4-8-4. B.T.S. had some 2-8-0 and 0-6-0 kits but they are out of production. S Helper had a 2-8-0 that hopefully MTH will bring back.
While S is not as quite as good as a few years ago, there is still quite a lot available. And Fox Valley Models has just introduced a very nice line of flex track and #5 turnouts that are very DCC friendly.
Yes, I have Kato USA-and Fox Valley Models locomotives; I have no problem replicating prototypical speeds on either of them. An additional advantage is that you could create a continuous loop in two by eight feet instead of four by eight feet, which will allow you to reach from one side to the other; thank you for your service!
I personally model in HO but regularly operate both HO and N scale layouts. Newer N scale equipment runs just as well as HO scale. For me (and many others), aging vision has been the reason I have stayed with HO. The owner of one of the N scale layouts I operate knows this and so plants flags with large loco numbers on straight pins next to his locos so we don't have to try to read the tiny little number boards on the locos. Switching cars can also require magnifying glasses to identify the cars and read the road numbers.
Even if you don't have vision problems, remember that many visitors to your layout will. With all other aspects between the two scales now being pretty equal, if you want others to operate your N scale layout, you will need to keep this in mind.
The only other operating problem I sometimes see is shaky hands. An operator with shaky hands is not too much of a problem when uncoupling HO scale, or larger, cars. However, that same shake can be a major problem uncoupling N scale cars. Our hand movements have to be that much more precise if we don't want to derail cars every time we need to reach into the layout. Again, mostly an age related problem but none of us are getting any younger.
Hornblower