Hello MRR community,
New member to the forum here. My history is with O scale trains. My layout always had kit buildings. The O scale stuff has now been handed over to my nephews. I'm switching to HO scale.
I want to get started in scratch building. Do any of you use autocad or any software to design your structures first?
Thanks,
Ed
Semi newbie HO scale modeler coming from the O scale world
mrrdadI want to get started in scratch building. Do any of you use autocad or any software to design your structures first?
Ed,
I don't, but I tend to be a fly-by-the-seat-of-your-pants sort of modeler. I do tend to calculate critical dimensions to get spacing, clearances, etc right, but I will usually jump in and start cutting and gluing after some preliminary thought. But I've also built 1:1 scale buildings this way and I do know my way arund a plan.
So nothing against developing new skills here, I'm certain it will be useful. I'd encourage you to think of these as two tracks that are somewhat related but also independent. Planning and design are only a couple of the many skills involved in scratchbuilding, so there are plenty of other places to make progress as you develop CAD to support those aspects of this skill set. You'll find satsifying results quickly.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
Hello all,
The cad program I loved; Canvas for Mac, has been discontinued for OS X.
Since then I have gone analog- -Graph paper, a scale ruler, mechanical pencil and a BIG eraser!
Hope this helps.
"Uhh...I didn’t know it was 'impossible' I just made it work...sorry"
there are so many many measured drawings of structures around 2 to 3 thousand on the library of congress site under the HABS/HAER tab that one dosen't need a cad program , also older issues of model magazines have them if you go to the MTF you can see photos of some i've built from them.
I'm like Mike, I don,t use plans, somtimes a picture but most times just a picture in my mind of the end results. Like grandpa said ''if it looks good ,nail it''
To me; if you need a plan and instructions, buy a kit
A scale rule, X-Acto knife and an idea is all the planning that I normally use.
Wayne
I'm with Mike, Wayne, and the others, an idea, and what size space I have.
I have built cardboard mock-ups, while planning a build, to get a sense of the size, roof designs, etc.
Mike.
My You Tube
mbinsewiI have built cardboard mock-ups, while planning a build, to get a sense of the size, roof designs, etc.
Dang good advice there!
Better than a measurement, a mockup can provide someting that fits.
The earlier advice about working from pics is also excellent
I do want to emphasize that there is value in making a plan to guide one's efforts. In some cases, it's indispensable. Many people work better from a plan and they should do so without apology or remorse. All I'm saying is you don't need to let lack of a plan stand in your way of building many things that are worthwhile as skill builders.
Hi Ed:
Welcome to the forums!!
I use my mind mostly too. I get my inspiration from photographs but my finished products often only bear a resemblance to the prototype. I tend to focus on architectural style rather than getting the number of windows exact.
I actually do my design drawing right on the styrene or wood without doing a sketch. All I need is an idea of what it should look like and how much space it will take up on the layout.
One piece of advice I would offer, whether you are using CAD or not, is to keep your interiors in mind when you are figuring out how to build your structure. A couple of my early attempts worked out great from an exterior point of view, but I didn't pay any attention to what would be seen through the windows. That resulted in multi-storey buildings that had no interior floors, or had structural components like bracing clearly visible where it shouldn't be. There were no interior walls so everything was wide open. That's fine for a factory, but not for a house.
I could go on forever but I'll wait to see if you have more questions.
Styrene is your friend!!
Cheers!!
Dave
I'm just a dude with a bad back having a lot of fun with model trains, and finally building a layout!
Thank you all for the warm welcome and great responses. It is much appreciated.
I have an older version of DataCad, a professional architectural CAD program. While I don't use all of the program's features to design my (many) scratchbuilt sturctures, I do use it to design floor plans, elevations and roofs. It is VERY helpful determining the dimensions of sloped roof sections. It is also very helpful whenever a structure needs to be compressed to fit a layout space.
I typically print out the structure on cardstock, then cut, fold and paste it together into a scale mock-up. Such mock-ups allow you to determine whether a compressed structure still "looks" right or if it needs more dimensional massaging before the final structure is built. These mock-ups also make nice stand-ins until the final model can be built.
Hornblower
Before I spent a ton on a CAD program for buildings at least, I'd look at the software for making your own cardstock buildings. I'd think it would work fine and be a lot cheaper.
Disclaimer: This post may contain humor, sarcasm, and/or flatulence.
Michael Mornard
Bringing the North Woods to South Dakota!
doctorwayne A scale rule, X-Acto knife and an idea is all the planning that I normally use. Wayne
I do the same, but if I can get a visual idea from a photo, or better yet, some drawings, I will certainly use them. And, as mentioned here, I use card stock mock-ups (I save the empty cereal boxes), especially for my own creations with no plans or drawings, maybe just a conceptual sketch that I've drawn to go by.
mlehmanBetter than a measurement, a mockup can provide someting that fits.
.
Oh, you knew I would agree with this comment!
-Kevin
Living the dream.
Still enjoy using my old drafting equipment & working from a scale drawing when scratch building. Conceptualizing with cardboard mock-ups is a good idea & like Tom I also save up the cereal boxes.
Regards, Peter
While I kinda understand the reason for mockups, arent you building the thing twice? If the measurement works for the mockup, it should be ok for the building.. You can come up with a foot print, to see if it would fit with a quick job with a ruler.The height will be determened by the building being built. How long ,wide and high, is all you really need.
I have used a very low key mock up when the building had to go around an unmoveble object,just to get the angles right.
Anyway mockups would be of little value to me,as I tend to design as I build. And yes there were times it didn't fit,oh well, not the end of the world. Relocate or make it fit
UNCLEBUTCHWhile I kinda understand the reason for mockups, arent you building the thing twice? If the measurement works for the mockup, it should be ok for the building.. You can come up with a foot print, to see if it would fit with a quick job with a ruler.The height will be determened by the building being built. How long ,wide and high, is all you really need.
Mockups let you look at how the buildings look in relation to each other. Both positive spaces (the building) and negative spaces (space between) and an idea of how the finished buildings will look on the layout. You may see changes in placement and sizes that will improve the layout design.
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
The mock-ups, are much quicker to build. An idea, cardboard/paper board/foamboam, whatever, and a hot glue gun. And I will admit, some of my cardboard mock-ups were strengthend, and used as the structure foundation, with siding, windows, details, etc, added to the original cardboard mock-up structure.
It's definitely not a waste of time, in my book. Studying architecture, working towards a license, (which never happened), mock-ups were an important part of creating and even a convincing way to put pages and pages of drawings to life.
It's a hobby, and what one finds as part of the design process, will not work for others. It's all in the fun, the creation, and feeling of accomplishment of creating what you want, and making it convincing, and maybe even the "wow" factor to others.
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I agree 110% but every now and then I feel the need to speak my mind. Never ever intending to offend anyone
I will also add that cardboard mockups are about the best tool I use.
- Kevin
Check out my shapeways creations! HOn3 and railroad items for 3D printing:
https://www.shapeways.com/shops/kevin-s-model-train-detail-parts
UNCLEBUTCH Never ever intending to offend anyone
Possitively, absolutely no offense taken unclebutch.
I don't use any software - just a t square, triangle and straight edge to make rough pencil drawings to get the job done.
I usually put the plan under a sheet of glass and build on that. I often will free hand certain things (such as trestle bents) rather than use fixtures, to save time.
To keep things square during glue - up I use a straight edge and 123 blocks. I also use lots of mock ups to check the fit of a model and make a decision about the amount of compression to use.
Guy
see stuff at: the Willoughby Line Site
Hi mrrdad,I'm a recent arrival in the hobby with no room for a layout yet, so I came in with a view to embracing the modern tech for "scratchbuilding" what I want. For CAD software there are a lot of free/low-cost options available. I know people have designed buildings, cars, and details with TinkerCAD (free online solid modeling tool), Sketchup Make (free basic version of more extensive package) and Autodesk Fusion360 (commercial, but free license for hobbyists). I know a lot of people who love F360 and hate Sketchup, but I learned that first last winter, and used it to design a subway car and a building.
I still have to add a second motor truck, LEDs and a DCC decoder, but through a combination of 3D printing (both on my own and via Shapeways) and molding and casting I'm pretty far along with the car:
I haven't gotten around to assembling the building yet, but have copied the projected views from Sketchup to Inkscape (free vector graphics program) to modify the drawings in order to use the laser at my local makerspace to cut/engrave the walls from 1/8" thick acrylic.
I just came to the realization, that the term ''scratch build'' is a pretty wide brush.
I build generic buildings,that may or maynot represent a real structure,and dabble in small farm equipment.
Some use real blueprints to reproduce a exact scale model of a real building
Then we have those that build engines and rolling stock
Now we have folks who use technology, to make thire own parts
Shouldn't there be some kind of distinction ? as in the scale of our trains, or dc/dcc ect. ect.
or am I over thinking again,
UNCLEBUTCHI just came to the realization, that the term ''scratch build'' is a pretty wide brush.
I get what your saying.
I guess in it's simplest form, scratch build, you make all the pieces, kit-bashing, you use pieces that come from different kits and packages, and then there is the combination of the above.
I like your farm machinery thing. When I was a kid, store bought farm toys weren't allowed, maybe Christmas, but that was a stretch. So, I always found my self out in the farm shop, using wood, wire, and what ever I could find, to make our own, I say "our" as I was the oldest of 4 boys.
To me, when I make a mockup structure it is because I don’t have the materials to build the final structure but I do have cardstock, so it’s more a question of supplies. As for plans, about half of the scratch built structures I have made I just winged it, knowing the space I had and the supplies that I had. The other half of the structures were made following plans from RMC magazine or other sources. Currently I am building a historic California mission with plans from a elementary school project where kids build them with cardboard. I am using styrene for mine. My roofs will look better also because I found the proper Spanish tile made in plastic. I’m also adding custom interiors.
I like cardstock mockups. They help me figure out the layout of everything in a section of my railroad. It's not much help to me in designing an individual building, but it helps whe putting everything together. Her, I've got a few buildings made from DPM modules, plus a kit and one side of a Cornerstone building flat.
I got the look I wanted, with the canal and the track curving over it.
It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse.
There is a software package specifically for your purpose called Model Builder by Evan Designs at modeltrainsoftware.com
The basic package is $45...It also has add ons such as Advertiser (over 200 classic to modern advertising signs, including blank signs..$30.00), Window Designer (Add window treatments to plastic buildings or hand made...$40.00), Brickyard (print sheets of brick or stone in any scale...$15.00), Sign Creator (street, highway or rail side engineer signs, editable signs for street names...$40), Stained Glass (churches and art deco buildings...$15.00) and Graffiti...$20, or you can do like I did and buy the whole package at $150.00...another neat thing about the software is you can bring in photos or images you find elsewhere (or design in Photoshop) and it will scale them for you. Hope that helps.
Hi Mel, I know the "feeling" on the aging process, and things hurt! lol I will be beginning shortly to model the transition years, 1950s - early 60s so I can have both steam and diesel running. The main area will be Holland, MI (along Lake Michigan) which will have a branch end in Chicago and at the other end, the Pere Marquette passenger and ore mines northward in the UP of MI. I've experimented for 2 years, and am ready for the BIG one! I better get going while I still have some movement left! lol (any pics of your layout?)