Hi,
I have a problem of dirty track on my current layout. The prior version, which was a lot shoddily constructed had much cleaner track. Here are a couple of differences:
My engines have become unreliable as heck as well ... in months after the new layout was constructed.
I have cleaned a lot, with alcohol, bright boy eraser etc and things work ok for a bit and then get dirty again. It's frustrating, I used to build while my kids drove the trains and now I am just cleaning.
Any suggestions or data on the above two differences?
NP.
Have you cleaned the wheels and contacts on the locomotives? Maybe they picked up dirt from the track
I tried to sell my two cents worth, but no one would give me a plug nickel for it.
I don't have a leg to stand on.
DSchmittHave you cleaned the wheels and contacts on the locomotives? Maybe they picked up dirt from the track
....and if that is the case, I'd be checking the rolling stock wheels as well.
Cheers, the Bear.
"One difference between pessimists and optimists is that while pessimists are more often right, optimists have far more fun."
Per above suggestions, I would suggest in approximately this order: (1) clean the loco wheels by spinning over alcohol wet paper towel piece, (2) clean freight car wheels manually with alcohol so you are not spreading old junk around, (3) "gleam", including the last polishing step, the track and stay away from abrasive cleaners, (4) run a John Allen masonite pad car routinely in your train, (5) change your freight car wheelsets to metal to minimize gunk buildup and movement, (6) splurge on a CMX car and run it using lacquer thinner or denatured alcohol when needed.
I only have to run the CMX about every 3 months with this "system". Of course, a big factor is your environment. I presume we are talking about nickle silver track.
Paul
Modeling HO with a transition era UP bent
Finish the ceiling, the fiberglass was no mistake if the basement was not to be heated.
Thanks all.
Paul,
#1 is done.
Maybe I will remove all rolling stock and do a major cleanup of all wheels prior to returning them to service. I have been thinking about that CMX car ... but I have to be able to maintain a week of clean track and establish a base clean ... get rid of the root cause.
RRBell,
I really can't. Basement is exactly 6' tall which is 1" more than my height. Yep, I have to be humble down there. but given I have drywalled it all, it dones not get that cold So the fiber could just all come out if folks think it's depositing dirt on the track.
Thanks,
You could/should finish the ceiling with sheets of 1/8 inch Masonite. It would keep the crud off the layout without using up much height.
Disclaimer: This post may contain humor, sarcasm, and/or flatulence.
Michael Mornard
Bringing the North Woods to South Dakota!
You said you mechanically remmoved the paint from the railheads. What did you use, if you scratched the tops, it could be dirt in the scratches.
If insullation has been falling on the layout it could not only be messing up the track, but the fibers could have been pulled into the motors and gears causing poor operating.
I think that the elimination of "fallout" from the ceiling would help with not only the track, but an overall dust factor. Using 1/4" plywood wouldn't take up much of your limited space and be well worth the time and expense.
EDIT: Mike and I were writing at the same time, that should work too.
Good luck,
Richard
Bayfield Transfer Railway You could/should finish the ceiling with sheets of 1/8 inch Masonite. It would keep the crud off the layout without using up much height.
It came to my mind immediately as well. It won't take many sheets to cover the ceiling, it will be lightweight, thin, and can be painted white to help illuminate the layout below it.
.........................................................Oh, and it will keep those tiny fibers from dropping down over the layout.
I agree that finishing the ceiling should be your priority. I finished the walls and ceiling of my basement layout room before beginning construction of the layout. After painting the rails and ballasting the track, I cleaned it using a mildly abrasive pad meant for cleaning electrical contact points. Since then, an occasional vacuuming (every couple of years-or-so), using the brush attachment on my shop vac keeps the trains running. I should point out that my layout is DC-controlled, so perhaps not quite so fussy as DCC. However, the layout has been in operation for over 20 years, with actual track cleaning in the conventional sense done only that first time.
Wayne
All good advice and I would take heed. May I add..........does your rolling stock have plastic wheels? They seem to hold gunk much easier than the metal wheels, and a lot of MR's will change them out. I prefer Intermountain wheelsets, and they work like a charm.
Sorry to ask, but by chance do you have brass track (as opposed to nickel/silver)? Brass track seems to attract and hold gunk much easier than NS.
One more thing...... Is the layout in its own room, or is it surrounded by stuff and subject to "traffic". That too will add to the corruption of the track surface.
ENJOY !
Mobilman44
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
I remember with my first layout the (brass) rail gunk would build up on plastic wheels (particularly deep flanged AHM wheels) and literally make the wheel diameter larger, but uneven, so the car would take on a gimpy legged hobble, until the gunk build-up would just fall off somewhere on the layout, looking for all the world like a truly filthy fingernail clipping. The gunk was dark but had a definite brass patina to it.
This is a hunch but it may be that with your painted track, while the railheads are clean, nonetheless the flanges are from time to time touching paint on the sides of the rail and creating slight wear and thus dirt. It may just be a matter of time until all such wear is over and done with and whatever paint comes in contact with flanges has finally been worn.
Any other changes - for example scenic glues applied? Engines with smoke units?
Dave Nelson
All,
Thank you so much!
1. Did 1/8" Masonite in a lot of the ceiling before construction. Then got sick in some of the more complex parts. I will just take the insulation off in these parts. It's limited and the basement is in California.
2. I do have plastic wheels and they were not a problem in the old layout, but I can remove all plastic rolling stock for now.
3. I am thinking if ballasting/painting of track is making it harder for the switch blades to make good contact based on other threads. I might have to looking into cleaning these as well
NP
NP013. I am thinking if ballasting/painting of track is making it harder for the switch blades to make good contact based on other threads. I might have to looking into cleaning these as well NP
Often a problem even on upainted track.
NP01 Hi, I have a problem of dirty track on my current layout. The prior version, which was a lot shoddily constructed had much cleaner track. Here are a couple of differences: Track is painted this time. But I have mechanically removed all visible paint from railheads. Somehiw due to an error, insulation fibers were installed in the basement ceiling. Easy to remove, but they are there. My engines have become unreliable as heck as well ... in months after the new layout was constructed. I have cleaned a lot, with alcohol, bright boy eraser etc and things work ok for a bit and then get dirty again. It's frustrating, I used to build while my kids drove the trains and now I am just cleaning. Any suggestions or data on the above two differences? NP.
Is it the track or the locos or both?
If the track is "dirty", is there a film of some sort on it? Is it paint residue? Black gunk? Ballast glue? Something else?
If it appears to be the locos, are the wheels dirty? Have insulation fibers got into the truck gears, the motor/drivetrain?
If the problem is "dirt", and not something else, it will be visual and can be observed. No mystery there. What do you see?
Rich
Alton Junction
A couple of layouts ago, it was in an unfnished basement. There was insulation in the ceiling. Bare poured concrete walls and floors. The layout would get dusty if left alone for a few days, but outside of cleaning off the paint as the rails were painted, no track cleaning was needed - at least not with tools, cleaning cars, or liquids. That layout was completely reliable, even from the very first test with ver much inadequate feeders - one set of clip leads feeding the whole 8x12 for a test run. I never did the full gleam process, no metal polish applied, but I do burnish the rails once after the paint is cleaned off. That also worked for my last layout which was in a fully finished spare bedroom. Could go weeks on that one and trains would still run just fine.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
Is it a black film on the rails ?
NP01 3. I am thinking if ballasting/painting of track is making it harder for the switch blades to make good contact based on other threads. I might have to looking into cleaning these as well NP
I assume by "switch blades" you are refering to the points. When painting track the points should be masked to keep paint off them. If they were painted, cleaning the railheads wasn't enough. It sounds like the paint has been on for a while, so paint thinner may not get the points clean. It may take some fine 600 wet or dry paper. If you used a water based paint windex may work.
Ah more to think of!
1. I do have plastic wheels and I have enlisted my 4yo to inspect and place all cars with plastic wheels in the yard. They will be out of service problem is fixed
2. Now that I recall, on my last layout I did apply the polish. I did not like that it left white residue on ballast, so I haven't brought the bottle out. So may be a gleam is in order?
3. It's multiple engines. I have an Athenian Genesis SD70 (12 wheel pickup) which was so amazingly reliable and now it does hiccup every once in a while. Still my best runner though. I have another Genesis MP15, the best slow speed runner and I loved it. Went through switches well. Now unusable. I opened this one, and there were no visible fiberes inside, I was looking for them. I have a Athearn RTR P42 ... 8 wheel pickup was very reliable after I re-wired it and added a Tsunami. Now unusable. This is after multiple cleanings with the kitchen towel/alcohol method.
4. The dirt is very black. on engine wheels as well as left on paper when cleaning tracks.
5. Sometimes there appears to be a brownish/clear film on the track. I can take it off with an eraser and the track works fine For a while.
6. Feeders could be an issue in a couple places I think spray paint gets into track joiners and reduces conductivity ... but is not a root cause. I have a fully detected design so every block is it's own.
7. Switches are more problematic, but some straight sections of track are a problem too.
8. I am wondering (new theory) if this is at least in part not a contact problem but a glitch in the power system. A while back a few people (RR Mel, Randy) advised against shared power supplies for multiple components even if the power capacity was enough. I still have that D.C. bus design, and I wonder if my BDL168 is glitchy. I wonder how I could test this.
Hope I answered everyone's questions as they were trying to help. I am very much appreciative of your thoughts!
OK! Voltmeter and Ohmmeter time.
I have discovered one place which needs fixing right away ... switch blades on tracks that are painted are intermittent. Even though I had masked the points and the pivots, obviously something got in there either painting or ballasting.