Hi all, Ive watched MRVP and other videos on how to lay cork roadbed and track. Do you use Wood glue or DAP cauking to secure the roadbed? How about the track? Nails, DAP, Ballast?
Gary
Cork = old days Elmers glue and T-pins to hold it down, now I intend to use caulk. Glue takes longer to dry but is probably cheaper, so the advantage to caulk is slight.
Track = caulk held down by push pins until it drys. There is no need to use unrealistic track nails now.
Ballast diluted Elmers/alcohol spray,tho's some people say diluted matt medium is less noisy
The is no need to rush the ballast. Make sure you track is reliable before you start on that.
Henry
COB Potomac & Northern
Shenandoah Valley
Thanks Henry. Interesting about the Matt Medium. I'm creating a new yard and don't want to use track nails So thanks for the post.
I used sheet cork, from AC Moore, for my yard instead of roadbed cork. With caulk, it is hard to spread in a way that 100% covers a large flat area. Maybe some water would have thinned it, I didn't think of that at the time.
I used caulk because I saw a you tube video of a guy who used white glue and the glue seeped through the top of the cork onto the objects he used to weight the cork down. For a broad area, maybe contact cement would be a decent choice too. Anyway I had bubbles, spongy areas where there was no caulk under the cork. I had access to syringes and needles and injected those "bubbles" with dilute white glue. The glue does in fact ooze to the top surface of the cork. A little wax paper prevented major stickage and I have no spongy areas now.
I mostly use nails (small brads) for the cork, adhesive caulk for the track.
I find it easier to make the cork follow the pencil center lines when using nails, particularly on curves. I have used caulk for cork and it works, but I think I have more control with nails.
I do use strategic pins for track when using caulk. Track is pressed into the caulk with a small roller meant for wall paper. The pins can be removed as soon as the caulk sets
Dave Nelson
I use tacks for the cork and track. Like these.
For me, it's much easier to do the curves.
I use Homasote roadbed, but I glue it down with wood glue. Track is held down with caulk.
I have the right to remain silent. By posting here I have given up that right and accept that anything I say can and will be used as evidence to critique me.
On the main part of the layout, the cork was glued to 3/4" plywood subroadbed using yellow carpenter's glue - held in place until glue dried using 2½" nails tapped in about 1/4"...I had a 50lb. box of them left over after building the house. The nails were pulled out, by hand, the next day. Atlas flex track put down with track nails.On the partial upper level, the cork was put down using gelled contact cement. Where Atlas flex track was used, track nails hold it in place - I use pliers to push them in rather than a hammer. In some areas, I used Central Valley tie strips, and cemented it to the cork using contact cement. This was also used where the tie strip was layed directly atop the plywood tabletop. I used the contact cement to add the rails, too, and it seems to work well.
For positioning the cork, track or tie strips, and the rail using contact cement, I apply it to both surfaces and allow it to dry as per the instructions on the can, then lay waxed paper atop the fixed surface - simply tear short lengths of it from the roll, and overlap each over the previously-placed one. This allows you to see centrelines when laying cork, track, or tie strips, and allows proper alignment of the rail when adding it to the tie strips. When the starting-end of the material you're laying is properly aligned, simply slip the first piece of waxed paper from beneath it and press down to make contact, then follow along aligning and removing the waxed paper as you proceed. The waxed paper is reuseable an infinite number of times.For ballast, I use lots of wet water and white glue - cheap, easy, and very effective. I've also used matte medium in some areas and it's no quieter and is much more expensive. If you later need to move or remove ballasted track, the white glue can be readily re-softened using a liberal application of wet water. That ballast will be garbage, but the track can be cleaned and re-used.
Wayne
I use disposable brushes to apply water-based contact cement to the bottom of the cork. Apply per directions is very important to using this stuff, but it works well, can often be peeled up cleanly when you do want to move something later, and is much less stinky and dangerous than the solvent-based stuff.
Applying sufficient pressure is important to making it stick. I use a 6" wide laminate roller to put the pressure on.
Mike Lehman
Urbana, IL
I spread caulk with a putty knife, then hold it in place with a staple gun. If I need to take it up, I use the edge of a putty knife. When the caulk sets, I sand the top of the cork with a palm sander after removing the staples.
For track, I use the same method, only I use a length of 2x4 clamped along the length.
Marlon
See pictures of the Clinton-Golden Valley RR
Atlas track nails for both cork and track.
Mike
Water Level Route Atlas track nails for both cork and track.
ditto
Joe Staten Island West
In the old days - the track nails. Now, caulk. Faster and easier. And still easy to take up if you don't like something and want to redo it. Push pins secure it, in a few hours it is set well enough to start taking out the pins. For the track I will typically put 4 pins at the very end, one to either side of each rail, which keeps the free end from moving as I attach the next section.
I was using clear for everything - it comes out white but dries clear, so you can easily tell when it has set up (under the track anyway). I may use a grey for the track next time, so any ballast bare spots don't show. Trick is to spread it VERY thin - the marks on the nozzle of the caulk tube make for openings FAR too big - find for running a bead around a window frame, but way too much for model railroad use. Cut just the very tip off to get a very thin line of caulk. Spread it thin. If you've drawn pencil lines for the centers to line up the cork - you should be able to easily read the pencil lines, it takes very little. My previous layout, ONE tube of caulk did all the track and roadbed on a 13x10 around the walls layout.
--Randy
Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's
Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.
I use foam road bed and adhesive caulk for adhering both the roadbed and the track. A bead along the center line then an old credit card to spread it out, and then lay some scrap 1 X 4's and bricks on the 1 X 4's for weight and leave eerything alone for a day. The roadbed and the track are laid separately.
Bear "It's all about having fun."
joe323 Water Level Route Atlas track nails for both cork and track. ditto
DITTO DITTO
rrinker In the old days - the track nails. Now, caulk. Faster and easier.
In the old days - the track nails. Now, caulk. Faster and easier.
If I can put an Atlas track nail in instantly to fasten cork down, how can caulk be faster than instant, which has to cure/dry?
The old days are still here and nothing wrong with them. Caulk has been around a long time so why wasn't it used in the old days, whatever "old" means?
I lay track on a center-line which I draw - and if I put the nail dead on the line, it seems more accurate than having to eyeball where the track is to go, especially if caulk is obscuring it - unless you use translucent caulk.
I have never seen the advantage of adhesives to lay track and cork - you have to wait. I am impatient and I'd rather not wait. If I don't like something or need to pull up, I can pull the nails out with needle nose plyers and relay. Again, no waiting.
If anyone objects to the nail head on the ties, no problem. After I have applied the ballast and secured it with a dilute glue or matt medium, I can pull them out.
Some may complain, hey, I bend a few nails. *shrugs* not a big deal to me - I toss it and move on. Still faster - plain and simple.
I can't see the advantage of adhesive; I mean, after it has cured, you site down the rail and see, oh, it dried crooked, funs over. With nails, often all I need to do is push the rail a little one way or the other and it will hold in that position. Again, ballast plus adhesive will hold it permanantly after I am completely satisfied.
Rio Grande. The Action Road - Focus 1977-1983
My table tops are foam, so every thing, track,building, roads ect. is held in place with caulk
Yes, with foam, it is going to limit you to adhesives because nails won't hold that securely to foam. If you plywood or OSB or Homasote, nails work quite well.
riogrande5761I am impatient and I'd rather not wait. If I don't like something or need to pull up, I can pull the nails out with needle nose plyers and relay. Again, no waiting.
Maybe if you were more patient you wouldn't need to pull it up?
There's no wait - you just keep right on chugging along. By the time you've put down a significant amount of roadbed, the first sections are now set enough to pull the pins and do the track on top of it. And by that time, you've exhausted your spare tiem for the evening so having to wait until the next day to continue is no bother.
ON my old old layout, the 8x12 donut hole one, I ran one of the loops in about an hour, although I was using WS foam roadbed in the rolls for that so basically it was about 3 boxes laid in continuous succession. I didn't notch in for the diverging route of turnouts until the next session - just cut out a notch in the roadbed and pulled it off. Then it was a little more tedious as I fit in all the turnouts before finishing the second loop. Once the turnouts were in place, I filled in the empty space using the long rolls again. As I had the track lines marked, I didn;t even precut anything, I just ran a bead of caulk from oen turnout to the next, started at oen and and stuck the roadbed in place, and when I got to the enxt turnout, laid it down to cut where neded and then pressed it into place. There is no doubt in my mind at all tha tthis is faster than nailing. Even with regular cork. Plus no bouncing materials all over the benchwork while hammering on it. Ditto with the track, maybe even more because you need to be more careful hammering a nail in to track, you really need a nail set to get it below the rail top but not hammer it in hard enough to bend or break the tie. Pulling them out isn't always sucessful, either. I can just slide a putty knife under my track and bring it up undamaged. I suppose I shoudl slavge the track off my old layout even if it's all Atlas flex and I am using Peco on the new layout. At least I should salvage and sell all the turnouts, Atlas Code 83 #4s complete with a wire already soldered on for the frog power.
well i march to the beat of a different drummer , for road bed cork i use 1&1/4 inch radiator cork it has contact glue on both sides , on curves just slit it to bend . for yards use sheet cork sprayed with rattel can glue on both sides .
riogrande5761The old days are still here and nothing wrong with them. Caulk has been around a long time so why wasn't it used in the old days, whatever "old" means?
I'm pretty sure the answer to this is that old school caulk was a pretty different product than the siliconized caulk that people typically use nowadays. The old stuff was often oil based and never really set up. It dried out instead, but only over a period of years. The siliconized caulk that's now used sets up quickly, mostly by reacting with air IIRC, but I am not a caulk chemist.
It's true that track nails give instant gratification -- or, if you're like me, pain in the fingers and maybe some bent track.
riogrande5761 Yes, with foam, it is going to limit you to adhesives because nails won't hold that securely to foam. If you plywood or OSB or Homasote, nails work quite well.
Possibly my layout is built on Homosote.
Roadbed - contact cement.
Track - latex liquid nails. I lightly sand the bottom of the ties for better adhesion.
At rail joints I use a few Micro Mark track nails (the horror!) for peace of mind.
Latex caulk and a putty knife for me for both laying track and cork.
Years ago I used a staple gun to lay the cork , but on my current layout i found the latex caulk to be far easier and quicker. I would lay a lot of cork in no time time at all. I did wait for the next day before I sanded the cork with a palm sander. ( that also went fast )
Track laying was only slowed by my soldering of feeders to the bottom of the rail before I laid each section of track. I do not solder rail joiners. and I don't rely on rail joiners to conduct electricity.
And another idea that I saw someone else use was sliding the rail joiner over the top of the rail to join sections of track and after the caulk dries , remove the rail joiner and use again in a different spot. I want to try that sometime so I don't have any unsightly rail joiners.
Craig
CraigNAnd another idea that I saw someone else use was sliding the rail joiner over the top of the rail to join sections of track and after the caulk dries , remove the rail joiner and use again in a different spot. I want to try that sometime so I don't have any unsightly rail joiners.
carl425 riogrande5761 I am impatient and I'd rather not wait. If I don't like something or need to pull up, I can pull the nails out with needle nose plyers and relay. Again, no waiting. Maybe if you were more patient you wouldn't need to pull it up?
riogrande5761 I am impatient and I'd rather not wait. If I don't like something or need to pull up, I can pull the nails out with needle nose plyers and relay. Again, no waiting.
Are you enjoying yourself there?
No it takes long enough to build a layout. Why wait for adhesives to cure when you dont have to.
Randy. So you can slap your track down and run trains on it right away while the caulk is drying and it wont shift or move? That stuff must be like contact cement. Anyway, I still like the way Atlas track nails and ME spikes work. I'm getting old and sruck in my ways.
Pretty much - I often run a train over new track to test it - but the pins are also still in holding it. I don;t use those big T head pins, the ones I use easily clear except those held up against the inside of the railhead where the flange runs. With the thin layer I spread out with a putty knife, it is somewhat tacky like contact cement, probably because in that thin a layer the surface at least starts to set almost instantly. The track tacks down but you cna still nudge it with a straight edge for straight sections or run one of those various curve gauges through to line up a curve - I have some of the Ribbonrail ones.
I am old and stuck in My ways...LOL. Started with brass code 100 and fiber ties hand laid with hundreds of spikes on cork roadbed and Tru-Scale plain milled roadbed for the curves. You could buy at the time milled roadbed for just about any size radius curve and the end result was a true curve. Used tiny finishing nails for that. Wish I could have afforded the ready made Tru-Scale track already ballasted...was the cats meow, for the time. I still use track spikes ME 3/8 in the pre-drilled holes in Atlas flex track, on Homasote and the ballast/cement does the rest.
Take Care!
Frank
I glue the cork roadbed down with wood glue.
I use track nails for the track. I predrill the hole slightly smaller than the nail. I then can gently tap the track nail with a hobby hammer and nail set. This allows me to set the nail snug without distorting the track. I also don't bend any nails, but that's secondary. Since the ties are very dark, the black nail head is virtually invisible - to the point that I have trouble finding them all if I have to remove the track.
Paul