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Starting Benchwork on new Layout....Terrified!!! Yikes!

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Starting Benchwork on new Layout....Terrified!!! Yikes!
Posted by Regg05 on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 12:33 PM

Okay so I'm finally ready to start on the new layout that I posted on about 6-8 months ago.  I figure I can save some money by trying to do the benchwork myself.  Problem is I've never built anything before and don't know really where to begin.  I bought a few magazines from kalmbach on model railroad planning, benchwork, etc. But the problem I see with these magazines is they assume you have everything or have had some experience when I have neither.  Not sure of what other tools I exactly need???  I just bought a saber saw, have a hammer, vice-grip pliers, level, yard stick, and some basic nails/screws.  That's about the gist of it. 

I admit the last layout I bought salvaged from someone who was practically getting out the hobby but the layout had many problems.  This time I want to be sure to start off on the good foot. 

I have questions such as should I buy 1/2 inch plywood or 1'' plywood.  What are the differences?  Should I buy foam as my base roadbed or cork since it looks aesthetically better? 

Layout will be 7x12.  Never was good in fractions so all the measuerment stuff confuses me when these magazines use them.

Regg

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Posted by wickman on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 1:16 PM

Regg05

Okay so I'm finally ready to start on the new layout that I posted on about 6-8 months ago.  I figure I can save some money by trying to do the benchwork myself.  Problem is I've never built anything before and don't know really where to begin.  I bought a few magazines from kalmbach on model railroad planning, benchwork, etc. But the problem I see with these magazines is they assume you have everything or have had some experience when I have neither.  Not sure of what other tools I exactly need???  I just bought a saber saw, have a hammer, vice-grip pliers, level, yard stick, and some basic nails/screws.  That's about the gist of it. 

I admit the last layout I bought salvaged from someone who was practically getting out the hobby but the layout had many problems.  This time I want to be sure to start off on the good foot. 

I have questions such as should I buy 1/2 inch plywood or 1'' plywood.  What are the differences?  Should I buy foam as my base roadbed or cork since it looks aesthetically better? 

Layout will be 7x12.  Never was good in fractions so all the measuerment stuff confuses me when these magazines use them.

Regg

 

Some very good questions.

First off you need to post your layout plan so the best suggestions for  the type of benchwork can be made, for instance if its going to be totally scenic layout you would probably want to go with an L girder or open bench work and use risers to hold the roadbed up. For subroadbed I would suggest 3/4 inch plywood if you go with risers. For the roadbed I would suggest cork and flex track for rail. 7x12 is a descent sized first layout. Should be fun.

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Posted by selector on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 1:20 PM

The thinner the plywood, the more work you'll need to support it at closer intervals.  However, it also depends...there's plywood and then there's plywood.  I use cheap siding quality, but I'm covering it all and I don't mind a lot of measuring, cutting, and screwing to place supports, blocking, and risers so that the thinner/cheaper quality stuff I use doesn't sag where it shouldn't...or can't.

Many here want no problems of any kind if they can avoid it, and that means not going cheap.  They'll pay, but they get good quality stuff they know will 'wear well'.  They use at least G1S (good on one side) plywood at least 5/8" thick, which I found to be nice and robust on my first layout.  Or, many do spend more and get 3/4" plywood.  Some get cabinet grade. 

In your case, you aren't terribly 'handy'?  I'm guessing?  So, if you have the money, you might want to have the stronger 3/4" working to support your tracks.

BTW, you might make use of a chop saw or radial/miter saw.  The decent ones are spendy, so there's another $250+...on sale.  They can be used to cut risers and blocks, the kind I use to block in my legs.  I use 1X2 spruce for my legs and brace them with the same material using diagonals.  A chop saw, or a miter-radial allows you to cut to length, but also to fashion angled joists.

-Crandell

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Posted by rrinker on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 1:41 PM

 ABout the only other tool you didn;t list would be a square so you can mark your cut spots with lines that are square instead of at angles, so it all fits together better. A cordless drill with both drills and screwdriver bits makes things a lot easier - you always want to pre-drill screw holes so the wood doesn't split.

 The key thing to remember is that lumber sizes are not the exact measurements of thwe wood. It's the pre-drying size. So a 1x4 piece of wood is not 1 inch x 4 inches. It's 3/4 of an inch by 3 1/2 inches. Where this most messes people up is making the outside frames. If you want it to measure 7 feet on the OUTSIDE, and you are using 1x lumber, you'd think you'd need to cut the cross piece to 7 feet minus the 2 inches - but that would be too short, because the side rails are only 3/4 of an inch thick. So if you have it liek this:

||======||  

the cross piece, the ==== part, has to be 7 feet - 3/4" -3/4" or 84" - 1 1/2", 82 1/2"

in order to make the measurement from the left || to the right || to be exactly 7 feet.

This is probably the hardest concept to grasp in beginnign woodworking. Once you grasp the concept that dimensional limber (like 1x4's, 2x2's, etc) are actually smaller than the sizes they are known by, you'll be well on your way. The offset between name and actual measurement is always the same, so you don;t have to memorize a whole bunch of measurements. And you can always take that tape measure and check the actual piece. 

Now sheet goods, like a sheet of plywood, ARE the sizes given - a 4x8 sheet of plywood does measure 4 feet by 8 feet, not something less.

Thickness choice is not so cut and dried. Most will say that 1/2" plywood will tend to sag unless you put a lot more cross supports in so there aren't large unsupported spaces. It's been a long time sicne I built a layout with plywood, and plywood, like all wood, has definitely gone down in quality. 1" plywood is probably overkill - and also VERY heavy. Most seem to use 3/4" and a good medium between weight and strength.

Foam? anotehr choice. My last two layouts were built with foam. There are pros and cons to foam as well as plywood. Foam is not always readily available in certain places, usually the warmer parts of the country. Here, both big box stores always stock it in 1/2", 1", and 2" thicknesses, but almost always in the 2x8 size. Other palces they can get 4x8 sheets of the stuff.

You have a size in mind, do you have a plan? You'll need a supporting frame no matter what - but also there is a trend these days from making the 1x4s out of plywood by ripping the plywood sheets into strips - this usually works out cheaper than decent quality 1x4s but you either need to have the lumber yard cut up the plywood or have the ability to do this at home - either a table saw (and extension table, especially if working alone - a sheet of plywood is HEAVY) or a circular saw and a long straightedge to use as a guide.

When it comes time for the top - there are lots of ways to do this. You can do a flat top with foam or plywood if you have no grades, or use things like the Woodland Scenics inclines and risers for grades. Or you can use your saber saw on the plywood and make what's called cookie cutter benchwork - cut out along the width of the track (plus extra for lineside details) and raise parts up to make grades. if you have access, check the videos on the building of the Virginian project layout on MR Video Plus, they used cookie cutter design for that layout.

 Lots to think about, lots to plan. At least half the fun's in the building though.

                  --Randy 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by jjdamnit on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 2:21 PM

Hello,

First of all congratulations!

You’ve got some great questions and valid concerns.

Your first step is to determine what will physically support your layout (pike).

The supports for my first pike were sawhorses built by my dad (I was about 8). There were four of them supporting a 4x8 sheet of 1-inch plywood. You can buy pre-made sawhorses or brackets that you provide the lumber, cut to length and fasten them to the brackets by nails or screws to fit your needs.

My current pike literally sits on the bed in the computer/spare beedroom/train room. It’s a 4x8 piece of ¾” medium density fiberboard with 1-inch insulating foam attached with screws and washers. I added a 2-1/2” border of thin plywood to add rigidity to the platform.

Then I build the scenic features with Styrofoam; track grades, hills, tunnels etc. Because the foam overlay is 1-inch thick I carve channels into the foam and run the wiring through flex tubing so when I scenic the wires aren’t perminently buried.

Most folks build what is referred to as bench work to support their pike. You said you’ve done some research on this. Think of the legs of a table supporting the table top.

As far as the thickness of plywood think of it as a sheet of paper versus a piece of cardboard or a plank of wood. A sheet of paper can support a given load but you need more supports; vertical or horizontal. A piece of cardboard can support the same given load with fewer supports. A plank of wood needs fewer supports than the cardboard to support the same load.

The thinner the plywood the more vertical or horizontal supports needed to prevent sagging under a given load. However the thicker the material the heavier it will be. Just like the paper vs. cardboard vs. wood scenario some areas of your pike will be better suited to thinner plywood or even cardboard over thicker material.

The late, great John Allen (Google him) espoused the use of open frame versus table top construction. What that means in English is, rather than having a single sheet of material supporting all your scenic features he cut out curves and straights from plywood and assembled them more like a roller coaster, then connected the roadbeds with various methods of scenic construction; chicken wire, paper maché, plaster of Paris etc. The disadvantage of this construction method is you need a lot of bench work to support the pike. The advantage is you need less material give the same square footage and it tends to be lighter.

Most modern modelers use a combination of both methods (see the thread “When do I add the bridges.”) Great stuff!

You mentioned your tools. Here’s where you can spend more on the items to build your pike over what you spend on what’s actually running on your pike.

By saber saw I’m assuming you mean a powered jig or scroll saw. Good start!

Power tools always make the work go faster.

Corded vs. cordless? Corded power tools can be cheaper but when you get into building your pike you’ll find that cordless are easier to work with.

I recommend the buy as you need method. Start with some basic power tools: a drill and the saber or jig saw you have. Then upgrade as necessary or budget permits. You’ll find that there are specialty tools that make the job possible and then there are crossover tools that you’ll discover on your own. That’s part of the fun/challenge of modeling You’ll soon figure out what you need to make the tasks at hand easier.

I have several carpenters squares. Ranging from a roofers framing square, all the way up to a drywall square. I recommend a good carpenters square and a framing square. Because you’ll be modeling in scale I recommend not only traditional rulers or measuring tapes but also a scale ruler. Microscale makes a great one.

Unfortunately here in the U.S. we go by the standard measuring system. It can be confusing. However, there are lots of charts available that will help you to negotiate this. The more you use this the better you will become. 

A caliper; you can purchase a great one from Harbor Freight And Tools, a Pittsburg brand for less than $30.00. This unit is digital and switches between metric, standard decimal and standard fractional! I can’t tell you how many times this tool has helped me.

As for roadbed I went with foam over cork. Cork can dry out over time and degrade. Also, cork needs to be presoaked to make pliable around curves. To adhere the roadbed to what ever surface you’ve chosen I’ve used Silicone caulk. It adheres well and if you need to readjust you just pull up the roadbed, peel the silicone and begin again.

Lastly, join the National Model Railroad Association (nmra.org). Their magazine is worth the annual dues alone. They also have a wealth of info including current and archived articles that will help you along this path.

Whew!!!

I hope this helps and please let us know how your progress goes.

 

"Uhh...I didn’t know it was 'impossible' I just made it work...sorry"

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Posted by Regg05 on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 2:22 PM

I can't remember how to upload the layout which is in my google docs under PDF format to this site.  But in one of my earlier threads from last year I had posted the layout pics with numerous responses. 

But yes I thought about the L shaped benchwork and definitely want something portable even though it will be in my garage off to one side.  I live in Chicago so need the other half of the garage.  Also thought about making the legs fold in and/or having them on casters/wheels for ease of work maintenance. 

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Posted by mlehman on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 3:23 PM

Mike Lehman

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Posted by dknelson on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 3:57 PM

I used 1/2 inch plywood because at the time I built my benchwork I lucked onto a source of fairly inexpensive pine 1"x4" lumber so I could afford to be fairly lavish with supports.  Also I did not buy my plywood in 4'x8' sheets but rather in 2'x4' "handi-panels" they sold in the big box home supply store: not only could I fit them in my then-car (a sedan) which I could not do with the larger sheet, but the big box store stored the handi panels indoors and dead flat, so they were and remain utterly unwarped and flat as flat can be.  By contrast 4x8s were stored outside under cover and supported by timbers so they had a natural warp built in.  Also most of my lumber and plywood were stored in my basement for nearly a full year before construction began so they had a chance to acclimate.

my layout follows the David Barrow "domino" approach so every segment is 2'x4' bolted together.  It involves more lumber and certainly more legs than a more conventional table top method, and more than an L girder type support, but it has the advantages that I was able to build my benchwork BEFORE finalizing my track plan.  Moreover I could move the domino pieces around the basement and try out different arrangements and corners before starting the planning.   The benchwork in a sense dictates the layout or trackplan in other words.

All my cuts were with a very high quality old crosscut hand saw that probably belonged to my great grandfather.  I learned from my industrial arts teacher how to cut a straight line and clean angle with such saws decades ago although I do not deny that a power saw would have saved a great deal of time.  Power tools were limited to an electric drill and an electric screwdriver.

Dave Nelson

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Posted by BroadwayLion on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 4:45 PM

Well, Given the descriptions of your tools, it is clear you did not take a basic industrial arts class in high school.

Lets back up or discussion a little bit. What room will you put the railroad in and how much space will it take up.

Second, what room or space will you put your workshop in. 

Third, how much dust are you willing to put up with

and Fourth how much will you spend on tools.

A saber saw is nice, but it is difficult to cut a straight line with thsat. But if you make a fence out of a piece of wood and a pair of clamps it is quite sufficient.  LION says you need a variable speed drill, and use drywall screws  to hold things together. Thes have a philips head and you can put a phillips bit in your drill to drive the screws in place. A good drill ought not put you back out more than $60 (with a bunch of bits.)

But you need to decide HOW you will build a layout.

Layout of LION uses many different kinds of construction. Him built on tables, on open framework tables, and on brackets mounted on the wall.

LION suggest to you to just build a 4x8 table and lay your tracks flat. Later on you can get more ambitious and build grades and cookie cutter deckwork.

LION has access to a carpentry shop with all kinds of power tools albeit two buildings away and two floors below the train room. Still, the dust does not follow me above.

 LION has lots of hand tools too, you need a nice clean place to work...

 

ROAR

The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.

Here there be cats.                                LIONS with CAMERAS

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Posted by richhotrain on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 5:13 PM

You sure don't need 1" plywood.  Even 3/4" plywood is overkill.

Just use 1/2" plywood, but make sure that one side is "finish grade" so that you have a smooth layout surface.

If you have a little extra space, make the layout 8x12 instead of 7x12.  That way, you can use three 4x8 sheets of plywood without having to make cuts.

As far as supports go, I use 2x4's for the framing and legs. You can get 12 foot 2x4's for the long side supports and 8 foot 2x4s for the short side supports.  If you go with an 8x12 layout, the short side will only be 7'9" (93 inches) since the short sides should be placed inside the long sides when framing.  

Don't forget that a 2x4 is actually 1 1/2" x 3 1/2".  So the frame for an 8x12 layout will actually require two 144" 2x4s and two 93" 2x4s.  To prevent plywood sag, add a couple of extra 93" 2x4s at 4' intervals when building the support frame. I use 2 1/2" drywall screws to hold the frame together.

Use 3/4" drywall screws to fasten the plywood to the frame.  I drill pilot holes to make it easier to screw in the drywall screws.

If you use 2x4's for legs, you can get 6' lengths and cut them in half so you will have 36" long legs, a nice height for a 8x12 layout for reaching in purposes.

Just some thoughts based on my personal experience.

Rich

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Posted by Doughless on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 5:41 PM

RichHo had a great suggestion.  Use 3 4x8 pieces of plywood and avoiding cutting those at all.  4X8 plywood is a pain to cut straight even if you have the right saw.

Or, have the home store make the cuts for you.  It looks like your layout will have straight edges, so after you figure out the shape of the pieces, they should be able to make the cuts for you, at about one dollar a cut.

Then, you'll just need to focus on measuring and cutting the sticks for the support and the legs.  Its a lot easier to cut them.

- Douglas

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Posted by rrinker on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 5:49 PM

 My now defunct previous layout was built in sort of 2x4 sections, to make it moveable when I moved. Though in reality, they ended up as 2x8 sections, since when I laid the foam sheets on top I did not cut them into 4 foot lengths. That was tough to transport, but I didn;t have far to go so a couple of feet sticking out the window was ok - especially since the highest speed limit on the way home from the local HD was 35mph. The stick wood - the 1x4 and 1x3's for the frames, I bought in 4 foot lengths so they were easy to carry, hence the section sizes. When I took it apart to move, I left in in the 8 foot long pieces - which since the widest were only 2 feet wide, easily fit through doors and down the 2 flights of stairs to the door (the legs came off too).

 The layout before that (down the bottom of my web site), since at the time I had a larger vehicle to carry lumber in, was all 8 foot long sections. Four of them, 2x8, arranged to make an 8x12 donut shaped layout. It could have been operated entirely from the middle - so if your actual space is 8x12 but you were building smaller so you could walk around the outside, consider a donut instead.

                     --Randy

 


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by CGW121 on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 7:03 PM
Chicago city or burbs? I live in the burbs if you are fairly close I am willing to help
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Posted by skagitrailbird on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 7:22 PM

For tools a cordless drill is essential.  12 volts is probably strong enough but larger works, too, as long as you don't mind handling the larger weight.  Get a kit with a charger and two batteries.  If you only have one battery I guaranty it will go dead when you can least afford to stop what you are doing. Also get one of the gizmos that has a dreill with integral countersink on one end and a screw driver tip in the other.  That way you can drill the pilot hole, flip the gizmo around and drive the screw.  (I eventually went to two drills but that is not necessary.  I found mine very cheap.) As suggested earlier, drywall screws work well and that is what I am using.  But if I had it to do over again I would probably use self tapping deck screws that come with a six pointed star driver tip to fit the screw heads.  Much more solid mating of the driver and screw virtually eliminating the spinning screw drover reaming our the Phillips head screw head. But while they are billed as self tapping I would still drill pilot holes.

If you are going to build L girder benchwork, then a power mitre say (aka chop saw) is extremely useful.  And for a beginner there are many priced well under $250.  Go the Sears web site, search for "mitre saw" and then click where you get to see them listed by price from low to high.  There are several in the $100 to $150 or $175 price range that are probably quite suitable for what you are going to be doing.

Good luck!

Roger Johnson
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Posted by rrinker on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 7:44 PM

 If you get one these dayas, get one with a Lithium Ion battery. My old faithful DeWalt 18V one is VERY heavy, but it's also tough, could probbaly drop it off a roof and it would still work, definitely more than the typical homeowner needs, this is a contractor grade tool. But did I mention, it's heavy, and gets tiring after a while. But luckily the battery doesn;t last long between charges, so you are forced to take a break - long enough to swap batteries (I have 2). A new Li-Ion one with equivalent power is probably half the weight, AND the battery lasts at least twice as long. Before I resume construction (still a ways off - need to gut and redo the basement) I am planning to buy a second one. If only because by having 2, I can have the drill bit in one and the screwdriver bit in the other and work faster. Though now that I have an air compressor, I'm seriously thinking of using an air nailer and glue to build benchwork.

                 --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by CTValleyRR on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 9:27 PM

Hi, Regg,

I agree with most of the other folks here that your tool crib is understocked with essentials.  As someone else pointed out, that sabre saw is a useful tool, but not for this application.  Go invest in a mitre saw.  Get a brand name at your local home improvement store.  Ryobi, Skil, Craftsman, Dewalt, Makita, Bosch, Kobalt are all brands that will fill the bill but not break the bank.  You're not making fine cabinetry, so you don't need perfection, but the ability to make a reasonably straight or angled cut in just a few seconds will save you a lot of trouble.

Lose the hammer, too.  It has its place, but this isn't it.  Get a cordless drill / screwdriver, as recommended by others, and a charger with two batteries.  Lithium ion is state of the art, but NiCad might be much cheaper.  Any of the brands above, or Rigid, will do fine.  All else being equal, get a lighter and smaller model.  If you don't have a set of bits, get one of those, too.

If you want portable, L-girder joists with foam on top is the lightest.  If you do decide to use plywood, 1/2" is fine.  I'd still use a sheet of foam on top, to give you a flat surface and allow you to carve terrain features without messing with so-called cookie cutter table tops.  As others have said, cutting plywood isn't easy, even with the right tools, so have the lumber yard cut yours.

If you want to be able to move your benchwork, assemble it with carriage bolts and wing nuts.  Otherwise, I would glue and screw all fastenings for maximum strength and stability.

Finally, if you can find a buddy with better woodworking skills (and maybe tools) who is willing to help, ask nicely and bribe with pizza and beer (afterwards -- alcohol and power tools don't mix).

If you 

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Posted by Regg05 on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 10:28 PM

Ok so my question now is should I take the saber saw I bought back.  I purchased it a few weeks ago so I can still take it back for something else if that would work better and more efficient.  I'm more worried about cutting my fingers off more than anything lol Surprise

I've seen several drills in the $40-$100 range but held off since I wanted to see which type would be the best.  Also since working on a strict budget, trying not to over spend on anything I don't need.  

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Posted by RideOnRoad on Wednesday, October 29, 2014 10:35 PM

Last year I was in your exact shoes. I had virtually no carpentry/woodworking experience since ninth grade shop, a long, long time ago. I decided to try my hand at benchwork and built a small tabletop layout to see what I could do. I made some mistakes, but in the end, I was surprised with what I was able to accomplish. I read and re-read the Kalmbach book on benchwork, which helped significantly. For what it is worth, I documented what I did in my feeble attempt at a blog (see the link below). It is in the April entries.

Richard

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Posted by jjdamnit on Thursday, October 30, 2014 12:29 AM

Hello,

Never take a tool back- -unless it’s broken!

The minute you do you’ll find you needed it for that one unique application you didn’t know you would encounter.

As many have said, begin building your tool set. The limited tools you’ve listed still have applications in building your pike. Some more than others.

I’ve got more than six sets of tools: my electricians tools, my bike tools, my ski & snowboard tools, my railroad tools, my general home maintenance tools, my trail building tools and my chefs tools. My wife jokes that I’m the only tool she needs!?!

Some of them are multipurpose; cordless drills, circular saws, screwdrivers, chisels, hammers; claw, mallet and ball peen, multi meters, standard and metric; Allen keys, wrenches, and socket sets. Also various cutting tools from hobby knives (X-acto) to miter saws and hack saws.

As the old saying goes, “You can drive a nail with a wrench but why not use a hammer.”

I said in my previous response, go with the buy as you need method. Also try not to get into the trap of the generic tool sets. Buy what you need and save the storage space for the next item you’ll truly need.

The suggestion of make a friend with what you need is great! However, I learned early on if I needed to borrow a tool more than three times it was time to buy my own. Also, be respectful when borrowing tools. I can’t tell you how many times a co-worker would come to me to borrow a tool because they had broken their own.

This might seem daunting now, but over time you’ll find that you’ll not only have the proper tool for the proper job but you’ll also know what you don’t need.

Hope this helps.

"Uhh...I didn’t know it was 'impossible' I just made it work...sorry"

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Posted by richhotrain on Thursday, October 30, 2014 4:52 AM

Regg05

Ok so my question now is should I take the saber saw I bought back.  I purchased it a few weeks ago so I can still take it back for something else if that would work better and more efficient.  I'm more worried about cutting my fingers off more than anything lol Surprise

I've seen several drills in the $40-$100 range but held off since I wanted to see which type would be the best.  Also since working on a strict budget, trying not to over spend on anything I don't need.  

 

You could consider returning the saber saw and replacing it with a circular saw.

A saber saw, also called a jig saw, is a slow moving, slow cutting tool that is not well suited to cutting plywood and 2x4s.  If you tried to cut a 4' length of 1/2" plywood with a saber saw, it would take all day and night to complete the task. OK, so I exaggerate, but it would take considerable time compared to a circular saw.

Rich

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Posted by CGW121 on Thursday, October 30, 2014 6:46 AM

I have had several cordless drills over the years, and 1 corded drill. The cordless drills sit idle while I use my Skill 3/8 drill constantly, Cordless drills are for when you are not near a power source, since you are close to a power source get a plug in drill, they are less expensive  and will always work when you need them. I have worked buildiing furniture and remodeling houses for a long time. Batteries will crap out at the most inoppertune time.

 

  • Member since
    December 2008
  • From: Heart of Georgia
  • 5,402 posts
Posted by Doughless on Thursday, October 30, 2014 6:48 AM

Regg05

Ok so my question now is should I take the saber saw I bought back.  I purchased it a few weeks ago so I can still take it back for something else if that would work better and more efficient.  I'm more worried about cutting my fingers off more than anything lol Surprise

I've seen several drills in the $40-$100 range but held off since I wanted to see which type would be the best.  Also since working on a strict budget, trying not to over spend on anything I don't need.  

 

A power mitre saw can be had for about $100.  They are great for cutting 1x and 2x sticks at perfectly consistent angles.  They are easy to work with. I also replaced and added wood mouldings to our dining room, sort of chair rail and squares, and it was great for that application too.  I never use the sabre saw or circular saw any more.

Plywood sheets are difficult to handle by yourself and to haul in a vehicle.  That's another reason why I would have the home-store cut the sheets down for you.  Once you have your plywood cut, you'll basically need a saw just for cutting the 1x sticks.  I would definitely have a power mitre saw for making all of those cuts. 

If you have never used one, you first press the handle on to get the blade rotating, then press the rotating blade onto the board.  Your fingers are really nowhere near the moving blade. 

- Douglas

  • Member since
    September 2004
  • From: Dearborn Station
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Posted by richhotrain on Thursday, October 30, 2014 6:49 AM

CGW121

Batteries will crap out at the most inoppertune time.

 

 

i.e, when you most need them.   Laugh

Rich

Alton Junction

  • Member since
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  • From: Dearborn Station
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Posted by richhotrain on Thursday, October 30, 2014 6:56 AM

Doughless

A power mitre saw can be had for about $100.  They are great for cutting 1x and 2x sticks at perfectly consistent angles.  They are easy to work with. I also replaced and added wood mouldings to our dining room, sort of chair rail and squares, and it was great for that application too.  I never use the sabre saw or circular saw any more.

If you have never used one, you first press the handle on to get the blade rotating, then press the rotating blade onto the board.  Your fingers are really nowhere near the moving blade. 

 

Although, they can be, so you really need to be careful around any power saw.

The one limitation of a power miter saw is that you can only cut small pieces of wood like 2x4s and moldings because of the configuration of the saw.  If you had the space and the budget, a double compound miter table saw is the way to go.

Rich

Alton Junction

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: Flushing,Michigan
  • 822 posts
Posted by HaroldA on Thursday, October 30, 2014 7:12 AM

Congrats on making the decision to build a RR.  It will bring you hours of enjoyment and, yes, I little frustration but in the end, it is your own work of creativity.

I would recommend a couple things.  First, buy the Kalmbach book by Linn Wescott Building Model Railroad Benchwork.  It should be available at your hobby shop or on line.  The book has many useful tables too numerous to mention here.  It is very easy to follow and has been my resource for many years.

 

Second, buy good lumber - I buy Top Choice from Lowe's.  Anything labeled Utility Grade or Seconds will only cause you problems.  Also, store your lumber flat - don't lean it against a wall. 

Third, if you don't own them, buy a chop saw, a cordless drill with an interchangeable drill bit - drill on one end, screw driver bit on the other and a cordless saber saw.   Again try Lowes as there are manufacturers that will sell some of these are a set - mine are Porter Cable.  A good quality square and other basic tools will make the job go a whole lot easier.

Then, draw a benchwork plan.  I did mine once I had the track plan done.  It saved me time and a little money since I didn't buy lumber that I didn't use.

You might say I have learned all this by experience over the years.  I just finished a major addition to my RR and all of this made everything pretty much pain free.  Good luck and let us know how things are progressing.

There's never time to do it right, but always time to do it over.....

  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: North Dakota
  • 9,592 posts
Posted by BroadwayLion on Thursday, October 30, 2014 7:17 AM

2x4s and not acceptable in railroad construction. This is copnstruction grade timber, and is never dimensionally accurate, most is twisted, cureved and warped in many dimensions.  If you want lumber in four dimensions or more, a 2x4 will do.

 

For your layout you will need to buy better lumber, and that costs a pretty penny. (Usually the gold colored ones)

1x4s are perfectly sufficient. 1x3s are also good.

Spend the money to get the better lumber, or Like the LION, him found lots of good used lumber stored in the ranch barn.

 

ROARING

The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.

Here there be cats.                                LIONS with CAMERAS

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    February 2002
  • From: Reading, PA
  • 30,002 posts
Posted by rrinker on Thursday, October 30, 2014 8:00 AM

1x3s and 1x4s are easily cut with a hand miter saw. Being in an apartment, I could't very well fire up a power saw, so i cut almost all the lumber for my benchwork by hand. I eventually got a small power miter saw to finish up some of the last bits.

 The jigsaw is actually more versatile than other options. Witht he proper blade it will cut plywood, dimensional lumber, foam, metal - you name it. Long term more useful than a circular saw. If you are only going to have one saw - the jigsaw is the one to have. You cna cut stright as well as irregular shapes - like cutting out the plywood for a lake, ir if you do try cookie cutter, cutting along those lines which in most cases will (and should) be anything but straight. Check out some of the older build a railroad books that cover the older peoject layouts that were in MR (or if you have the 75 year DVD, just read the old articles). Also HO Railroad That Grows. You'll see the ONLY power saw they had was a jigsaw. The only other power TOOL thay had in most of those articles is a drill. Not a nice modern cordless one that can drill AND drive screws, these were the old plug in kind good only for drilling holes. For driving in screws, they often used a Yankee screwdriver. I have a couple of those from my dad and Grandfather - as long as you aren't in a tight space they are great - definitely better than setting wood screws with an ordinary screwdriver. Still a LOT of work compared to a nice cordless drill/driver. You can still buy the Yankee-style screwdrivers - but you can buy a cordless drill/driver for less!

                 --Randy


Modeling the Reading Railroad in the 1950's

 

Visit my web site at www.readingeastpenn.com for construction updates, DCC Info, and more.

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Posted by richhotrain on Thursday, October 30, 2014 8:05 AM

I have cut a lot of plywood and Masonite board with a circular saw.  I would never attempt it with a jig saw.

Rich

Alton Junction

  • Member since
    April 2011
  • From: About 20 minutes from IRM
  • 430 posts
Posted by CGW121 on Thursday, October 30, 2014 8:10 AM

And you can buy a 3/8 variable speed reversable drill for about $30 at Lowes which I have used on a ton of remodeling projects. It drives screws wonderfully

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    March 2013
  • 450 posts
Posted by EMD.Don on Thursday, October 30, 2014 8:18 AM

I really have nothing more to add that already hasn't been mentioned. However, I may have missed this but in case it hasn't already been posted...measure twice (or three times) and cut once! Honestly, save yourself money, time, frustration, and waste by making sure your measurements are accurate BEFORE you make a cut. Pencil marks can be erased or covered over with stains/paints/scenery but messed up cut wood is darn near impossible to fix. 

Take your time and have fun! Seriously, the sense of accomplishment and site of progress will fuel your desire to continue. Success can be contagious! 

Enjoy!

"Ladies and gentlemen, I have some good news and some bad news. The bad news is that both engines have failed, and we will be stuck here for some time. The good news is that you decided to take the train and not fly."

N Scale Railroader.

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