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It's a vicious cycle

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  • Member since
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  • From: central Ohio
  • 116 posts
It's a vicious cycle
Posted by TomLutman on Wednesday, March 5, 2014 7:19 AM

I've been slowly putting together a smallish layout (10x7) and am running into problems with being realistic (literally). I started out with an area of about 20x36 with the thoughts of a grain elevator and feed mill on one spur and some cattle yards on the other. Easy enough. All 3 could realistically take a car or 2, but it seems I have giganticus layoutious syndrome, which is starting to cram it up a bit.

I've taken the feed mill (Walthers Sunrise kit) and attached it to both sides of the Prarie Star elevator. It looks pretty good IMO, but was missing something. I ended up with the Walthers grain bin, and Rix grain bin and conveyor. Alrighty, it's looking better! But it's still missing something..... I made a styrene outbuilding and picked up the Walthers wet/dry grain bins and their surge bin as well. I have 1 wet bin sitting there and it's starting to look great, but getting too busy too. Now I'm not sure if the stock yards would look right being jammed in there too. It seems that by making one industry more realistic for a railroad, I've eliminated another.

There was about 5in seperating the 2 spurs, with the grain industry on the inside of one and the stockyards being on the outide of the other, with roughly 8in between the stock track and the main line.

Is there another industry that might fit in better than the stock yard? I will try getting a pic later to show the area.

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Posted by MisterBeasley on Wednesday, March 5, 2014 7:53 AM

What era are you modeling?  Stockyards say "Transition Era" or "Steam Era," as little livestock traveled by rail after that.  One option that would fit with a feed mill would be a farm equipment dealership, which could take flatcars of era-appropriate tractors.

I have a small packing plant on my layout, with a small stockyard attached.  This lets me take stock cars in, but also reefers and old box cars of hides for the tannery going out.  Reefers, in turn, get to stop at the icing platform.

It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse. 

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Posted by ndbprr on Wednesday, March 5, 2014 10:52 AM
Lancaster PA had a stockyard into the early 60s. Nearly everywhere I travelled on business had an excellent steakhouse near the stockyards. Wouldn't generate any rail traffic but very appropriate and most were grungy on the outside but the steaks were great.
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Posted by rrebell on Wednesday, March 5, 2014 11:23 AM

I have never seen stockyards next to grain operations????????????????

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Posted by BroadwayLion on Wednesday, March 5, 2014 11:25 AM

"giganticus layoutious syndrome"....

In the world of today giganticus does not have to be all that big. Or rather, when it is done is toes not llok so big.

Witness the South West Grain Coop elevators at Gladstone ND. It began with four towers and now has 16 towers.

 

 

 

98th Avenue is a dirt road, south on it would take you via the back way into Gladstone, north on it is Old Highway 10. The road branching off to the east was built by the grain coop so that the farmer south of the tracks could get out to Old 10 via the next county road allowing 98th Avenue to be de-platted, thus trains can block it at will for as long as they like. Naturally the road is left open if grain is not being loaded into a train, but we are looking at 50 - 100 car shuttle trains and not single cars any more. It is a small operation, but big-time railroading calls here frequently.

That is the BNSF main line (nee NP) passing to the south of the terminal. It sees Coal trains, Oil Trains, Ethanol trains, Fracking Sand Trains, and other drilling requsits.

It is a busy track in what used to be a sleepy neighborhood.

ROAR

The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.

Here there be cats.                                LIONS with CAMERAS

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Posted by TomLutman on Wednesday, March 5, 2014 4:59 PM

MisterBeasley
What era are you modeling?

The transition era. It is what interests me the most. I don't mind a few of the early diesels, but they won't rule the roost.

MisterBeasley
One option that would fit with a feed mill would be a farm equipment dealership,

Guess that could be a possibility. The issues would be I have no flat-cars, but have several stock cars. On the plus side, if it was "part" of the feedmill, it would explain the close proximity to the grain bins

  • Member since
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  • From: central Ohio
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Posted by TomLutman on Wednesday, March 5, 2014 5:13 PM

BroadwayLion
we are looking at 50 - 100 car shuttle trains and not single cars any more

That would be a problem. The only way you're getting 100 car trains in there in to stack them 20 cars high. It might cause problems with the bridges. I have a stub track that can see maybe 5 cars at one time, and the other stub is the same. That's why I picked up the additional grain bins- to justify the additional cars.

  The "giganticus layoutious" refered to how I'm thinking of my "smallicus layouticus". I went from 5 industries to 4 trying to justify 1 having rail.  Now I also have to get the Walthers elevator and grain dryer. My rix elevator isn't tall enough for the wet/dry bins.

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Posted by BroadwayLion on Wednesday, March 5, 2014 5:23 PM

TomLutman
The only way you're getting 100 car trains in there in to stack them 20 cars high

The Taylor - Gladstone siding is over two miles long. That is just a little loop of it that passes under the elevators.

The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.

Here there be cats.                                LIONS with CAMERAS

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Posted by tomikawaTT on Wednesday, March 5, 2014 6:03 PM

In West Texas northeast of Clovis, NM, there are humongous (as in fill a couple of panamax grain ship) elevator-feed mills.  Immediately adjacent are feed lots the size of New England counties (and manure piles the size of major hills.)  Granted the critters move on rubber tires, but the adjacent railroad (BNSF) hosts long sidings and LOTS of grain hoppers.

Not a prototype I'd want to model, but it is there.

Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - lots of cedars, no cattle)

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Posted by TomLutman on Thursday, March 6, 2014 8:14 AM

BroadwayLion

 

 
TomLutman
The only way you're getting 100 car trains in there in to stack them 20 cars high

 

The Taylor - Gladstone siding is over two miles long. That is just a little loop of it that passes under the elevators.

 

I was referring to my layout, not theirsSmile My mill is on a stub track

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Posted by MisterBeasley on Thursday, March 6, 2014 9:33 AM

The issues would be I have no flat-cars, but have several stock cars.

Why is that an issue?  This gives you an opportunity to have both stock cars and flat cars!

Seriously, I view any opportunity to add a new car type to my layout in a way that it's actually used as a blessing.  For my tannery, I added both a chemical tank car and a covered hopper, both of which add some variety to my fleet.

I bought 3 Tichy undecorated flatcar kits to use as "idler" cars for the carfloat terminal.  They were very reasonable ($8 each) and resulted in very nice models.  They were, however, "models for masochists" because of the large number of tweezer-applied parts and underbody brake details.

It takes an iron man to play with a toy iron horse. 

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Posted by vsmith on Thursday, March 6, 2014 1:22 PM

I thought this was a Vicious Cycle:

Wink

   Have fun with your trains

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Posted by TomLutman on Thursday, March 6, 2014 3:55 PM

MisterBeasley
They were, however, "models for masochists" because of the large number of tweezer-applied parts and underbody brake details.

 Unfortunately, I find myself wearing the magnifiers and using tweezers for just about everything anymore. While I'm thin as a twig, my hands are large and calloused, and I've developed a sort of nervous twitch at the most inopportune times. It normally happens just prior to applying the part, or immediately after and yanking it back off.

MisterBeasley
I bought 3 Tichy undecorated flatcar kits to use as "idler" cars for the carfloat terminal. They were very reasonable ($8 each) and resulted in very nice models.

At the not-so-local hobbyshop here, unless the msrp is $8, it won't be $8. On the bright side, I need not call them to ask for a price. All I have to do is visit the Mfg website and see what THEY say it should be. I'm not upset about it, I know they are struggling. It's just that everything is expensive now. I have a bunch of old flatcars with truck mounted horn hooks, but I put them in the "to go away" box. Maybe I need to look at them again.

I NEED to get some more variety an the layout. I'm somewhat limited on how many will fit at any given time though. I need to get some more boxcars for the grain service, a few more gondolas, and of course some flats. I have a bunch of tank cars that I need to get ready for the track too. First thing is to finish getting the track down

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Posted by TomLutman on Thursday, March 6, 2014 3:58 PM

vsmith

I thought this was a Vicious Cycle:

Wink

 

 Well, this grain terminal will probably end up costing as much.Wink

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Posted by singletrack100 on Friday, March 7, 2014 7:02 AM

Tom, take those old flats, cut the coupler mounts from the trucks and secure some body mount Kadee's, install some metal wheels (I use IM's) and you're off and running. I did that with some old Tyco Western Maryland cars, used a rasp file to file the cast on load parts from the decks, made some "utility pole" loads using 1/8" dowel and jewelry chain, and they made respectable models (I should enter them in the "junk to respectable model" thread!

Happy RR'ing!

Duane

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Posted by bsteel4065 on Sunday, March 9, 2014 6:46 AM

I had a vicious cycle and had to have it put down.

 

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Posted by bearman on Sunday, March 9, 2014 8:13 AM

I have both loading stock pens and unloading stock pens on my layout.  The loading pens are Life-Life and are shown in the first photo.  The unloading pens are in the second photo where cattle are unloaded prior to being herded into the packing plant in th elower right.  The unloading pens are a heavily kitbashed Walthers Cornerstone unloading pens associated with the Walthers Champion packing company.  If you have only 5 inches of depth you will have to kit bash either to get them to fit into your space.  

 

 

 

 

Bear "It's all about having fun."

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Posted by TomLutman on Sunday, March 9, 2014 6:13 PM

 Here is a picture of the area I have. I need to get the Walthers conveyor because the Rix isn't tall enough.

 

 

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Posted by wojosa31 on Sunday, March 9, 2014 9:26 PM

ndbprr
Lancaster PA had a stockyard into the early 60s. Nearly everywhere I travelled on business had an excellent steakhouse near the stockyards. Wouldn't generate any rail traffic but very appropriate and most were grungy on the outside but the steaks were great.
 

 
Conrail still handled livestock through 1976-1987 on the rear of the Mail train - it was set off at WA5, and placed by a yard crew from South Karney. However, this was the tail end of livestock moves anywhere. Grain is always big, although export grain has dried up for now. During the 1950s it was quite common to see (and smell) livestock moves.
 
Joe
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Posted by TomLutman on Sunday, March 9, 2014 10:25 PM

I also had a thought of placing a lumber yard in that area instead of the stockpens. I got the idea from looking off an overpass down an old railway (now bike path). The track ran next to the lumberyard, but the yard was far enough from the track to have needed a small spur. There is an old passenger station, recently raised and repaired into a reator office between the yard and track, and then immediately on the opposite side of a crossing street is a mill.

I think mine would be better if I could arrainge them linearly, but I have to work with what I have.

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Posted by rrebell on Sunday, March 9, 2014 10:41 PM

Wow, you would think there would be sanitary issues!

 

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Posted by KRISTIAN CHRONISTER on Sunday, March 9, 2014 11:25 PM

East St. Louis, IL had a great stockyards steak house up through the early 80's. You had to drive through some of the sketchiest areas in the entire country to get there, and it was pretty grungy even when you arrived. But the steaks were incredible...

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Posted by KRISTIAN CHRONISTER on Sunday, March 9, 2014 11:28 PM

I used to suffer from giganticus syndrome myself. Spent a long time working on my 40' x 40' around the walls-with-many-peninsulas layout and got little past plywood junction... Then came to the realization that giganticus is more about complicatibus than sizeorum. Am about to embark on my latest - approx. 24' x 24' L-shaped layout. But more in "Pelle Seborg" mode where the space is used to create more realistic runs and scenery, not spaghetti-esque layout with 80% track-to-space ratio... It's all in how you use the space... 

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Posted by bearman on Monday, March 10, 2014 7:43 AM

Looks like you have plenty of room for the stock pens or whatever else you end up putting in that space.  You could even move that spur a little farther to the left and move those pens closer to the main on the left.

Bear "It's all about having fun."

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