How Steep is your grade?

[KenK]

I'm building a layout where I'll apparently have a grade of at least 4%. And yes,
it is a standard-gauge mainline layout, although it may someday become a
branch line of a larger layout.

My current motive power is one Bachmann GS-4 Daylight, a BLI Mikado, and
seven various 4-axle diesels.

Comments? Thoughts? Ideas? Insults?[:D]

[orsonroy]

So long as the grade is relatively short, not on a curve, and you're not running long trains, your 4% grade should be fine. Add a curve, a long grade, or long trains, and you'll need to run helpers.

[cwclark]

I don't run any grades over 2%...but i like long freight trains so that's why i keep them about 1.5%

[KenK]

We're looking at a 5x8 layout, there will be some curve on the grade. I'm not averse
to running double-headed. Trains will be maybe 10 cars at most?(50 ft cars or shorter).
May expand to 5x10, but probably still 4% grade.

[Anonymous]

I have a similar situation in N-scale (2 1/2' x 5'), and I have a couple of sections where the grade is maybe a little more than 3% on straight track (no more than 18" long each case), and I rarely have a train more than 10 cars. With some engines, while they can pull things fine through every other section, they will sometimes spin their wheels on a full train, and I have to double up on them. Now, in my situation, all of my cars have restraining springs and a little more weight than standard, so it will be harder to pull the same amount of cars around on my layout than others. But my point is that just a little increase (or decrease) in grade can make a big difference.

Maybe a test would be in order? A simple one like take a 1x4 or somethin', set it to the grade you will have, simply set some flextrack or sectional track (some old stuff you have would work), and see how well your engine pulls up it with a load behind it. Or to test a curved portion on a grade, take some lumber before you cut it up, and prop it up with blocks to the appropriate angle, and use some old or cheap sectional track, or temporarily tack some flextrack in place.

---jps

[KenK]

I do have an 8-foot 2x4 and a bunch of extra track, if I get time will do some
testing & report back.

[FThunder11]

2%

[dano99a]

4% though it was intentionally planned that way. Based off of a C&O HS article I read a while back, they would run multiple geeps up a 4% grade hauling coal up and down the mountains.

[rexhea]

kentk,
To give you some idea: I just received a HO BLI USRA 2-8-2 and tried it out pulling 10, 40 footers. It wouldn't make it up a grade (that includes a curve) that was suppose to be less than 2.5% without slipping. However, it would pull 6 with no problem. After checking out the grade , the curve part had over a 3% rise. I corrected this to be about 2% and all is fine now. The curves are very tricky in an incline.

FYI: Many thanks to those on the forum that guided me with this problem.[:D][:D]

[twhite]

I have a long 2% that contains a short section of 2.4%. Don't seem to have much trouble hauling long trains, because the curves are wide (34" min,) and the grade occasionally evens out to 1% or even level. About your 4%, Kentk, I wonder how your Bachmann GS will pull on it, since even though they're smooth running locos (at least mine is), they're not notoriously heavy pullers. I usually double-head mine when I run it (Bachmann GS War Baby). But close to 4% isn't unheard of on a main line--the old SP Siskiyou Line in Oregon had a 3.7% over Siskiyou Summit, and Rio Grande had about 30 miles of 3% on their Tennessee Pass line, to say nothing of their original 4% on Soldier Summit in Utah. And if I remember correctly, Southern had a 4.5% or something like that on one of their main lines, also.
You didn't say how big the layout is you're planning--any thoughts on that?

[Anonymous]

I'm modeling in "N" scale. My grades average 2% but I do have one area that is 3% with a curve 13.5" radius. I have (2) identical Atlas Gps' one can pull a string of 12 cars up no problem, the other will dpin it's wheels. A slight downpressure on the engine and it goes fine, so I may add some weight to it.
Since I'm a newbie starting again after 30+ years I was freaked out about grades. You get both sides of the story. Don't go past 1.5% and I run 5% no problems. I decided to try to keep it at 2. I tried the whole thing at 3% using Woodland Scenics Grades and risers and it looked like a roller coaster when it hit the initial grade. So I backed off to 2. This is just my experience. Dave

[KenK]

Testing so far:

One 30-year-old Athearn GP9, 5 40ft box cars, 2 50ft box cars, 2 40ft gondolas.
All box-stock except for couplers.

Sucessfully pulled up 5.6% grade.

Two GP9, 1 40ft hopper, 6 30ft hoppers, filled with that gravel for the bottom
of a fi***ank, haven't weighed them yet.

Also pulled the 5.6% grade just fine.

I think I'll be safe[:)]

[Anonymous]

I just laid my rail- have several 3% slopes to contend with that include curves.
I expect I will need to tweak them a bit- but I'd advise (after pushing individual cars) that you provide:

1- a Gradual change of grade to that 4%... don't want to have 3-axle truck (6 axle total) locos bottom out on the rails! or losing traction on the uphill direction.
2- consider a steep downslope to lead into a steep upslope - it averages out the strain on the loco- (picture a downhill rolling end of train pushing the climbing end)
3- provide (if possible) a slight uphill or long FLAT section after a 4% downslope-- you must consider the damage possible from a runaway car or section of a train!
4- remember - every 4% upgrade, when run in reverse is a 4% downgrade! that doubles the considerations you need to make.

Whew!... 3% was tough enough!
And- good luck!

[n2mopac]

I think you will have trouble with single engines pulling even 10 cars at 4%. I would keep it to 2% or less with single engine trains. My max is 1.5%
Ron