Any suggestions for insulating the "pointy ends" of Code 83 guard rails for my bridge?
I could, of course, position them so they don't touch, but that's not the way the modelers I admire in this forum have done it, and I don't want blaspheme to cost me my groupie status.
I've seen references to cutting plastic to size, but that seems tedious and time-consuming to me (but I'll certainly do it if that's the best solution).
Would coating the ends with CA, Sitx-All, or Pliobond insulate the joint?
Thanks.
Rick Krall
Place the rails as desired and cut a gap near the tip in a straight section. fill with plastic and paint to match.
hoope this helps.
I agree with wazzzy, that is the most effective way to do it and still keep it prototypical.
Rich
Alton Junction
If they are guard rails,why do the pointed ends have to be insulated???
Cheers,
Frank
zstripe If they are guard rails,why do the pointed ends have to be insulated??? Cheers, Frank
Any tight gauged wheelset or anything else that could bridge the gap between running rail and guard rail will cause a short. The insulation is just good insurance to prevent a problem.
Modeling B&O- Chessie Bob K. www.ssmrc.org
bogp40 zstripe If they are guard rails,why do the pointed ends have to be insulated??? Cheers, Frank Any tight gauged wheelset or anything else that could bridge the gap between running rail and guard rail will cause a short. The insulation is just good insurance to prevent a problem.
I agree with you on that, but the wheels have to be really far out of gauge for that to happen. On my to swing bridges and others on the layout they have close to a 1/4 inch gap between them...
Modeling Clay.
Swipe some from the nearest 6 year old who leaves it lying around. (of go buy some if you do not have any 6 year olds handy) You can model it easily into a point and then paint it. The LION has been know to use it to fill holes and to fabricate other details.
ROAR
The Route of the Broadway Lion The Largest Subway Layout in North Dakota.
Here there be cats. LIONS with CAMERAS
Very helpful; thanks. Either the styrene or modeling clay (ingenious!) will work for me. As to the styrene, after thinking about it, I now realize I will have "Dremeled" the ends to flatten the insides to make the point, so I won't have to follow the Code 83 rail contours as I feared I might. And I have some modeling clay from a recent turntable project, so I have choices. Choices are good.
I'm with Frank, for two reasons:
Looking at a prototype photo of a long, high deck girder viaduct, the guard rails look like mine car rails and are only spiked every fifth tie! Pretty obviously, they were never intended to support the triple-headed 2-8-2s blasting upgrade across that viaduct. All they're supposed to do is keep a derailed wheel set on top of the ties - and the attached car/locomotive out of the gorge below.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - with LOTS of guard rails)
"...as electrically dead as the French monarchy."
Great line!
I've seen only a few instances where the guard rails touched one another, but as others have noted, there's plenty of clearance between them and the running rails. Any wheel wide enough or that far out-of-gauge would have derailed long before reaching the bridge.
Here's a not-so-neat example:
Wayne
There should be virtually no chance for a short if one metal wheel happens to touch the guard rail and the stock rail at the same time, even if the guards do touch at a pointy solid sharp end just off the bridge deck. The reason is that the wheels are at a defined gauge, and therefore at a defined distance apart. If one wheel slips between the guard and stock rails and rubs both at the same time, the wheel on the opposite end of the axle will be displaced the gauge distance. There is nothing touching the guard and its counterpart nearer the opposite stock rail except the one wheel with electrical charge from only the one stock rail.
Otherwise, as the photos above show, guards have many endings. They come pointed, dual-curved, and separated. My photo here shows how I modelled one setup I saw personally. I don't remember where it was, unfortunately.
Crandell
Selector said: "The reason is that the wheels are at a defined gauge, and therefore at a defined distance apart."
Boy, Selector, now that you mention it, that seems patently obvious to me. But I didn't consider it before and confess I've never challenged what I believed was conventional wisdom that there's a risk of guard rails shorting.
Regardless, leaving them open solves the problem. And to illustrate you've provided one of my favorite scenes on your layout, in fact the one on which I've based the abutment design for my bridge. So I win twice!
selector There should be virtually no chance for a short if one metal wheel happens to touch the guard rail and the stock rail at the same time, even if the guards do touch at a pointy solid sharp end just off the bridge deck. The reason is that the wheels are at a defined gauge, and therefore at a defined distance apart. If one wheel slips between the guard and stock rails and rubs both at the same time, the wheel on the opposite end of the axle will be displaced the gauge distance. There is nothing touching the guard and its counterpart nearer the opposite stock rail except the one wheel with electrical charge from only the one stock rail.
Crandell, that would be true if the wheels move laterally in the event of a derailment, but if the trucks turn at an angle and the wheels are touching both the stock rail and the guard rail on each side of the track, a short will occur. The best practice is to somehow insulate or gap the rails.
richhotrain Crandell, that would be true if the wheels move laterally in the event of a derailment, but if the trucks turn at an angle and the wheels are touching both the stock rail and the guard rail on each side of the track, a short will occur. The best practice is to somehow insulate or gap the rails. Rich
Let's look at this from another perspective - - - that of the manufacturer.
I have Walthers Shinohara Code 83 bridge track on several bridges on my layout.
If you look at the guard rails, they do not join together at either end. There is a slight separation. To complete the guard rail setup, there is plastic forming the V. That plastic closure is colored brown so it doesn't look anything like the guard rails.
I assume that Walthers Shinohara chose not to join the rails to prevent shorts, however unlikely they might be to occur.
Hi!
I must be missing the problem here.......... the guard rails I am familiar with would just not cause a short, even if they touched a rail.
Of course that assumes the bridge/base is not metal..............
ENJOY !
Mobilman44
Living in southeast Texas, formerly modeling the "postwar" Santa Fe and Illinois Central
richhotrain ....If you look at the guard rails, they do not join together at either end. There is a slight separation. To complete the guard rail setup, there is plastic forming the V. That plastic closure is colored brown so it doesn't look anything like the guard rails.....
....If you look at the guard rails, they do not join together at either end. There is a slight separation. To complete the guard rail setup, there is plastic forming the V. That plastic closure is colored brown so it doesn't look anything like the guard rails.....
Rich, you simply need to paint the plastic bits the same colour as the guard rails - rust or whatever colour you use. I can't imagine why this has cropped up as such a big issue - I don't think I've ever had a short on my layout in the 20-or-so years it's been in use, and even if I had, it wouldn't be a big deal. Simply fix the rolling stock that's derailing and/or fix the cause of the derailments.
doctorwayne richhotrain ....If you look at the guard rails, they do not join together at either end. There is a slight separation. To complete the guard rail setup, there is plastic forming the V. That plastic closure is colored brown so it doesn't look anything like the guard rails..... Rich, you simply need to paint the plastic bits the same colour as the guard rails - rust or whatever colour you use. I can't imagine why this has cropped up as such a big issue - I don't think I've ever had a short on my layout in the 20-or-so years it's been in use, and even if I had, it wouldn't be a big deal. Simply fix the rolling stock that's derailing and/or fix the cause of the derailments. Wayne
LOL
That's not my point though, Wayne.
What I am saying is that Walthers Shinohara left the guard rails open rather than closed. So, they were obviously trying to avoid the possibility of shorts. Yet, they molded a plastic V-shaped closure to make it look more prototypical. So, if you want to make the guard rails appear closed, just paint the plastic V to match.
Why has this cropped up to become such a big issue? I don't think it has become a big issue. It is just the typical thread with a lot of responses and a lot of opinions.
If I were handlaying my own bridge track, I would not close the guard rails simply because I would not want to invite the possibility of a short. Having said that, I went down to my layout and tried to create a short, and it is nearly impossible, although it can occur.